Build or buy reman?

[scippy]

I don't pretend to know much about marine engines (this certainly won't help things because I won't be turning any wrenches
to help build anything) but I do know many board members here are very apt when it comes to knowledge of engines and would
appreciate some good suggestions for a mild engine setup (350hp+) with a must in "reliability".........application will be a 27 mag
w/twin power.
Realisticly, I don't see this happening for a least 2 years, but a budget of 7 to 9K per engine is hopefully what I can allow at that
time.........Recently, I visited some venders at the NY boat show and narrowed my choices down to a reman 350hp 383 mag bravo
4v (carbureted) around 7K........OR.......Reman 350hp 383 mag stroker bravo (MPI) around 9K........Both come with 1 year factory
backed limited warranty.
Would this be the "best reliable" power choice within my budget for a SB 383? ......or could someone make the argument aganist
the Merc reman 383 in favor of a better engine within the budget allowed..............thanks for taking a look!

[smokediver]

I bought a re-manned engine from mercury , a 350 , and imo it was junk . I could have had one built with way better internals for a lot cheaper . I replaced the 350 with a 383 I had built and was much happier and it is still going stong . just my 2 cents

[ralph crocker]

I have a 28 Magnum Maltese with twin 383 strokers built locally. Having a motor built is dependant on how well it is layed out. Cam/heads pistons/ etc. all must be designed to flow well. So I think the critical factor is the "builder".
Examples:
Friend of mine had a SBC built for a 16 with a parameter to the shop of 350 HP it ended up about 260 HP. He sold it and is having another built by someone else. On the other hand I have a chasis car I race that a local "meticulous" builder did. It is a 406 has over 400 runs on it and is still like new. Everything works together. Another friend bought a 22 Classic with a slightly built 454 by a motot "shop". He took apart only to discover it was poorly cammed and the heads poorly done. The motor had reversion at idle and damage in the valve train plus the dynamics allowed only 8 to 1 compression.
So whether reman or small shop built the critical factor for me is "the builder".

Suggest you find the builders in your area and research them. Depending on the power you want your budget may not be bad.

[silverghost]

Smokediver~
Are not ALL the Mercruiser Scorpion & Mag. 350/383 hi-perormance engines now built using only remanufactured used old iron block cores ?

I have always wondered about the quality level of these re-manufactured Merc. engines using used & remachined old core blocks .
What did you not like about your remanufactured block ?

Were the block's rotating internals of low quality ?
How was the basic block itself ?
The block's water jackets ?
The machine work ?

I believe GM / Chevrolet actually stopped building the small blocks some years ago after building some 65 Million+ units since 1955-56 when it first appeared in the Chevy Corvette .

[Buddyc]

I was going to go with a reman for my 66. I spoke with Jamie from lakeside and he told me horror stories about a couple of them and that was good enough for me not to go that route. Instead, I went with a 5.7 Vortec long block rated at 330 hp. I put a Edelbrock Performer intake and going to take it from there. Also a big plus for me is that I can paint the block and dress the motor the way I want. Maybe in the long run I might spend a couple more bucks, but I know that im getting what I want. Good luck!!!

[olredalert]

----Scippy,,,Look up Michigan Motorz (spelled correctly). They have many choices. I had to buy a duplicate 350 merc 2 barrel motor this past summer for the El P and they were simply great to work with. Cant remember the price off the top of my head as Im away from home, but it was very reasonable. The motor was absolutely new. I also bought two 454/380hp pills for the Fino from them. the 454s were previously used blocks but everything else including the heads was new. They couldnt find the intakes I wanted to use so they let me bring in mine, and also built one with reverse rotation. Family run company where you can walk in the front door and talk to the owner at length.
----Oh yah,,,Forgot, They build nothing but marine motors........Bill S

[justleft]

A friend got a GM LS-1 crate motor about a yr ago. After about 20 hrs it lost 2 pistons and kicked a couple rods out
of the side. Can't say which failed first.

But GM gave him a new motor on warranty !! Or so that is the story that I was told.

[smokediver]

I am speaking of the re-manned 350 . i think the scorpion is mecury racing ? I am not talking about the block , the internals were all cast and for the money i could have gotten more horsepower and better , longer lasting internals . I think you can have a quality engine built by a reputable shop cheaper than an off the shelf mercruiser engine ... just my 2 cents..

