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Thread: Winterizing

  1. #1
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    Winterizing

    Looking at winterizing a 350 Mag w/Alpha drive with "open" cooling system (did not do it last year and paid the price with cracked block, heads and exhaust). Have researched and plan the following process (boat stored on a trailer in unheated storage facility in Georgia (near Lake Lanier).

    1. Add stabilizer to fuel.
    2. Connect fresh water via "muffs" (garden hose) and start boat.
    3. Let run till up-to-temp and thermostat is open.
    4. Shutdown engine and remove flame arrestor.
    5. Connect 5 gallon container, with coolant, via short garden hose to "muffs" (container higher than "muffs") and run till coolant is seen running out of the exhaust pipes.
    6. Spray "fogging oil" into carb till engine stalls.
    7. Open all drain values and drain new mixture.
    8. Remove each spark plug, spray each cylinder with fogging oil and reinstall plugs (plugs only have 20 hours on them).
    9. Top off fuel.
    10. Lower outdrive when parking for season.

    Question that I have are:

    Step 7: Should I drain as much of the new mixture or leave full until spring?
    Step 9: Read to just go 3/4 of a tank for "expansion" but feel that full would be better to stop moister within the fuel tank and not worry about "expansion" since it will be colder than when filling tank.

    Should I remove pipefittings plugs from risers too (if I am draining block)?

    I realize that I should change the oil but it only has about 4 hours on it and the outdrive just has 20 hours on the drive fluid.

    Any input would be great......

  2. #2
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    i am in a colder climate then you i perfer to drain the antifreeze after it runs thru the motor for a few minutes. one thing i would do is run a wire hanger thru all the drains to make sure any sand mud or gunk is out. if you plan on leaving it wet do this while the block is full of water.

    with gas i like full topped off with stabilizer if non ethanol , if ethanol run it til it is empty.
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

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  3. #3
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    I am no expert concerning winterizing. However, I would change the motor oil and the drive unit lubricant as well. Oil is relatively inexpensive and I certainly would take the time to change it. The cost of the materials versus the cost of hard parts seem to justify the time and expense.

    I have always been told to try to fill the gas tank to its maximum to eliminate getting moisture in the tank. Especially with todays fuels I would not take the chance of leaving the tank anything below full. I have always had great success with Sta-Bil gas treatment.

    Good luck.

  4. #4
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    Been doing this stuff for over 40 years, to run anti freeze through the way you describe does not work. As soon as the cooler anti freeze mix hits the thermostat it will slam shut leaving the block 90%+ empty! Having a a ton of boats over the years up here in NY the most fool proof way is:: Run to temp change oil and filter, fire it off and fog it out with the fresh oil. Now drain the block and manifolds then close the cocks, now remove the circ pump hose at the Tstat housing put a snug fitting piece of PVC pipe in the hose. Use a funnel and pour the anti freeze in slowly until it comes out the Tstat housing, put the hose back on. Remove the two manifold feed hoses and pour anti freeze, use a funnel pour anti freeze in until you hear it trickle out the drive or pipes. Last but not least pull the hose off the power steering oil cooler to drain it. Grease all fittings and WD40 any thing that is or will rust! You can use cheap -50 RV anti freeze, I now work at a fairly big marine parts house, believe me no one uses the real stuff. I know of two contractors that are using 99 Cent windshield washer fluid, they don't like me any more I bioched them out a bit. Phil
    No matter what your beliefs are "GOD BLESS AMERICA"

    Fully retired marine tech near 60 years in the biz.

  5. #5
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    MOP,

    Could you clarify something for me? I don't understand what you are saying about the "cooler" antifreeze mix slamming the thermostat shut. Isn't the antifreeze likely to be about the same temperature as the water running through the hose? Or quite possibly warmer, if it's come right out of the indoors (from a store or one's house)?

    Put another way, if you ran the boat in a lake full of antifreeze, wouldn't the thermostat and the rest of the cooling system do the same things they normally do, but with antifreeze instead of water? Meaning that to keep the thermostat open, what's critical is getting the engine up to the needed temperature, regardless of whether there is cooling water or antifreeze being run through, and what temperature that water or antifreeze is on its way in?

    Or does antifreeze have a huge specific heat compared to water? Such that antifreeze absorbs far more heat than water, or absorbs heat more quickly than water, from the block? I did some looking and my first take was that the opposite was true. If this is right, I would expect that water should cool the block more efficiently than an antifreeze or antifreeze/water mix. (http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/et...col-d_146.html)

    I know you have tons of experience--I just feel like I must be missing something here.

    Regards and thanks,

    Mike
    "I don't have time to get into it, but he went through a lot." -Pulp Fiction

  6. #6
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    my setup is close to fixx's i use a bilge pump and drain pipes that drain into a 5 gal bucket with 4 gallons of antifreeze i run the boat that way for 10-15 minutes until it's all warmed up. not sure it would work on a muff system they always seem to lose water the kiddie pool would work, my setup has flush valve.

    don't have pics or vids can't take them either the setup was re-assigned as a sump pump for my basement during the power outage we had during the octobo'easter we just had.
    When the sky is grey,look out to sea.
    When the waves are high and the light is dying,
    well raise a glass and think of me...
    When I'm home again,
    boys, I'll be buying!

    My Ride

    Come Join Us on The Queen Of American Lakes



    Contact Us

    www.lgdonziclassic.com

  7. #7
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    Change the oil and run the engine to circulate the new oil. My oil only had about 4 hours too but I changed it.
    I also pulled the drive to check engine alignment, u-joints, gimbal bearing and changed the gear oil. The fresh water cooling stuff IDK. I back flushed my closed cooling system one component at a time to remove any sand (there was none).

