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Thread: Prop to try? Same post, both sites.

  1. #16
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    Ed, It may, or may not be the starter. It could be a simple bad ground wire.

    It was a phenomenal week end with respect to the weather, and with multiple other Donzis available for getting my son a Donzi ride, I couldn't see spending the week end in the bilge trying to track it down.

    Thanks for confirming about the internals on the engine.

    What is the hold up with the steering? Are parts slow in coming? I hope you get it installed soon!
    “Oh right, because you walked into strippers discount warehouse and said ‘Help me showcase my intellect.’” - Archer

    Bill
    Grand Rapids, Michigan
    1985 Donzi Criterion SS
    1967 Donzi 16 Ski Sporter, C16-409, Has a new home!
    38' Carver Aft Cabin
    1968 Sea Ray SRV 180 w/1975 70 hp Evinrude
    10" RIB w/15 hp 1984 Evinrude

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Say N20 View Post
    Happy to send the Bravo I 24" your way. You do remember they are all LH props. . .

    If you still want it, pm me your address. Likewise, if the 27 is a LH prop let me know.

    I did not look closely at the thread as the weather this weekend was great for boating. Do you mean the prop shaft on your TRS drive rotates counter clockwise?
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carl C View Post
    All of your speed results seem low for a blown 454. Your prop choices and results are all over the place. Bravo 1s are overrated in pitch by 1 or 1 1/2. I'm running a 30p Bravo 1. I could not pull a 30p in any other prop that I am aware of. I would shoot for at least 5,400 RPM. Just some thoughts. I don't know what to tell you on prop choices based on your previous results. . . . . .
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Say N20 View Post
    Interesting. Bravo shorty is probably a big help. I don't know if TRS drives are usually considered "fast."

    Carl, the TRS drive could also be why the speeds are lower than what you would expect.
    The starting point to all of this is the prop shaft centerline depth in relation to the bottom of the boats keel. I'd suspect if Carl leveled his trailer, leveled his Bravo drive and got that accurate depth for his rig you could then do the same for the TRS and start to compare. Bravo's came in two versions, one version had BOTH side water inlets and low inlets in the nose. The other (and more common) drive had just the side water inlets so the drive had to be a bit lower beneath the keel. All this assumes that a Critter has the same bottom as a 22 Classic (I have no idea) and that Carl's 22 and your Critter both make about the same horsepower.

    Gear case depth tells a lot at the start. The lower units overall profile is the second piece of the puzzle.
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Guimond View Post
    I did not look closely at the thread as the weather this weekend was great for boating. Do you mean the prop shaft on your TRS drive rotates counter clockwise?
    Yes, left hand prop = counter clockwise rotation.

    The Critter has the same bottom as a 22. This boat has transom mounted water pick ups. I don't think there are water pickups anywhere on the drive.

    I'm guessing your props are standard RH (clockwise) rotation.
    “Oh right, because you walked into strippers discount warehouse and said ‘Help me showcase my intellect.’” - Archer

    Bill
    Grand Rapids, Michigan
    1985 Donzi Criterion SS
    1967 Donzi 16 Ski Sporter, C16-409, Has a new home!
    38' Carver Aft Cabin
    1968 Sea Ray SRV 180 w/1975 70 hp Evinrude
    10" RIB w/15 hp 1984 Evinrude

  5. #20
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    Greg, The 2nd 24" prop is NOT a Bravo 1, it is a Mach Stern Driver LH, 14.5 x 24. My mistake.

    I've got a Rev 4 25" coming from BBlades to try.
    “Oh right, because you walked into strippers discount warehouse and said ‘Help me showcase my intellect.’” - Archer

    Bill
    Grand Rapids, Michigan
    1985 Donzi Criterion SS
    1967 Donzi 16 Ski Sporter, C16-409, Has a new home!
    38' Carver Aft Cabin
    1968 Sea Ray SRV 180 w/1975 70 hp Evinrude
    10" RIB w/15 hp 1984 Evinrude

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Say N20 View Post
    Greg, The 2nd 24" prop is NOT a Bravo 1, it is a Mach Stern Driver LH, 14.5 x 24. My mistake.