[OFFSHORE GINGER]

Pete , might i suggest something in the 400 to 420 HP range for the Mag .

[scippy]

Seems 4 to 1 aganist merc reman engines...............Bill, I'll checkout Mich. Motorz
Ralph, I have Kurts marine here in Brick N.J............I hear they're excellant builders
Artie, 400, 420 reliable hp is probabely a better choice for the "heavyweight" sport.
Kraftee (Eric) is building a 383 of his own right now.......getting his opinnion as well.
might just want to slow build an engine of my own.......with a little from my friends.
I have lots of time!...................Thanks all!

[OFFSHORE GINGER]

Pete , just curious and once again what drives are you running Volvo or TRS and what speed range would keep you happy without wanting to rebuilding the following year because S/B's can be truly reliable considering you are not ready for any rat motor's yet ....Ha Ha Ha

[Buddyc]

Where are you located?

[scippy]

Fixx,
I want lighter SB's going into my Mag.........who is Bob Mandara?

Artie,
Drives will be Bravo ones..........not looking for speed, just reliable mild power.

Buddy,
I live in Jackson.......You didn't make your NFL picks yet.

[joseph m. hahnl]

I agree with SD, To rebuild over a Merc re manufactured block. You can defiantly up the quality of components used. But there is a catch to rebuilding. The blocks you have need to be gone through. When you buy a re manufactured engine all of the machined surfaces are resized and trued. You might want this done on the seasoned block. Usually NAPA has a machine shop that can assess and re true the block. Are they going to be as thorough as Merc. Probably not, but I'm sure it will be adequate.At this point you can have them put in all of the block reliefs to except a long throw stroker crank and drill and tap for a 4 bolt main. To make it up to a 383 it needs to bored .030 over. You need to determine what compression ratio you want and what type of Piston you are going to use,to determine the proper deck height . "this does not mean cast or forged", Pistons come in a variety of profiles on the top.You also want to use a marine roller camshaft for roller Tappets "AKA Lifters" If the block did not have them, a mod in the oil valley may be needed. So you can see it can be very labor intensive just to prep the block.
They sell bottom end kits and top end kits that can take out all the guess work out , heads and intake, rod,crank and pistons are all matched.The top end kits would need to purchase the same spec marine cams separately.In the end the only thing that is seasoned is the block . Both kits would run in access of $6000 per motor + labor.

Now if the block does not have closed cooling."purchase them" and was run in salt. It would not be worth putting all that labor into a block that may be corroded through out the water passages.


My suggestion would be to go with a secondary builder, and buy the 383 short block with a steel crank , forged rods , forged pistons and roller cam setup.
Then put a Top end kit on, with a matched spec Marine cam, pre installed by the builder.

This is the best of both worlds.You would Have a top notch block capable of 600+Hp, all dependent on what top end kit and cam you put on. This setup I would estimate $6K to $7K and it would be bolt on, the top end kit you can do by yourself or with help from friends . No need for the local guy to get involved.

[mphatc]

Scippy,

I am completing two new 383 SBCs for my Magnum 27. They will be close to 475-500 HP . . New DART blocks, AFR Heads, Custom ground cams, Eagle forged cranks and H beam rods, J&E Pistons, full ARP fasteners, Edelbrock Air Gap manifolds, MSD ignitions, all aluminum parts coated by DART Coatings. By the time they are completed they will be a bit above your price point, but built and designed for 93 Octane and long life. I do advise that you build for more power than 350 HP.

If you go with new, spend the extra dollars to break them in on a dyno and have them correctly tuned before you hit the water!

Even though I build BMW race engines for a living, I left the details of these engines to a SBC professional who has been building marine engines for years. He did the same with me on my Corsican which has a 302 Ford that runs over 70 MPH. On that engine we dynoed the lower end, and later changed to AFR heads which really woke it up!

Mario L.

[HallJ]

[ QUOTE=$originalposter]{$pagetext}[/QUOTE]


Do you put Chinese parts in your BMW engines?

Jeff

[scippy]

J m hahnl, Mario, fixx, SD...
Who's best to supply the 383 CID block for the start of a build.....Summit, Dart..??
Also, could a MPI engine be built much the same as a carbureted one?.......would
the LS-1 induction be simular to an SBC Merc MPI engine?.....What about a base
marinizerd LS-1 block in general....are they offered much the same as any SBC?