    As far as the fuel thing you will find a lot of opinions. Since my boat is stored uncovered indoors I don't worry about how much fuel is in it.
    Lake St. Clair, Lake Huron, Lake Erie, Lake Oakland

  8. #8
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    I do essentially what MOP has described. Here's my procedure from start to finish.

    Add Sta-bil and top off fuel (leave 5% room for expansion)
    Run the engine until warm on muffs.
    Change oil and filter
    Change outdrive oil
    Run engine on muffs to circulate new oil and check levels

    I do not go through the trouble of pulling each individual spark plug to fog and use the latest method from Merc for the late model engines.

    I use a 6' piece of fuel line, a water separating fuel filter I have designated for "winterizing" and a small container of fogging "mix". Merc tells you to mix 5 gallons which is way too much. I can do both engines on my Formula with exactly 1/2 gallon. The fogging mix recipe is:

    32oz Premium fuel (non-ethanol if you can get it)
    22.4oz 2-stroke oil
    3.2 oz sta-bil
    3.2 oz injector cleaner
    3.2 oz dry gas

    Remove water sep fuel filter
    Install "winterizing" filter
    Remove fuel line from engine
    Connect 6' fuel line hose and 1/2 gallon fogging mix to engine
    Start and run engine on mix at 1500 rpm for 5 minutes
    Shut down engine (you should see blue smoke and notice her running rough)
    R&R water sep filters
    Reconnect fuel line to main tank.
    Drain block of raw water (both sides) manifolds, fuel cooler (5 blue plugs) or drain via single point drain for newer 350 MAGs
    Some of the newer engines with Bravo drives have blue plugs on the engine driven seawater pump. Drain these if necessary
    Replace all blue plugs
    Remove hoses from T-stat
    Fill manifolds with antifreeze until runs out pipes or outdrive
    Fill large hose until antifreeze runs out T-stat gooseneck.
    Reconnect water hoses
    Loosen serpentine belt
    Remove batteries
    If you on the sho', then you sho' not me, yo.

    1997 18 Classic 350 MAG/MPI Bravo -
    2004 Formula 27PC T-350 MAG/MPI Bravo III

  9. #9
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    Move more south :)

    Pull the drive and store it until spring. There is water that lays in the drive area. This also allows you to grease everything and check your coupler, etc.
    Nick
    1994 22' Classic-454 B1 Red & white
    1981 13' Whaler sport(original owner)
    South Tampa Bay, FL "May I mamoo dogface to the banana patch?"

  10. #10
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    Thumbs up Cool, more than one way to skin a cat

    My project for Saterday

  11. #11
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    Winterizing (for clean fresh water boats only)

    1) Fog.
    2) Remove 4 drain plugs and 3 hoses.
    3) Have a beer.

    My last boat lasted 25 years and over 3000 hours with no major work (and still ran fine when sold)
    Cheers,
    Pismo
    1996 22 Classic
    Red with Stainless Windshield
    Stock Gen VI 502 Magnum MPI-415hp
    Stock Bravo I
    25" Mirage Plus
    74.5mph best @ 5050rpm GPS (Speedo said 80)
    27" Labbed Mirage Plus
    75.5mph best @ 4800rpm GPS (Speedo said 82)

  12. #12
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    Cold Antifreeze???

    MOP,

    I have the same question as Ghost. I actually asked it several years ago in a thread you gave advise on about winterizing. Are we missing something?

    As I see it the cold water from my garden hose is flowing through the muffs into the engine. When the engine gets hot enough the thermostat opens allowing the garden hose water to flow through the engine. As the engine remains hot and the thermostat remains open, I switch the three way valve on my winterizing kit to allow the 5 gallons of antifreeze to flow into the engine. The temp of the antifreeze is warmer then the water from the garden hose. Once I see the antifreeze exiting frm my exhaust I begin fogging the carborator. I fog until the antifreeze is about gone from the 5 gallon container, then shut her down.

    Does this sound right???

  13. #13
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    New YOGA position.

    I did the upside down in the bilge INVERTED DOG looking for drain plugs in the block, none to be found. All other drain plugs removed. hoses pulled, I think the exhaust manifolds and block are mostly empty. My Merc book said 1-1/1/2 oz 2 stroke oil in the vapor sep. then run. I did both, oil in the sep then fog. We will see next spring. Any thoughts on HP plugs. My other go fast toys run the Platinum plugs, the 502 does burn a bit of oil, I've read this is normal?

  14. #14
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    Winterizing

    PMZoner
    My 350 Merc has one drain plug on each side of the block.... I seem to recall reading that some brands of replacement blocks do not. Your replacement block may not...
    I would question how one knows if the block water jackets really are drained???? I honestly don't know but I bet someone out there does....
    The temp has only been down to 34 here on Lake Lanier, so all is good for now.
    Comments or help for PMZoner???

  15. #15
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    "the 502 does burn a bit of oil, I've read this is normal ? "

    and

    "Comments or help for PMZoner ??? "

    Another of my much hated OT diversions .. Yes , when I got the 502 I was surprised to see oil consumption and sooty transoms (never experienced before) referred to as 'normal' for the 502 .

    After building V8's for all these years one would have thought that GM would put out something a bit better than this if you ask me .

    There was lots of convo over on OSO about this back in the early 2000's .
    Just because something's old doesn't mean you throw it away !

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