Page 3 of 25 FirstFirst 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 13 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 367

Thread: Ply or Coosa?

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    1,451
    Rep Power
    11
    Scippy I hear ya. My goal is the November 2012 key West Poker Run. Its going to be 90 and very humid here all week. Another week I won't be getting any grinding done Just too hot!
    P
    Time forSweet Cheekz to find a new home

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    877
    Rep Power
    0
    Finally a little break in the hot weather to get back to work on the transom. The only trace of rot I found in the transom was in the small area around the drain hole plug. (there was no sleeve or even a resin coating to the bare ply) good news moisture didn't wick upward which kept the rest of the transom dry. But, I had to remove most of the transom anyway (between the two outside stringers) It didn't seem practical to just fill in the large TRS cutouts especially after I squared them up it would only be a large replacement patch. I don't think a patch would hold well since I will be cutting a smaller Bravo within it. I decided to go beyound and replace most of the transom.
    1983 Cigarette 35' Mistress
    1976 Magnum 27' Sport
    1986 Donzi 18' Classic
    NEVER FORGET 9/11

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    938
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Sweet Cheekz View Post
    Hey Scippy
    I had an hour conversation this week with one of the most respected boat builders ever about this exact thing in my 27 and he emphatically said marine grade plywood. That may create a stir from a few diehards here of "modern" materials but he uses some of the most high tech stuff out there and still does his trabsoms in wood He had lots of good reasons and he really does know what he'stalking about I'm redoing my whole transom and using wood
    Parnell
    I agree on using wood and was that builder Pete of Douglas Marine / Skater ?

  4. #34
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    3,819
    Rep Power
    14
    Quote Originally Posted by scippy View Post
    Finally a little break in the hot weather to get back to work on the transom. The only trace of rot I found in the transom was in the small area around the drain hole plug. (there was no sleeve or even a resin coating to the bare ply) good news moisture didn't wick upward which kept the rest of the transom dry. But, I had to remove most of the transom anyway (between the two outside stringers) It didn't seem practical to just fill in the large TRS cutouts especially after I squared them up it would only be a large replacement patch. I don't think a patch would hold well since I will be cutting a smaller Bravo within it. I decided to go beyound and replace most of the transom.
    Scippy,
    Great to see the progress. How thick is the glass in the transom? I think mine was right at 9/16" thick. It looks like one of the four exhaust hole plugs fell out. If it did, why not take out the other three and fill them while you are building up the TRS cutout holes before building up the new transom? If you stretch and tape some wax paper on the outside of the transom holes, you can then screw some backing pieces of plywood or masonite to form a flat surface to build up layers of fiberglass from the inside until you get the thickness the same as the rest of the transom. You would need to bevel the edges from the inside first and have multiple pieces of glass cut to slightly larger pieces which you can layer into place to fill those holes. When done, go back and grind the inside of the transom to a smooth surface before installing the new transom. The outside small screw holes that held the backing pieces can be filled with thickened resin and the outside sanded and prepped before rolling on a coat or two of gelcoat which can then be sanded to smooth before applying paint or pigmented gelcoat. Just passing along the way I have done many transom rebuilds - Bill

    PS If you never want to take the chance of water damage due to the bilge drain hole, just build up nothing but layers of glass in the bottom 3 or so inches below the plywood transom pieces.

    1971 Donzi 18' 2+3
    1985 Eliminator 23' Daytona Offshore - Kevlar hull
    1988 23' Donzi CC F-23 with 250HP EFI Mercury OB
    1989 28' Team Warlock Offshore - single 548CID/600HP
    1990 23' Warlock Offshore - single 525HP
    Bill from Denison, TX - Lake Texoma

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    1,451
    Rep Power
    11
    Quote Originally Posted by OFFSHORE GINGER View Post
    I agree on using wood and was that builder Pete of Douglas Marine / Skater ?
    Hi Artie
    It was. Give me a shout when you get a chance

    Scippy Bill has good ideas and has been successful at it a few times Sound advice
    Parnell
    Time forSweet Cheekz to find a new home

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    877
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Conquistador_del_mar View Post
    Scippy,
    Great to see the progress. How thick is the glass in the transom? I think mine was right at 9/16" thick. It looks like one of the four exhaust hole plugs fell out. If it did, why not take out the other three and fill them while you are building up the TRS cutout holes before building up the new transom? If you stretch and tape some wax paper on the outside of the transom holes, you can then screw some backing pieces of plywood or masonite to form a flat surface to build up layers of fiberglass from the inside until you get the thickness the same as the rest of the transom. You would need to bevel the edges from the inside first and have multiple pieces of glass cut to slightly larger pieces which you can layer into place to fill those holes. When done, go back and grind the inside of the transom to a smooth surface before installing the new transom. The outside small screw holes that held the backing pieces can be filled with thickened resin and the outside sanded and prepped before rolling on a coat or two of gelcoat which can then be sanded to smooth before applying paint or pigmented gelcoat. Just passing along the way I have done many transom rebuilds - Bill