[joseph m. hahnl]

I'd go with Summit for the top end kit. But for the Short block you should shop around.Here's a link for some one who will custom build to your spec. They don't have any prices on their site, you have to call:mad:
http://boostpower.com/s8bpr-383-sb-marine-short-block-p-438.html

This guy has a 7 year warranty,They show long blocks with stamped rockers:boggled:
http://www.usenginesinc.com/marine-engines.html


There are a lot of these guy's out there. Keep in mind you want a internally balanced assembly. Try to keep the rods long and the wrist pin offset below the ring grooves. If you read some history about the 383. It is alleged that they are not a good high revving engine when short rods are used, as all the geometry is pushed to the limit. The offset wrist pin also can be controversial as it shortens the ring land or in some cases actually violates it:shocking:

[scippy]

Fixx,

I spoke with Mandara.........sweet guy!........pointed me toward an assembled SBC Dart short block.
I'll best be able to decide after he writes a parts list on top of the assembled short block....Sump-in'
tells me I'll have to wager a bit more on my Super Bowl bet to cover a twin engine build:wink:

[mphatc]

Scippy,

I actually built mine as 377 cu in, chosing to save the blocks for further rebuilds into the future. I don't need this boat to go stupid fast, and long life was more important.

When we looked at the amount of torque I'd sacrifice by going 377 vs 383 . . and the amount of torque gained with longer rods I decided that my money would be better spent on the AFR heads and custom cams. My engines have the shorter rods.

If you want the Magnum 27 to be fast, single BBC with a blower , add a pad on the back like Mange's boat . . . I want a period classic with a bit more guts, and this is why I stayed with the Volvo drives . .

The most important thing in the marine engines are the clearances. Every clearance in my engine is set for the cooling system using lake water. The machinists changed every clearance spec, including valve guide clearance, wrist pin clearances, afaik, even the upper and lower main bearings differ. Discuss your use and applications with the builder and find one who recognizes your interests and concerns.

Mario

[oledawg]

Just bought a new 482 stroker 454 short block from Hawaii Racing in California. Will advise how this works out. All of the nice top end parts from my broken Bill Dennis 454 will fit, so I should end up with around 500 hp. I have been looking for alternatives for the past couple of months and this seems to be the best all around. At least my boat techs thought so, and they are VERY familiar with my Donzi 22C and my driving habits. Going back to my Mirage 27P prop and I think that it will be a nice package. :wink:

[biggiefl]

A 377 is just a standard bore 350 with a 400 crank where a 383 is bored .030 over. Why would 5 pubic inches account for a noticeable torque loss? Everything in/on a 377 should be the same as in a 383 other than pistons/rings or am I missing something. What are you guys talking about with short or long rods?

FYI- My 383 has been in my Vette since 1992 when 383's were not very common. I don't take it above 6k as I am faster at about 57-5800 between shifts on the track. This engine has been ABUSED for 20 years and about 50k miles but runs like a scalded dog to this day. Not sure how many half shafts I have twisted or blown out before I had custom ones made.

[HallJ]

What's the biggest you can go with Dart small blocks?

Jeff

[joseph m. hahnl]

What are you guys talking about with short or long rods?



http://www.strokerengine.com/RodStroke.html


Because of the longer stroke the deck height changes. The piston travels up and down further:bonk:. You can use stock pistons with short rods. or stock rods with offset wrist pins in the piston



http://image.hotrod.com/f/9506917+w750+st0/p140792_image_large.jpg (http://image.hotrod.com/f/9506917/p140792_image_large.jpg)http://www.strokerengine.citymaker.com/i//331_or_347_pistons.jpg

[smidgen too]

Back in 1991 I had my friends Katech build our Skater race team a pair of 372cu small blocks. They had 100 over J&E pistons 6" Carrilo rods & Callies 3.480 stock stroke crankshaft. Back then we made 710hp with a single holley 1050cfm carb. With a 1:68 gear ratio in the speed IV drives we ran them @ 7200 to 7600rpm all day. This combination was very depenable, we ran 35 + races without a failure. I have one of these engines in my street 1959 Corvette, say it's a little over powered. :boggled:
http://www.katechengines.com/katech_inc/

[BUIZILLA]

a 372 sb is a .125 over 350 block, which would require sleeves for wall thickness safety....

a 383 stroker is a big crank in a 350 block

most succesful 372's and 377's were destroked 400's using a 3.480/3.500 350 crank and either a std bore or +.030 bore 400 block

I have built EVERY combination above, and my favorite (and I still have it) is a 392" sb which is a 4.155 400 block and a *unique* destroked 3.625 crank

your math may vary :)

[The Hedgehog]

Reman is reman. That is not really an issue. In the end assembly built is the same. They are kind of like modern electronics, if they make it through the first month or so, they are probably fine. I have a 383 reman in my X-18 and have run it well with no problems. I would not put a blower on it though.

