PDA

View Full Version : Crank pulley problem



gcarter
09-09-2011, 05:03 PM
I'm doing everything I can to finish the TR other than the engine rebuild.
That (the engine rebuild) will be the last and largest expense to budget for.
So, in the mean time, I'm mocking up everything on the engine.
I just received the Johnson crank driven pump and bracket. The original cast aluminum crank pulley is quite thick and places the pump flange forward about 1-1/4" so the bracket and pump can't be bolted together. I could fab a spacer for the block end of the bracket, or I could mangle the bracket and extend it.....
But the best solution would be a thin section triple pulley. I found some on eBay, they talk about long water pump, and short water pump?????????
What the heck!
I'm not using a belt driven circ pump.
So can somebody help me and tell me which this existing pulley is?

Here's some examples;
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3984Q2em1423Q2el2649QQ itemZ330591260994QQsspagenameZSTRKQ3aMEWAXQ3aIT

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3984Q2em1423Q2el2649QQ itemZ220644480142QQsspagenameZSTRKQ3aMEWAXQ3aIT

http://www.donzi.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=67798&d=1315605764

http://www.donzi.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=67799&d=1315605775

fogducker III
09-09-2011, 05:37 PM
Not sure if this is what you need George? This is off my 1997 454, I swapped it out when I did the Procharger install.....if it will work for you, send me your address and I will send it off, you will only have to paint it red......:yes:678006780167802

silverghost
09-09-2011, 05:51 PM
George~
When they talk about Long VS, Short water pump they are talking about the engine's stock circulator pump.
Usually cast iron; sometimes aluminum.
Most, if not all, stock marine engines use the short pump.
This is the dimension from the front face of the block to the pump pulley mounting flange.
Cars & trucks use the long pump to put the radiator fan close to the radiator.
On a boat engine you want the front to back measurements as compact as possible & thus the short pump is usually used.
Hope this helps ?

gcarter
09-09-2011, 06:16 PM
Hi Foggy, I think that's the pump pulley itself, which I don't need as I don't have a pump there, but thanks anyway. That's a very generous offer.

Brad, I think I got that, and what the two different pumps do is to relocate the centers of the three V-pulleys...isn't that right?
That's how i interpreted it anyway.
So, the power steering pump and alternator pulleys line up perfectly w/the first and third existing crankshaft pulleys.
Now, I think it's for a short pump, but what I think I need is for someone to identify my existing crankshaft pulley, as to whether it's for a long or short pump, so I can replace it with one that will keep the pulley referance locations and allow the crank driven pump to move back the 1-1/4" that I need.

silverghost
09-09-2011, 06:24 PM
George~
You got it right as to why they used these styles.

From your posted photos it appears you now have a short style crankshaft balancer syle pulley.
I have the very same style pulley on my MK IV 454 along with the Johnson crank style pump on my Skiboat.

gcarter
09-09-2011, 06:28 PM
Thanks Brad, I appreciate it.
I'll order the appropriate crank pulley.

mrfixxall
09-10-2011, 01:10 AM
ginger,,here we have a member that said see ya because of comments like this..this comment is totally uncalled for,,maybe he is just trying to ease back into things,,we all mis his posts so back the phuck off and quit instigating..



Sorry George..

OFFSHORE GINGER
09-10-2011, 08:02 AM
Fixx - Ha Ha Ha , are you happy now :yes: ? Fixx , i gotta say seeing him back really brings a tear to a glass eye .:eek::eek:

fogducker III
09-10-2011, 09:22 AM
I grabbed the wrong pulley, I think this might be the one your looking for....? Same offer applies.....678076780867809

gcarter
09-10-2011, 09:41 AM
Yep, that's the one I have and the material where the bolts go through is too thick and moves the pump flange too far forward.
Thanks again.

GeneD
09-10-2011, 12:44 PM
Plain and simple...
That pump was made to be installed with the sheet metal pulley and not the aluminum cast pulley.

gcarter
09-10-2011, 09:06 PM
Yep!
And now I have the proper pulley ordered.
I think it'll arrive on Wednesday or Thursday.

MOP
09-11-2011, 06:41 AM
George I beleive you have the Merc under drive pulley set similar to the ones that came on my Tempest engine, I cut one land off then machined the remaining pulley to accecpt the pumps flange. It came out pretty neat plus I have no empty pulley lands and still have under drive saving a couple of ponies. The tin set is a bit larger in diameter and spin the accessories faster.

Phil

gcarter
09-11-2011, 09:24 AM
Thanks Phil.
I think yuou're correct as to the ID of my existing pulley.

This is the pulley I ordered;
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BBC-POLISHED-ALUMINUM-3-GROOVE-SHORT-PUMP-CRANK-PULLEY-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trkparmsZalgoQ3dLVIQ26ituQ3dUC IQ26otnQ3d5Q26poQ3dLVIQ26psQ3d63Q26clkidQ3d2706000 669732430406QQ_trksidZp5197Q2em7QQitemZ11069795057 5

I measured my pulley and if the pulley dimension in the description is the OD of the flanges, then they're the same; 6.6".
Also, the web thickness appears to be approximately the same as a sheet metal pulley set, so it should be good.
$50.00 and "free" shipping!

MOP
09-11-2011, 11:30 AM
That will do the job but will need help, looks like the "Race Lite" one I have. I gave up on the Race Lite, I could not get the pump centered enough to get rid of the wiggle. That was the reason I machined the under drive, I made a cup in the pulley that dead centers the pump. If you have enough meat get it machined, even a .040 cut will save you some grief. The other alternative is tube shims or shouldered bolts that fit the pumps bolt holes.

Phil

Bobby D
04-29-2013, 02:54 PM
Since the motor is out of the boat I decided to install a new crank driven raw water pump. The original VP water pump was leaking and after reading about the benefits and easy maintenance of the crank driven pump I made the change. Forgot to take before pictures however I had the same problem George did, the universal bracket I ordered was way short and interfered with the harmonic balancer so here’s what I did. I believe it’s made to be mounted on the starboard or facing the motor on the lower left. My cross over is starboard side and in order to properly line up the inlet and outlet hoses I needed to mount the bracket on the port side or lower right and it needed to move down 1 7/8 inches and out 1 to work. I turned the bracket upside down cut off the piece that extended down below the arm transferred the bolt pattern to the upper end and drilled (2) new holes. I used the piece that I cut off to extend it and this is what I ended up with. A little black spray paint and except for the hole you can’t tell where it was extended.

mattyboy
04-29-2013, 03:07 PM
Bobby

****in A Bubba

outstanding !!! :yes:

gcarter
04-29-2013, 03:47 PM
Bobby, it looks great, and you'll really enjoy the pump.

Back to mine, and the problem I had, I took the new pulley to the machine shop and had a close fitting pilot machined into it. Now it all fits perfectly.