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zigman2
03-23-2011, 04:50 PM
I was wondering if i could get some input on how much an omc 460 king cobra hurts resale of a 22 classic versus merc 454 bravo ? thanks for any input

silverghost
03-23-2011, 05:45 PM
It is true that some folks do shy away from almost any OMC outdrive~~~especially since they went under & out of business some years back !
Some of these older OMC drive parts are getting a bit hard to find locally new now !
Many marine mechanics do not know much about them
& possibly won't do any repairs on them . The OMC King Cobra was a good outdrive~~~Possibly OMC's best !
Chevy power has always been more popular in power boating ever since the late 1970s . (Basically when Hollman~Moody, & a few others, stopped building performance Ford marine V-8 engines.
Chevy has since dominated
the marine powerplant industry as base engines used by marining outfits such as Mercruiser & Indmar .
In my opinion the Ford 460 was never intended as a high performance engine.
It's basically just a big truck gasoline engine.
There are just many more great performance & marine bolt-on parts out there in the after-market for the Chevy V-8 powerplants.
Add the Ford 460 engine to an OMC King Cobra Outdrive in a Donzi 22 "Classic"and many diehard performance boaters will pass on buying such a powered Donzi 22 "Classic" .

This limits your potential pool of performance boat buyers.
Thus a lower re-sale price in my opinion .

OFFSHORE GINGER
03-23-2011, 05:47 PM
Hey guy , is that the boat that was purchased in Tawas Mich , and if so could you post some pics of her ~~~~~~~~?

joefitness123
03-23-2011, 05:57 PM
Absolutely correct,alot of potential buyers shy away from the OMC boats for lack of available parts. But on the flip side, you might be able to get a great deal on one of the OMC boats as compared to a Chevy powered boat.But at the end of the day..You would still be buying a 22 Donzi classic. One of the most sought after little boats around..Not to mention, the classic hull design is priceless...OMC or CHEVY powered...Still a Classic ride..

VetteLT193
03-23-2011, 06:37 PM
I was wondering if i could get some input on how much an omc 460 king cobra hurts resale of a 22 classic versus merc 454 bravo ? thanks for any input

Depends on the quality of the boat, but in my experience it's roughly 5 grand less. There are exceptions to the rule but this number seems pretty consistent.

zigman2
03-23-2011, 07:50 PM
the boat i am looking at is in perfect shape ,original owner,always a trailer queen. the omc does not bother me i just want a feeling for resale and were i need to be at to buy it right .
thanks again for any and all input

Tony
03-23-2011, 08:11 PM
No matter your allegiance, most in the know will admit that the King Cobra is way superior to an Alpha and somewhat superior to a Bravo.


:beer:

joefitness123
03-23-2011, 08:21 PM
Tony,

I have to agree with you..I have had 3 22 Classics..2 with the King cobra and 1 with a bravo..The only one that went wrong, was the one with the bravo..But It could have been just a coincidence..

:bonk:

Carl C
03-23-2011, 08:22 PM
No matter your allegiance, most in the know will admit that the King Cobra is way superior to an Alpha and somewhat superior to a Bravo.
:beer:

The King Cobra perhaps but not the Ford 460.

gcarter
03-23-2011, 08:25 PM
I've no personal experience w/BBF's. I've read the biggest problem is high performance exhaust systems.
I know you can buy spacers that allow you to bolt on BBC exhaust to your Ford heads.
You may not be giving up anything.
One of the fastest 22's on this site is Dr. Dan's w/a KC drive.

gcarter
03-23-2011, 08:29 PM
These aren't marine engines, but they're still interesting;

Big Block Enginesclose (http://www.fordracingparts.com/crateengine/main.asp#)

http://www.fordracingparts.com/images/part/tiny/M-6007-521FT.jpghttp://www.fordracingparts.com/images/part/tiny/M-6007-521RT.jpgPart NumberM-6007-521FT* (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=10355)M-6007-521RT* (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=10356)Displacement (cu. In.)521521HP (SAE J607)609 @5750609 @5750Torque (SAE J607)630 lb* ft @4500630 lb* ft @4500HP (SAE 1349 Corrected)580 @5750580 @5750Torque (SAE 1349 Corrected)600 lb* ft @4500600 lb* ft @4500BlockM-6010-A460 (4 Bolt main siamese bore) (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=283)M-6010-A460 (4 Bolt main siamese bore) (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=283)Comp. Ratio10.0:110.0:1HeadsM-6049-SCJB (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=5469)M-6049-SCJB (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=5469)CamshaftMechani cal RollerMechanical RollerPistonsForgedForgedIntakeM-9424-H429 (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=2012)M-9424-H429 (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=2012)DistributorMSD 8580 w/ M-12390-H Bronze gear (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=777)MSD 8580 w/ M-12390-H Bronze gear (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=777)Valve CoverM-6582-C460 (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=4843)M-6582-C460 (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=4843)Oil PanFront T SumpRear T SumpWaterpumpM-8501-C460 (V-Belt style) (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=2493)M-8501-C460 (V-Belt style)) (http://www.fordracingparts.com/parts/part_details.asp?PartKeyField=2493)MSRP

Carl C
03-23-2011, 09:03 PM
One of the fastest 22's on this site is Dr. Dan's w/a KC drive.

And a Mercury Racing HP 500 EFI...........

dsparis
03-24-2011, 09:35 AM
Any part you want for a K/C is available and they are'nt expensive either.

roadtrip se
03-24-2011, 11:08 AM
After running next to Dr. Dan in his OMC Donzi by Chriscraft for several years now, there isn't anything on that boat that would suggest a markdown from a Bravo boat. If anything, the boat is better built in some areas than my newer vintage 2001. He has run the crap out of that KC drive behind a juiced 500EFI and the engine let go, before the drive did!

So it comes down to the condition of the boat and what both parties think it is worth. I would pause at the 460 and evaluate it for condition, but that is about it.

b.guggenmos
03-24-2011, 08:55 PM
Nothing at all wrong with the 460 Ford/King Cobra drive. I don't really aggree with it being a 5K reduction in price. There are plenty of King Cobra's still out there with both Ford and Chevy power. Just because the Bravo is more popular does not mean it is better. Like George said the exhaust choices are not as good but there used to be stainless headers available for the 460. There are plenty of performance parts for a 460 Ford also. JMHO. Brian

CaribouLou
03-24-2011, 08:59 PM
I own a '90 with a KC/460 Combo, and I would do it again in a heartbeat. Don't listen to people who don't know first hand.

VetteLT193
03-24-2011, 10:10 PM
he's not really asking how great they are to own, just value. I'll stick to my original roughly 5 grand less number. I have stayed pretty up on the market in my free time over the last few years and time and time again the 5 grand number rings pretty true on boats that actually sell. In fact, the lowest priced boats even in asking price tend to be OMC boats. There are a few exceptions, but I haven't seen any of the exceptions actually sell.

There are plenty of people here that sing the praises of the OMC KC, but even with that parts are more expensive (both general maintenance and bigger stuff). Trying to find someone who knows how to work on them (in my area, there are NONE). On a pleasure boat you can send stuff out, etc. but it will be a hassle or a toasted weekend if you need a quick part (local places stock basically everything for Merc stuff, but nada for the old OMC boats)

go ahead and take a look at whats out there for sale right now. Stick to nice stuff... there are plenty of Bravo boats for sale between 22-27k that are super nice. a couple blackhawk boats in that range too (one regular one at 22, one LE at 25k) Then there is one really nice Ford / OMC boat for sale... asking $16,500.

I'm not saying they are bad, unreliable, or whatever. just that they are old (20+ years), require maintenance, and the old/easy Merc standby is easier for weekenders... if I'm looking at an OMC boat I am going to want a 'deal' in order to compensate for any future potential hassles... even if it ends up there are none :bonk:

roadtrip se
03-24-2011, 11:46 PM
he's not really asking how great they are to own, just value. I'll stick to my original roughly 5 grand less number. I have stayed pretty up on the market in my free time over the last few years and time and time again the 5 grand number rings pretty true on boats that actually sell. In fact, the lowest priced boats even in asking price tend to be OMC boats. There are a few exceptions, but I haven't seen any of the exceptions actually sell.
There are plenty of people here that sing the praises of the OMC KC, but even with that parts are more expensive (both general maintenance and bigger stuff). Trying to find someone who knows how to work on them (in my area, there are NONE). On a pleasure boat you can send stuff out, etc. but it will be a hassle or a toasted weekend if you need a quick part (local places stock basically everything for Merc stuff, but nada for the old OMC boats)
go ahead and take a look at whats out there for sale right now. Stick to nice stuff... there are plenty of Bravo boats for sale between 22-27k that are super nice. a couple blackhawk boats in that range too (one regular one at 22, one LE at 25k) Then there is one really nice Ford / OMC boat for sale... asking $16,500.
I'm not saying they are bad, unreliable, or whatever. just that they are old (20+ years), require maintenance, and the old/easy Merc standby is easier for weekenders... if I'm looking at an OMC boat I am going to want a 'deal' in order to compensate for any future potential hassles... even if it ends up there are none :bonk:

I will give you the fact that a Bravo boat is going to be the best in terms of servicability. The rest of your arguement? Not so much.
As for one who has tried to find decent Bravo service, this can be a crap shoot, too, depending on where you do your boating.

The KC drives don't break that often at all. So, the testimonials here are relevant to value, especially from those who own them. If they don't break, you don't have to fix them. But if you do, on Lake Cumberland where I do my boating, there are several parts houses that have OMC stuff and work on them regularily.

And you reference, one KC boat and comparable asking prices. As a former broker, this has nothing to do with transaction prices. And one KC boat asking price doesn't hold water, statistically.

Finally, you compare a KC boat to some Blackhawk asking prices. I know for a fact how hard it is to find BH replacement parts. BTW, BH boats are bringing no where near these kind of asking prices, when they finally sell. Then add trying to find obsolete TRS and Volvo replacement parts for drives on boats that sell at premium prices all of the time here.

I stand by the fact that a KC boat is a good value and worth what the rest of the condition of the boat reflects, without a big whack in value due to the KC. A KC boat deserves the love and consideration at a decent price, just like any other Donzi here.

dsparis
03-25-2011, 01:45 AM
I'll take my K/C over a bravo any day. I've got a big 383 in a 18c that I beat on. Mercruiser is all PR.