You can probably build a nice 383 for a cheaper price if you know what you are doing. If you have a good builder that works for cheap, you may be able to do it cheaper as well. You won't wring out 500 hp from that setup without spending some money on parts though.

[scippy]

After all the great info that's come in so far, i've decided to "build" rather than "buy" Merc reman.
Spoke to a few reputable builder's and all have suggested as well as some here to go with a new Dart
SHP small block.....Talked with Rick www.dartheads.com (http://www.dartheads.com) and agreed a 427 would be a better starting
base than a 383 for a performance rebuild down the road.....Waiting to go over 3 different parts list's
and the prices. I opted for an assembled engine & top kit, we'll see......one thing that puzzles me though,
he never asked about using a "marine" roller camshaft for the roller tappits -or- using stainless rockers.
Hope this isn't... "What's good for car engine is just as good for marine engine"......Since I'm learning
as I'm going here,,........Are there obvious no no's that can't be over looked when it comes to a marine
engine build?........What would be a good check list here!!!

[scippy]

CHEVY SBC 406 STAGE 3 CRATE MOTOR ENGINE. DART SHP BLOCK, FORGED PISTONS 515HP (http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHEVY-SBC-406-STAGE-3-CRATE-MOTOR-ENGINE-DART-SHP-BLOCK-FORGED-PISTONS-515HP-/350520332903?hash=item519ca3d267&item=350520332903&pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr)
Here's a crate motor within my budget (twice for twins) definately a step-up in power & parts
over some of the engines I've seen recently......by reading the build sheet would someone be
able to tell me if this motor would be a good crossover for marine use....application is 27 mag.
With a "street rod setup" such as this, would anything have to be changed -or- detunned in
any way before it can be a good fit in my boat?........Wish I knew more, but I know very little
in regards to Cams & cam settings....roller rockers, lifters and the like.....I do apppreciate the
feedback and honesty!.............Thanks

[smidgen too]

This was posted by BUIZILLA,,[a 372 sb is a .125 over 350 block, which would require sleeves for wall thickness safety....
a 383 stroker is a big crank in a 350 block
most succesful 372's and 377's were destroked 400's using a 3.480/3.500 350 crank and either a std bore or +.030 bore 400 block]

I stand corected they were 368cu, we were in a 372cu max class. We ran Chevy bowtie blocks with siamese bore's, no sleeves. As I said these engines would somtimes run at WOT for long run's in the 100 mile races we ran. After 500 miles we send them back to Katch to freshen them up. Dependability you bet, [35] 100 mile race's, never a failure.

[smidgen too]

Scippy , Roger Munn built the 400cu in my sport they are 2 bolt blocks, they run well and have held up. Roger and the Alle the guy I bought it from all said my Sport ran 70+ with Volvo drive raised 3". If these dont work out I have the 355cu Chevy's that were in the ANACONDA Mag when it raced back in the day. By todays standards they are old tech but they won many races. :yes:

[scippy]

Fixx.......If I can throw one more at you CHEVY SBC-427 -610HP (http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHEVY-SBC-427-STAGE-5-BOWTIE-CRATE-MOTOR-ENGINE-610HP-/350460444823?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&vxp=mtr&hash=item5199120097) Appreciate the honest opinion.
I spoke with Skip White, he suggests.............Configure the 427 to a 421 c.i. with a lower cam.
bore 4.185 x stroke 3.875 .........10.5 to 1 compression.................Will give Ted a call!

Mark.......who better to have an engine built for the Mag then Roger Munn.....I think Bud posted
his number somewhere?........400 block is a great way to start things going!