    PS If you never want to take the chance of water damage due to the bilge drain hole, just build up nothing but layers of glass in the bottom 3 or so inches below the plywood transom pieces.
    Bill,
    They didn't fool around back then, did they?..........it's as equally thick as yours and what's really amaz'in is the amount of Glass they used to wrap the stringers. I cut the outboard stringer away from the transom today and the core was only 1/2" ply, but it was wrapped in atleast 1" of glass. "Crazy thick" I intend to cutout the remaining exhaust holes and laminate them in after I scarf the edges 12:1..............A quick question on applying the pre-cut pieces of cloth for filling in the exhaust holes and TRS cutouts. (From the inside) do I go large to small -or- small to large?.........I read somewhere it said, place the largest piece first to cover the full area of the scarf and work smaller as you go..............I'm using 1.5 oz mat and 24 oz roving w/poly resin - I like the idea of full glass in the small area of the drain plug something that was echoed here by a few pro's as well.
    1983 Cigarette 35' Mistress
    1976 Magnum 27' Sport
    1986 Donzi 18' Classic
    NEVER FORGET 9/11

  7. #37
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    3,819
    Rep Power
    14
    Quote Originally Posted by scippy View Post
    Bill,
    They didn't fool around back then, did they?..........it's as equally thick as yours and what's really amaz'in is the amount of Glass they used to wrap the stringers. I cut the outboard stringer away from the transom today and the core was only 1/2" ply, but it was wrapped in atleast 1" of glass. "Crazy thick" I intend to cutout the remaining exhaust holes and laminate them in after I scarf the edges 12:1..............A quick question on applying the pre-cut pieces of cloth for filling in the exhaust holes and TRS cutouts. (From the inside) do I go large to small -or- small to large?.........I read somewhere it said, place the largest piece first to cover the full area of the scarf and work smaller as you go..............I'm using 1.5 oz mat and 24 oz roving w/poly resin - I like the idea of full glass in the small area of the drain plug something that was echoed here by a few pro's as well.
    Scippy,
    I always went with the smaller pieces to the larger pieces, but I really don't think it will matter as long as they all overlap by a little - it will be totally filled and the resin will provide the contact saturation area. When you lay in your first layer of glass over the entire area for the first piece of plywood, the repaired areas will then be sandwiched into place. Try not to over catalyze the resin or it will get very hot with that much thickness (9/16") in one application. Bill

    1971 Donzi 18' 2+3
    1985 Eliminator 23' Daytona Offshore - Kevlar hull
    1988 23' Donzi CC F-23 with 250HP EFI Mercury OB
    1989 28' Team Warlock Offshore - single 548CID/600HP
    1990 23' Warlock Offshore - single 525HP
    Bill from Denison, TX - Lake Texoma

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    938
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Sweet Cheekz View Post
    Hi Artie
    It was. Give me a shout when you get a chance

    Scippy Bill has good ideas and has been successful at it a few times Sound advice
    Parnell
    Parn ,i will get with you sometime next week and have a great weekend .

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Posts
    938
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by Conquistador_del_mar View Post
    Scippy,
    I always went with the smaller pieces to the larger pieces, but I really don't think it will matter as long as they all overlap by a little - it will be totally filled and the resin will provide the contact saturation area. When you lay in your first layer of glass over the entire area for the first piece of plywood, the repaired areas will then be sandwiched into place. Try not to over catalyze the resin or it will get very hot with that much thickness (9/16") in one application. Bill
    Bill , not to be rude but it does matter because your layup is only as strong as your weakest link and you had it right using smaller pieces going to the larger ones staggering your layup and for excample if you you lay up two pices of glass on top of each other, all you get is one thick layer of glass with no structural strength other then one thick layer of glass .

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    12,663
    Rep Power
    28
    Quote Originally Posted by scippy View Post
    I'm using 1.5 oz mat and 24 oz roving w/poly resin - I like the idea of full glass in the small area of the drain plug something that was echoed here by a few pro's as well.
    Of course you can use whatever you want to, but some 24 oz. 1708 Knytex bi-directional +/- 45* stitchmat will be MUCH stronger.
    It's only $6.00/yard here;

    http://www.mertons.com/Reinforcement...le_stitch.html

    Keep in mind it's not woven, therefore the fibers are straight and not kinked like they are like roving. Also, w/all the rows of stitching that holds the material together, it's very easy to cut and fit the measured pieces.

