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View Full Version : Going from 5.0mpi to 383mpi, what can I expect?



Full-throttle
02-18-2011, 10:09 AM
I have a 2006 Classic 18 that came with a 5.0 and a Bravo 1 with a 1.65 drive.
My engine has 52 hours in is in perfect condition. Figuring about $800.00 for the swap and what I can get from my engine, it looks like it will cost about $5000.00 for the upgrade. I want to stay with fuel injection. Any idea what I could expect to gain over the 5.0? I'm trying decide if the extra expense is worth the real world gains. Thanks...

VetteLT193
02-18-2011, 10:26 AM
which 383? If you are talking merc there are a couple flavors with different power. Also, if you are talking the Merc ones I am thinking of, they are Reman engines, not new, so keep that in mind too.

Full-throttle
02-18-2011, 10:31 AM
The engine I am looking at is from NuWave Marine in NJ. It is the remanufactured Mercruiser 6.2 with fuel injection and 350HP. $7800.00
My engine is 260HP.

osur866
02-18-2011, 11:37 AM
You can expect 67-68 box stock, now if you change exhaust and throw a -2 on it and find the right prop, then 72-73 full hyd steering will help as well. But stock bravo 1 with 1.65 gears that combo with a stock 25p m+ will be 67-68 at 5000 rpm. Some will say it's gonna be a 70 mph boat with that combo and on the dream-O-meter it may show 70 but gps it and it will be 67-68, if you want 70 your gonna have to add some other stuff, been there done it!

Steve

tice652
02-18-2011, 11:48 AM
osur866 - I think he will break 70 with this combo. I have a stock 14 year old 350 mag mpi - 300 hp with a bravo and it runs 68.6 gps - either way keep us posted full-throttle im curious about what you'll get.

Full-throttle
02-18-2011, 11:48 AM
Thank you, that gives me a good idea. I haven't even run the boat with the 5.0 to see how it performs with that engine. I just bought the boat and had it delivered to the northeast.

Fishermanjm
02-18-2011, 12:36 PM
where in the northeast?

Full-throttle
02-18-2011, 12:50 PM
The boat is in Connecticut right now. I will be using it around here and also at our summer cottage on Great Pond in the Belgrade lakes area of Maine.

Fishermanjm
02-18-2011, 01:00 PM
i'm on narragansett bay,,,

osur866
02-18-2011, 03:10 PM
Something that raises suspect is a 5.0 infront of a Bravo, sure it's a Bravo? Think if you dropped the 6./ or 383 mag in with the Alpha he'd be a cpl mph faster and as long as he kept it in the water the Alpha should last.

Don't know what a 5.0 in an 18 would do box stock but just guessing would go with 60-61. Either way the 6.2 or 383 mag is a nice set up and with the forged crank is a good candidate for boost later should it not provide ample speed for you, Whipple makes a nice kit for that engine.

Steve

The Hedgehog
02-18-2011, 03:26 PM
I am with OSUR866 on the speed. I have this package in my X-18. I have eeked 70-71 (GPS) or so on that perfect day. That would be cool day with slight chop. It will break 68 every time you drop the hammer. It will NOT break 70 on a hot day, glass, full fuel etc.

osur866
02-18-2011, 03:31 PM
osur866 - I think he will break 70 with this combo. I have a stock 14 year old 350 mag mpi - 300 hp with a bravo and it runs 68.6 gps - either way keep us posted full-throttle im curious about what you'll get.

He asked what he can expect, it has been my experience, over 350 hours behind the wheel of my 06' 18, that in fresh water at 960' 2 people and half tank of fuel he can expect 67-68, like Bill said on fumes on a perfect day low humidity yes he may eek out 70 but it won't happen consistently, just saying!

Will we see ya at AOTH Bill?

Full-throttle
02-18-2011, 03:38 PM
Thanks for all the responses. It is a Bravo 1. I'm not sure why they ordered that combination unless the original owner thought he might upgrade the power at some point. It does make sense that he went with the 1.65 instead of the 1.5 gears for that engine. In terms of seat of the pants, is there an amazing difference if you took a ride in mine, and then hopped in an 18 with a 383?

osur866
02-18-2011, 03:46 PM
Keep the 1.65 gears, will be more challenging to prop but the accelarion will be worth keeping them. I'd say yes, there would be a pretty big difference between a 5.0 Vs a 383mag these 18's stock can get interesting in the upper 60's in the low 60's it's a Sunday afternoon drive! ;) even with a 383 mag hyd steering would be a good consideration

The Hedgehog
02-18-2011, 03:48 PM
He asked what he can expect, it has been my experience, over 350 hours behind the wheel of my 06' 18, that in fresh water at 960' 2 people and half tank of fuel he can expect 67-68, like Bill said on fumes on a perfect day low humidity yes he may eek out 70 but it won't happen consistently, just saying!
Will we see ya at AOTH Bill?

Yes, we will be at AOTH?