[BUIZILLA]

Skip White has a nice place and does a decent all around job, I have been there.... he knows the package permutations well, he puts together interesting CHEAP PRICE packages, you can't do that with all good parts IMO, with that said we don't have street rods the mope around the foothills.. anybody that says to use 10.5 today even with alum heads doesn't own or understand the marine industry today, or perhaps ever did..

read between those lines

PS, I do like the 421 idea with alum heads and 9.5ish pop though

[MDonziM]

Pete,

I agree that large displacement (~400ci) small block motors are prob best, big blocks are a tight fit in a sport. Its not easy to find a good eng builder at a reasonable price but in my opin. crate motors are not an option. When I was researching a motor for my 22 and asked my mechanic about a crate motor he wouldn't even begin to think about it. You need a forged crank and upgraded internals like fixx said and I would run not walk away from a builder who says 10.5 comp is ok (for you application) like buiz noted. If you find a good builder you can luck into some quality used parts for a build but its tough to find stuff in pairs. ( I bought a 540 ci merlin pro block, crower crank, 10 qt pan and msd distributer/ignition for 3k for my 22 but it was from a customer of my mechanic and he knew the history of the parts.) I think you have to count on spending 3-4k per motor more than the crate prices you see out there and have them done by the right shop.

- Marshall

[MDonziM]

Theres a pair of refreshed hp 500's on OSO swap shop, in NJ. Probably more motor than what you are looking for but a nice option if they fit. Seller used to own a 3man mag 27 raceboat too...

[scippy]

Appreciate all the good feedback & honest opinions!.......Having it out there for you guys to break down is a good thing.
I feel a bit lost, but better to be lost than to have invested in a inferior motor, I mean motor's....this is a great learning
experience without having to be sorry.
Fixx.......good check list for a build......gave Ted a call, waiting for a response.
Buiz.......400 block 421c.i. with good internals?.... realize it doesn't come cheap.
Marshall......couldn't find it on OSO?

[BUIZILLA]

I wouldn't do a 4.185 block unless it was aftermarket new, a seasoned block should stay at 4.155 max...

[MDonziM]

Go to OSO, Forums,scroll down to OSO Marketplace, Swap Shop. Sellers tag is Jmemoli , posted on 2/4 on pg three today. I have bought many things there with about 95% satisfaction.

[scippy]

Fixxx....you mentioned yor not a Dart guy, afr all the way.............could you explain?
Also, I jotted down your parts list...thanks. Could you go further and include a top to
bottom long block build that would be safe internally but not break the bank!.."Oxymoron"
right!!
knowing my budget..............Say in the 450 hp SBC area??

Buiz...What about a 427c.i. bored 4.125 x stroke 4.00 with 9 to 1 compression, forged
pistons & crank, H beam rods?....would this be heading in the right direction for 450 hp?
if so, what would be your choice of heads, cams, valves, manifold etc. etc. ..I would like
to present a long block build rather than a builder pushing a package or crate motor.
Skip White said a 4.00 stroke would be tooo deep thus the 3.875........confused as hell:confused:

Marshall....I found it.....they seem really huge!..............thanks Man!

[joseph m. hahnl]

I wouldn't do a 4.185 block unless it was aftermarket new, a seasoned block should stay at 4.155 max...




http://www.ebay.com/sch/skipwhite/m.html?_trkparms=65%253A12%257C66%253A2%257C39%253 A1%257C72%253A5841&rt=nc&_trksid=p3911.c0.m14.l1513&_pgn=1


http://www.ebay.com/sch/skipwhite/m.html?_nkw=sbc+motor&_sacat=0&_odkw=sbc&_osacat=0&_trksid=p3911.c0.m270.l1313






SBC CHEVY BOWTIE BLOCK, BRAND NEW FACTORY SEALED IN THE CRATE

FULLY MACHINED VERSION


These blocks are brand new, never used. supply on these are very limited
We start by boring the block to the desired specs. anywhere from 4.00 up to 4.185






70069



SBC 421 COMPLETE SHORT BLOCK KIT. FULLY FORGED, DART SHP BLOCK, SCAT 4340 CRANK, READY TO ASSEMBLE




70067


COMPLETE HEADS & CAM PACKAGE FOR SBC 350/383/400 ENGINES. EVERYTHING NEEDED IS INCLUDED.


70068.


This looks good for an Alpha drive



STAGE ONE 413HP CHEVY 350 CRATE ENGINE 100% BRAND NEWCOMPLETE FROM INTAKE TO OIL PAN, PARTIAL ASSEMBLY




70070

[scippy]

These are the same exact crate motors I alluded to (383, 421, 427) by Skip white back in post #33 & #37.
Reasonably priced when non-forged parts are in the build. The 427 crate has better parts (forged bottom)
but still questionable on the other parts in the build, as I've been told...far better for me to listen and learn.

[joseph m. hahnl]

I think that this is a place you can put and get what ever you want in the build for a reasonable cost. The key with this guy is he's doing all the machining and on CNC equipment. I'm thinking he buys bare everything and machines it . He seems to offer availability of roller hydraulic cams and lifters as an option. No mention of marine cams, though I'd bet they'd do it. I noticed something about flat tappet to roller. The stock OEM roller lifter appears to be a different Dia then the flat tappet. so they sell a retrofit roller cam and lifter to modify flat tappet motors. any one know if this is true and what Dia each are?

[scippy]

I can get this SHP 427 short block Small Block Chevy 427 Short Blocks - Short Block Assemblies (http://www.dartheads.com/products/short-block-assemblies/small-block-chevy-427-short-blocks.html) for
more than 1K cheaper than the above advertised price through a Dart vender in Fla. Dart will do all the
in house assembly in Mich. and ship to my home or business in Jersey ..I believe this price is even cheaper
than a Skip White 427 short block package with lesser parts.
The ironic thing is, living here in south jersey home to some of the premiere performance engine builder's
in the country does not always lend it's itself to great savings when it comes to building a marine engine.

[scippy]

Below is a statement by Skip White on why a 4.00 inch stroke would be a bad idea for a 427 engine build.
Is this a true statement or false for a marine engine?

THOSE WONDERING WHY WE DONT OFFER ANY ENGINE OPTIONS IN THE 4.00 INCH STROKE VERSION,
(434/440) AS WELL AS THE 4.125X4.00=427 IT IS BECAUSE WE FEEL THEM TO BE SHORT LIVED IN
COMPARED TO THE 4.185X3.875=427 STROKE USED IN THIS ENGINE. YOU MAY HEAR OF THOSE RUNNING
THE 4.00 INCH STROKE IN COMPETIVE RACING EVENTS BUT ENGINE RELIABILITY AND LONGEVITY ARE NOT THE
MAJOR CONCERN. WHEN IT COME TO STREET ROD USE, IT IS IN OUR OPINION A SOMEWHAT SHORT LIVED BUILD.
THE 3.875 STROKE IS NOT LIKE THIS, WHEN USING A HIGH PERFORMANCE BLOCK SUCH AS THE ONE USED IN OUR
ENGINES. YOU WILL NOT HEAR OF ENGINE FAILURES ON THE 3.875 STROKE BUILDS AS COMPARED TO THE 4.00
INCH. ONE MORE REASON WE DONT LIKE THE 4.00 INCH STROKE SET UP IS THAT THEY ARE NOT AVAILABLE FOR
THE 1 PC. REAR MAIN SEAL BLOCK, AND ONE OF THE ADVANTAGES OF THE 1 PC. RMS BLOCK IS THAT THEY ARE
VERY RESISTANT TO OIL LEAKS. IT WOULD NOT COST US 1 DOLLAR MORE FOR THE PARTS AND A VERY SLIGHT
AMOUNT OF LABOR, (MUCH MORE CLEARANCING IN THE BLOCK, AND BUTCHERING THE RODS FOR CAM CLEARANCE)
TO MOVE UP TO THE DEEPER STROKE ENGINE, BUT WE ARE FAIRLY CERTAIN ITS THE WRONG CHOICE TO MAKE.
WE HAVE FOUND THAT MANY OF THE PEOPLE BUYING ENGINES FOR A STREET ROD IN THIS PRICE RANGE WOULD
LIKE TO KNOW THAT THIS IS THE LAST ENGINE THEY WILL NEED FOR MANY YEARS TO COME. ITS CERTAINLY HAS
ENOUGH HORSE POWER TO PLEASE MOST EVERYONE, AND CAN BE DROVE AS A DAILY DRIVER FOR MANY MILES,
AND ENDURE MANY SPIRITED SPRINTS WITHOUT THE WORRY IF ITS THE LAST.

[scippy]

Well I'm pretty much sold on a pair of assembled 427 short block from Dart for my Magnum.

Fixx........Thanks for the referral to the "Cam guru".....lots to work out yet, but heads will
most likely be AFR ...........still need to figure out compression & pistons for 91 octane.

Marshall.......Bobby Mandera (Cam guru) just did the cam & head setup for a Starfire in
Texas running 427 Darts!