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Thread: Donzi 16 Timeline - The Boats Built During 1964

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Guimond View Post
    So the 1964 builds seem to be shaping up as .................

    #1 - White w/Grumble Green deck stripe and Eaton drive as shown in photo
    #2 - White w/Lucan Red deck and waterline stripe and Volvo 200 drive
    #3 - White w/Lucan Red deck stripe only and Volvo 100 drive (Swede Thomas Ronnberg owner)
    #4 - Solid Grumble Green w/ Lucan Red deck stripe - Drive unknown ( NJ Frank Civitano's Father owner after Michael Aronow)
    #5 - White w/Cristina Blue deck stripe and Volvo 200 drive - (Alan Brown Jax show boat)
    #6 - White w/Grumble Green deck stripe and special 3" longer Volvo 100 drive - (Fred Darwick owner)
    #7 - White w/Blue deck stripe and special Volvo 100 drive - (Fred Darwick assisted in the sale, buyer could have been Bob Cox Lauderdale Marine)
    #8 - Mystery puzzle piece member-- Joe _ _ _ _ from Miami races a 16 Classic
    #9 - January 1965 New York Boat Show 16
    #10 - Second New York Boat Show 16

    1&2 Greg what info do you have on the hull number 1 and 2 to support this ?? isn't the jax boat show the first 200 drive in the country? you have # 2 with a 200

    #4 an all grumble green boat built in 64 is highly suspect it is an early 65 boat The early hornets were all green yes but they had a much bigger price tag and took 3x as long to produce. The delivery time on a hornet is 12 weeks so i would say besides the race 19s all the first hornets are 65s as are the St Ts


    #3 Tomron boat is the teknikens boat isn't it????

    #8 what race?

    9&10 what info do you have on two boats at the nyc show???


    where would you put the hull rework into this and what boats are long straked and short straked?


    I think this list is about 4-5 hulls high


    the 16 donzi hornet ????? motor boating you had one job really????
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  2. #47
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    I think I forgot two boats to make it an even dozen ...............


    The Muncey 16 that was given as a gift

    and Sam Ballingers 16, white with a blue deck stripe and blue waterline stripe

    1964 Donzi Ski Sporter,

    Unmolested, and as it came from the factory
    Hull DM988 (#4?), 47 hours on Hobbs meter
    Power is 165hp Ford V-8 interceptor, I/O drive is Eaton unit, Engine Runs Great, as does Eaton drive
    Have owned for 10 years and used 6 times , Cushions good not new. Needs plastic cover for rear light.
    Trailer in Good shape.

    Price $11,000.00 obo
    Contact Ballinger@resolutelaw.com
    Cell 813-401-9018813-401-9018 (9am-5pm EST
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    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  3. #48
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    Matty, let me take a stab at a couple of your questions over morning coffee..............


    Quote Originally Posted by mattyboy View Post
    1&2 Greg what info do you have on the hull number 1 and 2 to support this ?? isn't the jax boat show the first 200 drive in the country? you have # 2 with a 200

    GRG: We have several photos of what Alan Brown says are "The first two 16's". In those photos, one of the two boats has an Eaton drive. Then, add to this Brownies comment about the Jax show boat NOT being the first 16 hull built but probably hull 3 or 4 I am going to say that the first hull ever built was the Eaton powered hull.

    #4 an all grumble green boat built in 64 is highly suspect it is an early 65 boat The early hornets were all green yes but they had a much bigger price tag and took 3x as long to produce. The delivery time on a hornet is 12 weeks so i would say besides the race 19s all the first hornets are 65s as are the St Ts.

    GRG: I'm going to look to you Matty to take this one on. Can you track down Frank Civitano and ask him about his Dad's boat please? I'm not sure what bearing the 19' Hornets have on painting a 16 green. You had the heir to the Kleenex fortune running around with Don Aronow at the time. My guess is that he (James Kimberly) played a role in convincing Don to turn out a solid color 1964. Civitano would have some additional info as you know. His Dad was friends with Don A from his real estate development days.


    #3 Tomron boat is the teknikens boat isn't it????

    #8 what race?

    9&10 what info do you have on two boats at the nyc show???


    where would you put the hull rework into this and what boats are long straked and short straked?


    I think this list is about 4-5 hulls high


    the 16 donzi hornet ????? motor boating you had one job really????
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    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  4. #49
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    Greg


    if the green hornets have no bearing on this why post a picture of them especially if the magazine can't get it right a 16 hornet ??? that writer should get paper cuts on his typing finger . I thought production time is very key to this discussion a hornet started in oct 64 would be delivered in jan of 65. so they have to build at least one for the 65 show tour they are all green they are not marketed to the 16 crowd

    the first 16 is a volvo powered 16 Mike A tells the story KOTBR

    the pics you have may very well be the the first and second of the reworked hull do you have a date on them? THIS IS THE BIGGEST PIECE OF THE PUZZLE is it possible this pic is taken during the 1st quarter of 65

    would have been nice to see the dash of the red boat or the green boat to see how the deck stripe was treated.


    TOMRON's boat is short straked and the deck stripe doesn't go thru the dash and has a volvo dash plate . it needs to be on it's way to sweden by dec of 64 or it won't leave this country til some time in Feb of 65 the articles I have seen on the strike say the ports were hosed with backlog in some cases for several months. His boat is reviewed in teknikens in july of 65 and also ran in the 65 Gettingloppet which is also sometime in July this boat may be the prototype of the new bottom

    my point with the strakes is the first one(s) had long ones like the press photo boat same with the deck stripe these are signs of being first

    I also see the interior cushions were redesigned at some point maybe bilt-rite isn't in on the early ones and they come along later or they use their very skilled talent to refine the interior


    I will skip trying to build the whole time line when we need to start at 1 so until we find and confirm hull one the rest will be confirmed later

    also the 16 was never designed for the v8 interceptor that was an after thought and an on the fly rework I think due to lack of volvo to begin with the eaton interceptor is used to fill the gap this also is a key to the early boat having problems with the bigger powerplant and having bottom issues and failure they original layup wasn't stout enough
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

    My Ride

    Come Join Us on The Queen Of American Lakes



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  5. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattyboy View Post
    Greg, the first 16 is a volvo powered 16 Mike A tells the story KOTBR. the pics you have may very well be the the first and second of the reworked hull do you have a date on them? THIS IS THE BIGGEST PIECE OF THE PUZZLE is it possible this pic is taken during the 1st quarter of 65.
    I don't have the book KOTBR handy but I tend to believe Alan Brown over Mike Aronow.

    Can you snap a picture of what Mike Aronow writes in it and post it? Brownie said the AQ200 drive was in the 3rd or 4th 16 hull built but hell that WAS 50 years ago. Mike Aronow says the opposite but he was barely shaving. Then a third angle is the press photos you supplied which shows a Volvo 200 drive and the fourth angle is the handwritten note from Brownie that shows BOTH a Eaton drive and a Volvo drive on the two 16's.

    It was 50 years ago. Michael Aronow was maybe 15 years old and Brownie is now maybe 81?

    Post up that King of Thunderboat Row sentences and let's see if we can grab anything from it. Winter hasn't even started yet, plenty of time.
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  6. #51
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    the muncey boat was highly modified and modernized during the resto mod and no other proof was given besides the word of the person who owns the boat now It is an early 65 boat there is no proof to consider this a 64
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

    My Ride

    Come Join Us on The Queen Of American Lakes



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  7. #52
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    Greg



    let me ask a few questions

    when do you think the side by side pics was taken ?

    why is it not included in any of the original sales literature?

    why are there no running pics of a 16 at all in the original sales literature?


    you need to buy KOTBR it is on amazon


    I have to disagree with I think Mike is very accurate when recalling his father.

    the story is about his ride with his Dad in the new 16 design powered by a 4 banger volvo and the ride where is father is running so hard the only thing he could hold onto was the driver seat pedestal in Don's words " Mike what the hell are you doing down there" then his Dad gives him the helm and Mike runs the boat he runs it so hard turning the tables on his Dad and his Dad has to tell him to take it easy Mike he also says that Don gave anyone out that day a good Look at the new Donzi .

    Knowing what we know about Don if there is a 4cyl and from what you say is the first 16 with a 8cyl at the dock what boat is Don going to get into?
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

    My Ride

    Come Join Us on The Queen Of American Lakes



    Contact Us

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  8. #53
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    So you have the book KOTBR right there next to you and you won't post a pic of Mike's write-up? Why? Am I missing something?
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  9. #54
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    let's see if we can set benchmarks that are known and confirmed and then filter the info we have thru it to establish the timeline on the first go round I will leave some info blank and fill in what we know is confirmed

    Hull 0 (prototype)- volvo 110 hp powered but not an aq 200 most likely an aq100 time frame before NOV 64 has DONZI painted on it in the rear gunwales basically the same as what was done on the first hornet and the raceboats ,Don and Mike A test drove, no grab rails no interior

    Hull 1- power unknown but not a volvo aq 200 time frame around Nov 64 no grab rail color?

    Hull 2 power unknown but not an aq 200 timeframe around Nov 64 no grab rail color?

    Hull 3 Jax show boat white blue stripes first aq 200 nov 64 this is believed to be the press shoot boat????

    so let's run the side by side pic thru that filter?? the green boat could fit 1 or 2 but not 0 or 3 the red boat doesn't fit 0-3 unless they repowered it when the aq 200 came out ??

    added notes: the aq100 looks very much like the eaton shape wise the upper and lower on the drive and there are controls that come from the top of the transom housings to the top of the drive the transom housings are completely different the aq 200 has no visible controls so telling them apart is fairly easy by looking at them
    the pic of Fred's first race boat looks like an aq 100 they make the 110 with both drives production era on the 110 aq200 is 1963 to 1966.
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

    My Ride

    Come Join Us on The Queen Of American Lakes



    Contact Us

    www.lgdonziclassic.com

  10. #55
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    Again, so you have the book King of Thunderboat Row right there next to you and you won't post a pic of Mike's write-up? Why? Am I missing something?
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  11. #56
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    why do I need to post a pic I said what he wrote?
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

    My Ride

    Come Join Us on The Queen Of American Lakes



    Contact Us

    www.lgdonziclassic.com

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Guimond View Post
    Again, so you have the book King of Thunderboat Row right there next to you and you won't post a pic of Mike's write-up? Why? Am I missing something?
    Quote Originally Posted by mattyboy View Post
    why do I need to post a pic I said what he wrote?
    Umm ...... Because I asked you nicely and I would personally find it interesting to read it? Because it takes two to four seconds to snap a picture on your phone of the page and then post it? Because 3 other peeps of the 12 who read this stuff might not have the book and would be interested in Michael Aronow's (Don's Son) specific description of the AQ200? Because I'm too cheap to buy the book on Amazon lol

    Come on man, show the spirit of co-operation? Where's the love!

    Do I have to pick you up under the Tappan Zee Bridge later today in The Mule and earn my bones

    Today will be downright balmy at 60 compared to yesterdays 50 degrees and 25 knot breeze. I probably won't need my head gear. Heading out in 30 ............ them there Merc hamsters are hungry!
    Attached Images Attached Images
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  13. #58
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    for the doubting Thomas sorry my daughter took back her scanner printer so you have to use my pics which are usually fuzzy


    HULL 0 prototype powered by a 110 hp volvo and what must be an aq100 the boat is wonder white and stripes unkown no grab rail


    from The King of Thunderboat Row by Michael Aronow a book any Donzi fan must have they were selling for near $500 now at around $125 on Amazon

    notice the painted donzi reference and look at the 28 race boat DONZI 28 on the rear gunwales the hornet that Brownie raced had DONZI 19 on the rear gunwales these are some of the first Donzi ever built so it makes total sense when the first 16 came out they would paint Donzi on it
    Attached Images Attached Images
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

    My Ride

    Come Join Us on The Queen Of American Lakes



    Contact Us

    www.lgdonziclassic.com

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by mattyboy View Post
    for the doubting Thomas sorry my daughter took back her scanner printer so you have to use my pics which are usually fuzzy


    HULL 0 prototype powered by a 110 hp volvo and what must be an aq100 the boat is wonder white and stripes unkown no grab rail


    from The King of Thunderboat Row by Michael Aronow a book any Donzi fan must have they were selling for near $500 now at around $125 on Amazon

    notice the painted donzi reference and look at the 28 race boat DONZI 28 on the rear gunwales the hornet that Brownie raced had DONZI 19 on the rear gunwales these are some of the first Donzi ever built so it makes total sense when the first 16 came out they would paint Donzi on it


    That was a great read Matty , thanks for posting it . (My eyes MIGHT return to normal in an hour or so)
    One thing that I wonder about is how 'terrifying' the ride really was in that 16 . I could see it , no matter what , with Don himself driving as I know what that's like firsthand in a 28SS .
    But those little 110 Volvos really only translated into about 80hp at the prop and the 16 is such a sweet hull .Maybe it was just the novelty of being in a boat so much smaller than the 233 that they had all gotten used to .
    Just because something's old doesn't mean you throw it away !

  15. #60
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    MC
    my wife can relate to that story she said no way in hell would she be in a 16 without a grab rail when I gave her the wheel she was like oh yeah this is so much better sitting down with the wheel to hold on to.
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

    My Ride

    Come Join Us on The Queen Of American Lakes



    Contact Us

    www.lgdonziclassic.com

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