You? Any surprises? My friends that went to the LOTO shoot out are still talking about the way you drive an 18. These guys were in OL's and Skaters but were very impressed.

osur866
02-18-2011, 03:55 PM
Yes, we will be at AOTH?
You? Any surprises? My friends that went to the LOTO shoot out are still talking about the way you drive an 18. These guys were in OL's and Skaters but were very impressed.

Yea, I seem to be the only fool out there on Fridays fun/poker run that isn't in a 30-40 somehing, lol!

Suprises? Hmm, I'm sure we will talk before I see ya in KY ;)

Fishermanjm
02-18-2011, 04:04 PM
is the 6.2 the same engine as the 383 mag, i thought the 6.2 is a 377ci engine, or am i wrong?

osur866
02-18-2011, 04:06 PM
is the 6.2 the same engine as the 383 mag, i thought the 6.2 is a 377ci engine, or am i wrong?
Basically yes, the 383 mag is merc's reman 6.2 it's bored .030 over

Fishermanjm
02-18-2011, 04:10 PM
ok forgot it did say it was reman,,, is the latham steering system more responsive??? what is the deal with that

osur866
02-18-2011, 04:18 PM
is the 6.2 the same engine as the 383 mag, i thought the 6.2 is a 377ci engine, or am i wrong?

ok forgot it did say it was reman,,, is the latham steering system more responsive??? what is the deal with that

Simple answer, yes, more stable and more safe, keeps your tail from wagging the dog so to speak!

osur866
02-18-2011, 04:29 PM
Once you have hyd steering you won't wanna ever go back without it

joseph m. hahnl
02-18-2011, 04:50 PM
You can expect to use more Gasoline with more Cubic inches.:boggled:

MOP
02-18-2011, 05:34 PM
Why 350 there are a lot of 400hp 383's available for well under 7K!

Full-throttle
02-18-2011, 05:46 PM
I want to stay with fuel injection and it seemed the remanafactured 6.2 would be pretty much plug and play. Is there anyone else offering the same turn key install and performance as the Mercruiser engines?

Pismo
02-18-2011, 06:59 PM
You have a beautiful boat. Great picture, even from the rear.

Pismo
02-18-2011, 07:00 PM
A 383 is perfect for that boat. A new LSX would be even better if money was no object.

MDonziM
02-18-2011, 07:02 PM
Thanks for all the responses. It is a Bravo 1. I'm not sure why they ordered that combination unless the original owner thought he might upgrade the power at some point. It does make sense that he went with the 1.65 instead of the 1.5 gears for that engine. In terms of seat of the pants, is there an amazing difference if you took a ride in mine, and then hopped in an 18 with a 383?

Nice looking boat, good luck with it.

osur866
02-18-2011, 07:09 PM
Buy the 383 mag run it for a few years put hyd steering on it and when it's time for a rebuild add a lil help from Whipple :)

osur866
02-18-2011, 09:03 PM
A 383 is perfect for that boat. A new LSX would be even better if money was no object.

Have considered this, the LSX as an option for a re-power along with an ILmore 625 also.

Steve

LKSD
02-19-2011, 07:55 AM
Buy the 383 mag run it for a few years put hyd steering on it and when it's time for a rebuild add a lil help from Whipple :)

ousr,
I agree.. Been there done that.. They are absolutely wicked with a 2.3 unit on there.. There is one I did for one of my customers a couple years ago on one of the earlier 383 mags that runs like an animal...


Full-Throttle,

I would just be cautious of some of the places selling engines. If you are looking to sell yours you have to watch on "who's" bob tail you get.. Some of these places strip everything off to offer a low up front price.

The problem is that they end up with an engine that has no exhaust, bell housing, coupler etc..

Thats fine if yours is compatible/usable & you are not planning to offer your take out with those items. However if you were planning to sell your engine as a complete take out it may not work well..

One other thing is yes you may want to run the boat before actually pulling the trigger on an upgrade, but either way the 383 or a 350 will be faster than the 5.0.. Repropping on a 1.65 wont be too terrible with another stock engine upgrade, you will just need to run a little bit of a bigger prop than the 1.50 would have run..

If you are still thinking of an upgrade feel free to give me a shout again, I know we discussed a couple little things last week.. :)

:) Jamie / Lakeside Restorations

BUIZILLA
02-19-2011, 08:20 AM
1.65 drive with a blower isn't necessary... could work against you actually..

LKSD
02-19-2011, 09:17 AM
If he added a blower and ran out of props The drive could be changed, or the gear set can replaced. Not a big deal if you need to do it... ;)

The Hedgehog
02-20-2011, 10:32 AM
Buy the 383 mag run it for a few years put hyd steering on it and when it's time for a rebuild add a lil help from Whipple :)

Good plan. And the steering too. The steering made my X much happier. I would not call it a death trap without it, but much better with.

