EstorilM
05-20-2012, 11:28 PM
I just can't have an enjoyable weekend with this boat. After countless trips to the shop while working with the install (3hr trip) I really want to see some return on investment and watch this boat run. Anyways, when I picked up the boat from this shop (they had just replaced the intake manifold gasket earlier Friday since it had a nasty vacuum leak during my LAST failed boating weekend) - they also swapped the 23p prop for a 27p prop (these were all that I had to work with, and the 23 was kinda a joke) - I was excited to see what the engine actually had for power, since I couldn't put any load on it with the 23, it would just tach out. For reference, boat is a 24' Black Widow with new 454 bored to 468, 10:1 pistons, roller rocker, all forged internals.. apparently 490hp on dyno.
Took a girl friend out this weekend, picked her up, loaded up supplies.. we were running really late and didn't get onto the water till 10:45 PM :boggled: So I'm pulling out of the neighborhood marina and pass the no wake buoys - I slowly get on it, trim down, planes down.. builds up speed to about 10-12mph and I feel some resistance in the way it's loading up, I push the throttle a little harder and can feel the engine kinda building "pressure", lowering rpm slightly, then POOF/cough and I'm sitting there at 11pm with this girl in the middle of the lake with a dead engine. :nilly:
I pop the hatch... and everything looks normal? Oil is okay.. I turn the key just for the hell of it, and it fires right up?! I try to plane again and same deal.. no go.
At this point I idle it over to the cove which gives me a new found respect for how FAR things seem when you're going ~7mph.
I think a few things are going wrong here, but they've told me they "will make it right this week before Memorial Day weekend or give me a refund on the engine" - I don't want them chasing their tails long with this one, since a) I hate people just screwing around in my boat to begin with, and b) I'm tired of 3 hour trips and wasted weekends only to discover new issues.
Previously I had 21p and 23p props on the boat and I don't think either of them loaded the engine up enough to see if there were any high-HP type issues with it like fuel or air delivery. They removed the bypass system on the fuel pump (how it was when I got the boat with a dead 454) and connected it directly to the carb on new engine (Sea Demon 830) - the block on the pump clearly has return AN fittings on it for the return type system, but I'm not sure if it needs that. When I came in the next day I let the engine do the same thing when I pushed it, but with the hatch open so I could look at the glass float bowl indicator.. it didn't LOOK like it had run out of fuel, but that pump might be filling up the bowl instantly after the engine cuts out so it's hard to know.
I think this problem always existed since my engine install a few weeks ago, but I was still breaking it in and didn't want to put the big prop on it yet. Even if that prop is slightly too large, the engine obviously shouldn't just shut off.. so I don't want to focus on that (besides, personally I think a 500hp engine can spin a 27p prop - I'm just far from convinced in the power of this engine yet).
My throttle travel also seems limited, I need to check the rigging but the throttle lever hits a stop at around the neutral position of the shifter lever - I know that's wrong, but I also think the carb arm isn't moving all the way from what I saw / felt with the 23p prop - carb arm is 1/8" from stop location still.
My main question is simply... what could they have done when they replaced the intake manifold gasket which would cause something like this to happen? Or do you think it's totally unrelated and I'm simply discovering a fuel problem since I put the larger prop on there for the first time? Is that how an engine would behave if I drained the float? On the return trip I did manage to "save" it right when it was about to cut out I killed the throttle and after a couple coughs/throttle pumps it returned to idle and ran in the lower throttle positions just fine.
PS before I gave up on my weekend saturday (I was just going to put the 23p back on real quick) and checked with the hatch open.. when I really got it to shut off to check the float indicator, it coughed REALLY loud - probably just because the hatch was open, but when I turned around EVERYTHING back there was covered with water?? :eek: I never did see an actual leak, or damaged hose or anything.. and noticed water draining around the hatch gutter and into the drains - I GUESS because the engine stopped, it just swamped everything back there (the black widow has like zero space behind hatch hinges, maybe 6") but I'm not sure how I got water on the engine, intake manifold, etc.. but unless a water hose was damaged, that should pretty much be impossible right? I mean unless it did just get swamped for a second.
Took a girl friend out this weekend, picked her up, loaded up supplies.. we were running really late and didn't get onto the water till 10:45 PM :boggled: So I'm pulling out of the neighborhood marina and pass the no wake buoys - I slowly get on it, trim down, planes down.. builds up speed to about 10-12mph and I feel some resistance in the way it's loading up, I push the throttle a little harder and can feel the engine kinda building "pressure", lowering rpm slightly, then POOF/cough and I'm sitting there at 11pm with this girl in the middle of the lake with a dead engine. :nilly:
I pop the hatch... and everything looks normal? Oil is okay.. I turn the key just for the hell of it, and it fires right up?! I try to plane again and same deal.. no go.
At this point I idle it over to the cove which gives me a new found respect for how FAR things seem when you're going ~7mph.
I think a few things are going wrong here, but they've told me they "will make it right this week before Memorial Day weekend or give me a refund on the engine" - I don't want them chasing their tails long with this one, since a) I hate people just screwing around in my boat to begin with, and b) I'm tired of 3 hour trips and wasted weekends only to discover new issues.
Previously I had 21p and 23p props on the boat and I don't think either of them loaded the engine up enough to see if there were any high-HP type issues with it like fuel or air delivery. They removed the bypass system on the fuel pump (how it was when I got the boat with a dead 454) and connected it directly to the carb on new engine (Sea Demon 830) - the block on the pump clearly has return AN fittings on it for the return type system, but I'm not sure if it needs that. When I came in the next day I let the engine do the same thing when I pushed it, but with the hatch open so I could look at the glass float bowl indicator.. it didn't LOOK like it had run out of fuel, but that pump might be filling up the bowl instantly after the engine cuts out so it's hard to know.
I think this problem always existed since my engine install a few weeks ago, but I was still breaking it in and didn't want to put the big prop on it yet. Even if that prop is slightly too large, the engine obviously shouldn't just shut off.. so I don't want to focus on that (besides, personally I think a 500hp engine can spin a 27p prop - I'm just far from convinced in the power of this engine yet).
My throttle travel also seems limited, I need to check the rigging but the throttle lever hits a stop at around the neutral position of the shifter lever - I know that's wrong, but I also think the carb arm isn't moving all the way from what I saw / felt with the 23p prop - carb arm is 1/8" from stop location still.
My main question is simply... what could they have done when they replaced the intake manifold gasket which would cause something like this to happen? Or do you think it's totally unrelated and I'm simply discovering a fuel problem since I put the larger prop on there for the first time? Is that how an engine would behave if I drained the float? On the return trip I did manage to "save" it right when it was about to cut out I killed the throttle and after a couple coughs/throttle pumps it returned to idle and ran in the lower throttle positions just fine.
PS before I gave up on my weekend saturday (I was just going to put the 23p back on real quick) and checked with the hatch open.. when I really got it to shut off to check the float indicator, it coughed REALLY loud - probably just because the hatch was open, but when I turned around EVERYTHING back there was covered with water?? :eek: I never did see an actual leak, or damaged hose or anything.. and noticed water draining around the hatch gutter and into the drains - I GUESS because the engine stopped, it just swamped everything back there (the black widow has like zero space behind hatch hinges, maybe 6") but I'm not sure how I got water on the engine, intake manifold, etc.. but unless a water hose was damaged, that should pretty much be impossible right? I mean unless it did just get swamped for a second.