    I've got a Rev 4 25" coming from BBlades to try.
    If the drive is deep the Rev4 will solve all of your problems
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  7. #22
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    The Rev 4 works great on my 22

    I've measured the prop shaft on my 22 to be approx 7" below the bottom. It's very deep for sure. Running real light, my stock 502 with Gil exhaust will turn nearly 5000rpm with the boat topping out at 73mph GPS with a 1.5 Bravo and 25P Rev 4.

    My guess is that you've got approx plus 100HP over my 502 but will lose an extra 20 thru the trans and TRS.

    Let's make a prediction on your results with a 25p Rev 4. - 78 mph @ 5600rpm

    By comparison, I recall a fellow running a 600HP 502 Bravo drive in a 24 Pantera hitting 80 at 5800 with the 25pRev4.
    Thank you, Patrick
    1994 18' Classic 350Mag Alpha

    Previously owned Donzis -
    1996 22' Classic, 502Mag Bravo
    1987 20' Minx, 350Mag Alpha
    1975 18' Classic, 350Chevy Volvo 280

  8. #23
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    Sounds like a pretty good prediction Patrick.

    I want to try and limit the RPMs to around 5,400 max. My understanding is that the smaller blower I have becomes a furnace much over 5,200. It is great for mid-range performance enhancement, but not great if WOT is all you do.

    Greg, I don't know how deep the drive is. I will check that out this week end.
    “Oh right, because you walked into strippers discount warehouse and said ‘Help me showcase my intellect.’” - Archer

    Bill
    Grand Rapids, Michigan
    1985 Donzi Criterion SS
    1967 Donzi 16 Ski Sporter, C16-409, Has a new home!
    38' Carver Aft Cabin
    1968 Sea Ray SRV 180 w/1975 70 hp Evinrude
    10" RIB w/15 hp 1984 Evinrude

  9. #24
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    Rev 4

    Yep, Agree with Patrick. He turned me on to the REV 4. I am thrilled with the performance and handling at all speeds. Top speed so far is 70.5 GPS. That's only off by .5 MPH of the three bladed 25P Turbo.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pat McPherson View Post
    I've measured the prop shaft on my 22 to be approx 7" below the bottom. It's very deep for sure. Running real light, my stock 502 with Gil exhaust will turn nearly 5000rpm with the boat topping out at 73mph GPS with a 1.5 Bravo and 25P Rev 4.
    Patrick, a prop shaft centerline that is 7" below the 22 Classic's keel is perfect for the attributes of the Rev4 prop. They are designed to run a little on the deep side and are happiest at 4" below and greater.
    I'm going to bet that the prop shaft on Bill's new Critter is 6 1/4" below the keel. Hole shot will be very good and overall handling will be exceptional.

    I don't know chit about car motors so I won't even guess on the top speeds and rpms with the Rev4 prop swinging left. Should be interesting.
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Say N20 View Post
    Greg, The 2nd 24" prop is NOT a Bravo 1, it is a Mach Stern Driver LH, 14.5 x 24. My mistake.

    I've got a Rev 4 25" coming from BBlades to try.
    I think you will be pleased with all the characteristics of the Rev4 and I look forward to hearing your synopsis.

    1971 Donzi 18' 2+3
    1985 Eliminator 23' Daytona Offshore - Kevlar hull
    1988 23' Donzi CC F-23 with 250HP EFI Mercury OB
    1989 28' Team Warlock Offshore - single 548CID/600HP
    1990 23' Warlock Offshore - single 525HP
    Bill from Denison, TX - Lake Texoma