    Also, the transom is important, and the resin you use is very important for a good bond of your new layup to the old transom glass..
    Merton's also offers Ashland vinylester resin at very good prices;

    http://www.mertons.com/Epoxy/vinyles...ins/index.html

    IMHO, filling in transom holes is no place to cut any corners, or take any chances on techniques.
    George Carter
    Central Florida
    gcarter763@aol.com
    http://kineticocentralfl.com/


    “If you have to argue your science by using fraud, your science is not valid"
    Professor Ian Plimer, Adilaide and Melbourne Universities

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    12,663
    Rep Power
    28
    Hi Scippy;
    Why don't you go back and read my post # 12?
    George Carter
    Central Florida
    gcarter763@aol.com
    http://kineticocentralfl.com/


    “If you have to argue your science by using fraud, your science is not valid"
    Professor Ian Plimer, Adilaide and Melbourne Universities

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    877
    Rep Power
    0
    Quote Originally Posted by gcarter View Post
    Of course you can use whatever you want to, but some 24 oz. 1708 Knytex bi-directional +/- 45* stitchmat will be MUCH stronger.
    It's only $6.00/yard here;

    http://www.mertons.com/Reinforcement...le_stitch.html

    Keep in mind it's not woven, therefore the fibers are straight and not kinked like they are like roving. Also, w/all the rows of stitching that holds the material together, it's very easy to cut and fit the measured pieces.

    Also, the transom is important, and the resin you use is very important for a good bond of your new layup to the old transom glass..
    Merton's also offers Ashland vinylester resin at very good prices;

    http://www.mertons.com/Epoxy/vinyles...ins/index.html

    IMHO, filling in transom holes is no place to cut any corners, or take any chances on techniques.
    George,

    So, I would only need one type of material (1708 kyntex) to do all the patching of the large TRS cutouts?...just layer upon layer until I reach the right 9/16" thickness? -or- do I still need Mat as the first patch piece going in?........I like the price of the vinylester. I'll order a 5 gallon pale to start with.....I have alot to do (Transom,TRS cutout, exhaust holes, cockpit sole) The 5 gals. of polyester was going to cost me the same price $220 all except for the shipping though. About storing it, cool & dry place?..........what's the shelf life?
    Also, do I just thickened some vinylester resin as a fillet for the transom corner's as well as the transom stringers?.................I devoured post "12"
    1983 Cigarette 35' Mistress
    1976 Magnum 27' Sport
    1986 Donzi 18' Classic
    NEVER FORGET 9/11

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    12,663
    Rep Power
    28
    Scippy, you can do the burn trick like I mentioned and duplicate the original schedule or just use 1708. The 1708 is probably stronger in the long run but it will take more courses than if roving was used in the original layup schedule.
    It's very important to start w/a layer of gel in your hull color, or at least a couple of coats of resin and let it start to kick, then one course of mat.
    The first course of 1708 Knytex has mat attached to one side, so that makes two courses of mat when you stick in your first piece of 1708.
    The next course of 1708 will be rotated 45* so that the build up is always alternating between +/- 45* and 0*-90*.
    Also the mat on the next course will be applied to the face of the preceeding course.
    In other words, mat side face down on each course so there's a layer of mat between each course.
    Since you don't know the original schedule, be sure and cut some extra pieces to make sure you have enough material to fill the void.
    When everything is setting up quickly is not the time to stop and cut some more.
    Your original layup is pretty thick, so your bevel will be about 6 1/2" wide (that's a LOT of grinding).
    I would start fitting the first piece at about 1" larger (1/2" per side) and go up in 3/8"-1/2" increments (per side).
    In fact, I'd start w/something small like an exhaust hole. That would give some experiance in an area where there's no torque or heavy loads.
    I wish you well. Just like painting, everything depends on preporation.
    Anyone can lay in the little pieces of 1708 Knytex, the key to success is having everything right.
    George Carter
    Central Florida
    gcarter763@aol.com
    http://kineticocentralfl.com/


    “If you have to argue your science by using fraud, your science is not valid"
    Professor Ian Plimer, Adilaide and Melbourne Universities

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Posts
    12,663
    Rep Power
    28
    Quote Originally Posted by scippy View Post
    George,
    . About storing it, cool & dry place?..........what's the shelf life?
    Also, do I just thickened some vinylester resin as a fillet for the transom corner's as well as the transom stringers?.................I devoured post "12"
    Cool storage is important. If cool enough, it might last a year.
    As far as radii, I'd use this product;

    http://www.mertons.com/Epoxy/polyest...ins/putty.html

    It'll save you some time.
    George Carter
    Central Florida
    gcarter763@aol.com
    http://kineticocentralfl.com/


    “If you have to argue your science by using fraud, your science is not valid"
    Professor Ian Plimer, Adilaide and Melbourne Universities

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    877
    Rep Power
    0
    Thanks George for all the valued info!......as you say, good prep is key to good results...............Tomorrow, Parnell will be coming here to NJ to spend the night before picking up the last of the 2 Magnums. maybe I'll throw in a scheduled "fiberglass burn" to parch the throat for some real cold ones...LOL!!
    1983 Cigarette 35' Mistress
    1976 Magnum 27' Sport
    1986 Donzi 18' Classic
    NEVER FORGET 9/11

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •