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kcraig99
08-18-2011, 01:00 PM
I have a hydraulic steering question. I won't go into the whole full system vs. add on and one ram vs. two ram debate. I would like to know if there is a template for where the rams will mount to the stern. I know it will be different depending on which system you go with. I have read some good things on here about the Zeiger system, so I guess that is where I am probably leaning right now. I just would like to get a general idea where the rams will be on the stern. Pics of any 22 classic sterns with hydraulic steering would be great too.

Also I guess any lessons you've learned "the hard way" are always helpful.

Thanks.
Kris

Carl C
08-18-2011, 01:14 PM
I just dug up all of the pics I could find on this forum. Get the drilling guide with the Zeiger kit. Here is a pic of Bamboo Loui's: http://www.donzi.net/forums/showpost.php?p=557205&postcount=3
Here are pics of mine: http://www.donzi.net/forums/showpost.php?p=560492&postcount=18

kcraig99
08-18-2011, 01:56 PM
Thanks for the links to the pics. That's what I was affraid of. My mounting locations for the underwater lights I use about 3 times per summer seem less than intellegent now.:bonk:

http://images2.snapfish.com/232323232%7Ffp539%3B4%3Enu%3D3933%3E%3A98%3E258%3E WSNRCG%3D3434%3B%3B3657349nu0mrj

zelatore
08-18-2011, 02:25 PM
I can't tell where exactly your lights are from the glare but I'm assuming they are well under the boot stripe since they need to be under the waterline. You might well have enough room to mount the rams. Keepin mind that you can move the hose attachments wherever you want as long as you have access. Here's a pic of my Zieger system - I put mine above the ram mounts. The second shot may help give you some idea of the spacing. Also remember that they offer the kits with different length rams that will mount closer/further from the drive.

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz85/zelatore/steeringinstal019.jpg

http://i816.photobucket.com/albums/zz85/zelatore/steeringinstal015.jpg

kcraig99
08-18-2011, 02:42 PM
Thanks those pics are great, exactly what I was looking for actually.

The lights are right on the stripe. Bottom of the light is on the top of the stripe I should say. This puts them about 5 inches under water at rest and they are out of the water when on plane shining on the wake/rooster tail. They are the ocean LED trailer series so they do not need to be under water at all times.

I'm just pissed at myself for not thinking ahead. The boat runs about 65 so hydraulic is not a must, its just one thing that I would like to add for safety and peace of mind. I can rip off the lights, it actually looks like the ram mount will pretty much cover the hole so that is not a huge concern, however the 4200 used to seal the lights will probably take some gel coat off with it if I were to pull them off.

zelatore
08-18-2011, 09:10 PM
I'd say there's a 75% chance you can get the lights off without tearing off the gel if you take your time and go slowly and carefully. Look for a product called DeBond at your local chandlery. It does work, but the key is getting it to the working surface you're attacking. I usually hit the perimeter of the item I'm working on, then get a plastic scraper started under the edge, then hit it again to break a little more of the 4200/5200 free, work the scraper a little more, repeat as needed.

It's a slow process, but you can do it. Of course, if you've got a lot of adhesive packed in the actual hole you might still be in trouble unless you can get some sort of thin blade between the hole and the light from the inside.

Here's the product at West Marine:
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10001&storeId=11151&partNumber=12222295&langId=-1

Phil S
08-18-2011, 09:45 PM
Thanks for the links to the pics. That's what I was affraid of. My mounting locations for the underwater lights I use about 3 times per summer seem less than intellegent now.:bonk:

http://images2.snapfish.com/232323232%7Ffp539%3B4%3Enu%3D3933%3E%3A98%3E258%3E WSNRCG%3D3434%3B%3B3657349nu0mrj


Nothing wrong with a little bling though....:cool::pimp::yes:

MOP
08-18-2011, 10:17 PM
De Bond is very good but not as good as Skip Sand a new bottom paint prep product, I helped with the removing of windows on a 53 Hatt. The Capt. taught me the trick he picked it up down south. What he did was smooth off and round a 1" scraper, he would heat it slightly then push/rock a continuous groove in all the way around. Slowly dribbling stuff into the groove you could feel it softening, the bottom does take a bit of finesse but all of a sudden it the whole thing starts to move. It was a decent sized salon window out in about 35-45 minutes, with no damage to the finish He and now I have a large syringe, which gives good control dribbling the the Skip Sand in the groove. You can probably use a clean oil can, a few drops at a time on small stuff. A little time/patience you will do fine, you will have to reinforce the transom. Make a decent sized backer and the hole for the wire may be sandwiched not needing much more that a bit of filler. No matter which one you use it is a bit messy, A bunch of cheese cloth or old towels come in handy they pick better than rags.

Phil

blackhawk
08-18-2011, 10:25 PM
Thanks those pics are great, exactly what I was looking for actually.

The lights are right on the stripe. Bottom of the light is on the top of the stripe I should say. This puts them about 5 inches under water at rest and they are out of the water when on plane shining on the wake/rooster tail. They are the ocean LED trailer series so they do not need to be under water at all times.

I'm just pissed at myself for not thinking ahead. The boat runs about 65 so hydraulic is not a must, its just one thing that I would like to add for safety and peace of mind. I can rip off the lights, it actually looks like the ram mount will pretty much cover the hole so that is not a huge concern, however the 4200 used to seal the lights will probably take some gel coat off with it if I were to pull them off.


1) You may be able to get longer rams and go on the outside of your lights.

2) If not, you can mount the rams slightly above centerline, both of my boats that had external steering were mounted this way. The only downfall is you lose turning radius as the drive is trimmed up.

3) If you do have to remove the lights, I've found the best thing to remove anything with 4200/5200 is heat and CONSTANT mild pulling pressure. When removing the K-planes off my Classic on one I tried scrapers, piano wire, chemicals, etc and it took forever. On the second one I used a ratchet strap and heat gun. Hooked the ratchet strap to something secure and snugged it up. Then used the heat gun to get the K-plane good and warm(not hot) and gave the strap a click or two every now and then. After a few minutes the K-plane was off and no gel coat damage. Used heat several times since then.

zelatore
08-18-2011, 10:26 PM
Oh sure, now you tell me. I just got done r/r'ing a full set of salon windows on a 38 Carver...:wink:

blackhawk
08-18-2011, 10:42 PM
Here's a pic on my Blackhawk. As you can see the rams were mounted above centerline. When asking before I bought, I had some people equate it to the sky was falling because they were mounted that high but it worked great. And WPM said it was fine and they did make a mod to the wing plate so the rams would mount on top of the plate. My main concern was how thin the transom was so I had to do some creative engineering for backer plates.

http://www.donzi.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=15086&d=1128006942

kcraig99
08-19-2011, 08:09 AM
Great info guys, very much appreciated. Its good to know I have a shot at getting them off and not effing up the gelcoat. This would be a good winter project when you got nothing but time.

I'm going to have to do some measuring and see if mounting them just a tad high is possible. Diminished turning radius with the drive trimmed up wouldn't be much of an issue I would think.

I got this from CP Performance: http://www.cpperformance.com/Instructions/Transom_Bracket.pdf

Looks like the 9 inch ram may give me an option on the outside of the lights as well.

pipnit
08-19-2011, 12:43 PM
Great info guys, very much appreciated. Its good to know I have a shot at getting them off and not effing up the gelcoat. This would be a good winter project when you got nothing but time.

I'm going to have to do some measuring and see if mounting them just a tad high is possible. Diminished turning radius with the drive trimmed up wouldn't be much of an issue I would think.

I got this from CP Performance: http://www.cpperformance.com/Instructions/Transom_Bracket.pdf

Looks like the 9 inch ram may give me an option on the outside of the lights as well.

I take it these suckers are stuck on with adhesive? This stuff makes goo-be gone look like water:

http://forums.pelicanparts.com/uploads17/31roBEe47mL+_SL500_AA300_1277651809.jpg