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Just Say N20 View Post
    Long-winded Bill is back. The Criterion, of which I am now the proud owner, came from the factory with a 370 hp 454. The blower HAD a 3.48" top pulley, which produced just under 3 lbs of boost. I have run both the 24" Intimidator Q-IV, and the 31" Bravo I with this configuration. The 24" Intimidator Q-IV runs 78 GPS, but at 5,800 rpms. The 31" Bravo I prop ran 73 mph at 4,500 rpms. Now, the plot thickens. My daughter gave me a smaller (3.04" I believe) pulley. I did some engine "tuning" prior to swapping pulleys. The engine now has 5 lbs of boost. Results running the 31" Bravo I are 4,800 rpms, top speed remained at 73. I have NOT run the boat with the 24" Intimidator and the higher boost.
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Say N20 View Post
    Thanks Bill. I'm not sure moving from a 24 to a 25 would be enough increase in pitch. I would like to keep the rpms around 5,200 max. I believe I would need at least a 28'. A guess would be my engine is putting out maybe 550 hp.
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Say N20 View Post
    Marshall, your statements are spot on. The TRS drive is a little deep. I wish I knew why the Q-IV 24" seemed like a magic prop. I thought 78 for that set up was really good.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pat McPherson View Post
    I've measured the prop shaft on my 22 to be approx 7" below the bottom. It's very deep for sure. My stock 502 with Gil exhaust will turn nearly 5000rpm at 73mph GPS with a 1.5 Bravo and 25P Rev 4. My guess is that you've got approx plus 100HP over my 502 but will lose 20 thru the trans and TRS. Let's make a prediction on your results with a 25p Rev 4 ....... 78 mph @ 5600rpm.
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Say N20 View Post
    Sounds like a pretty good prediction Patrick. I want to limit the RPMs to around 5,400 max. Greg, I don't know how deep the drive is. I will check that out this week end.

    Hopefully Bill you have received the new BBlades 25" Merc Rev4 prop and can try it this weekend to see if Patrick's prediction of 78mph rings true. You should also bring the 24" Hydromotive Intimidator Q-IV and run that just for a comparison. I have one in the garage that I'm going to dust off against my Rev4. Btw - there is a left rotation 28" Q-IV up on ebay.
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  13. #28
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    Bill

    some thing to keep in mind when talking a critter with a trs sometimes you can't compare straight headsup to a 22C performance wise the critter tends to be a bit heavier as does the trs with the tranny from a bravo setup the critter will ride better though.
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  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg Guimond View Post
    Hopefully Bill you have received the new BBlades 25" Merc Rev4 prop and can try it this weekend to see if Patrick's prediction of 78mph rings true. You should also bring the 24" Hydromotive Intimidator Q-IV and run that just for a comparison. I have one in the garage that I'm going to dust off against my Rev4. Btw - there is a left rotation 28" Q-IV up on ebay.
    I tried my Q-IV against my Rev4. I find the Rev4 to be a lot more predictable across all ranges. It also tends to lift the entire boat, not just the bow. The Q-IV was a little faster but not by much. I like Rev4's so much I picked up another one off CL for $210 delivered yesterday.
    1972 16 OB - C16B-63 - "Surface Tension" Resto Project
    1974 16 OB - DMR16106017-B - "The Mule"

  15. #30
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    Testing results. The boat liked the Rev 4.

    RPM, Nuvï GPS, air/fuel ratio, boost gauge

    Rev 25
    1,000 - 6.5, 13.6, 10 hg
    2,500 - 31, 14.2. 8 hg
    3,000 - 38, 14.5, 6 hg
    3,500 - 45, 14.2, 4 hg
    4,000 - 52, 13.4, 2 hg
    4,500 - 59, 12.1, 0
    5,000 - 67, 11.9, 1.5 lbs
    5,500 - 74, 11.9, 5 lbs
    5,700 - 75.5, 11.9, 5 lbs
    Attached Images Attached Images
    “Oh right, because you walked into strippers discount warehouse and said ‘Help me showcase my intellect.’” - Archer

    Bill
    Grand Rapids, Michigan
    1985 Donzi Criterion SS
    1967 Donzi 16 Ski Sporter, C16-409, Has a new home!
    38' Carver Aft Cabin
    1968 Sea Ray SRV 180 w/1975 70 hp Evinrude
    10" RIB w/15 hp 1984 Evinrude

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