None of these engines (377 or 383) really burn much more than the 350. The fuel cost difference will be the cheapest part of the whole deal.

mike o
02-23-2011, 04:12 PM
I have the exact same color 02 18C with 320hp 6.2L in NH. Play with yours a bit.:yes: Then come over and drive mine...........:kingme:

osur866
02-23-2011, 08:06 PM
I have the exact same color 02 18C with 320hp 6.2L in NH. Play with yours a bit.:yes: Then come over and drive mine...........:kingme:

Mike , have you been up to no good with yours over the winter months? Lol

Full-throttle
02-24-2011, 08:12 AM
Hi Mike,
That would be great. The other pilot I fly with lives in Sandown, NH. so I will be bringing the boat up that way. I am going to take the advice given and run the boat a year or so before doing the swap. Although, If i ride in yours, that time line may be shortened, LOL...
I have a 19P Rev 4, and a 21P Mirage Plus to try on the boat to see if they will make a difference over the 19P Vengeance thats on there now.
Just had a new starter, impeller, and all the services done so I figure I should stick with this engine for the time being.

mike o
02-24-2011, 08:42 AM
Mike , have you been up to no good with yours over the winter months? LolHa-Ha, I was wondering about what your up 2, since you lead the way with the 18C upgrades. That be, with Foggy defecting :confused::kingme::kingme::kingme: ( temporally) :crossfing:. My 18 is always full of 6th graders, so Im very content to leave it alone at 69mph :wink:. No Stainless Marine exhaust from Santa, even though I was A Good Boy....:nilly:....:kingme: Its all about snowmobiling around northern NH in winter.:yes: Regards, Michael

mike o
02-24-2011, 09:09 AM
Hi Mike,
That would be great. The other pilot I fly with lives in Sandown, NH. so I will be bringing the boat up that way. I am going to take the advice given and run the boat a year or so before doing the swap. Although, If i ride in yours, that time line may be shortened, LOL...
I have a 19P Rev 4, and a 21P Mirage Plus to try on the boat to see if they will make a difference over the 19P Vengeance thats on there now.
Just had a new starter, impeller, and all the services done so I figure I should stick with this engine for the time being.Im on Squam lake 7 miles above Winni so your welcome anytime. I head over to Sebago at least once a summer. Hoping the Long lake - Songo crew plans a get- together, since theres so many donzi's over there. The Winni poker run is the last saturday in July every yr. Ive been sledding around Moosehead this winter. Im going to try to head up that way, I hope........:crossfing: Tim Dorr in Windham Me sells those 383's at his engine shop on 302.......:wink: See ya next summer somewhere.........:yes:

Full-throttle
02-24-2011, 10:30 AM
Mike,
We have an apartment in a hangar in Greenville. My boss has a place on Moosehead over by Socatean Stream. I was just up there for 5 days. Great snowmobiling. We have a cottage on Great Pond(the original Golden Pond) My wife helps delivery the mail by boat during the summer.

mike o
02-24-2011, 10:57 AM
I have a friend with a lodge in Millinockett, and friends with a camp in Dickey in the Alligash. So Im all over Maine in winter. I was in greenville 2 week ago checking out the B-52 crash site. Rode the lake down from NE Cary after going up to the Locomotives between chamberland and eagle lakes, via lake Chesoncook..... Last week I rode on lake umbagog, upper-lower Richardson, Mooselukmugontic and Rangley, lake Osoocahaus, back to Pittsburg NH. Im on the water (be it frozen sometimes) yr rd. My 05 600 skidoo about to turn 18k....:crossfing:.....:kingme:

Ranman
02-24-2011, 03:39 PM
Sorry if I'm redundant, but I have no time to read the prior responses.

I run a 1997 18C with 350MAG MPI Gen+ (300 PSHP) and 1.65:1 Bravo. The boat turns a 25P Mirage Plus a twitch over 5000 RPM @ 68.5 or so.

I would guess that a 260 PSHP 18 would go somewhere around 62-64 and it should turn around a 21-23P three blade prop. A 19P with a 260HP and 1.65 drive sounds low to me and I'm guessing it would be on the rev limiter (remember that you should be turning a bigger prop slower with a 1.65:1 vs. 1.5:1). In other words, your boat will turn a higher pitch prop as compared to a 1.5:1 boat.

Replace that combo with a 383 that makes 350+ HP (nearly 100 more HP) at the propshaft and you'll turn a 25-27P Mirage Plus to 5000 @ somewhere around 72-74 MPH.

For 383's look at the reman'd Merc offerings. That would be rock solid reliable and an easy swap from the 5.0L. One that you could do yourself if you wanted to. I've pulled my 350 at least 3 times before and it's not tough.

The Hedgehog
02-24-2011, 10:34 PM
Sorry if I'm redundant, but I have no time to read the prior responses.

I run a 1997 18C with 350MAG MPI Gen+ (300 PSHP) and 1.65:1 Bravo. The boat turns a 25P Mirage Plus a twitch over 5000 RPM @ 68.5 or so.

I would guess that a 260 PSHP 18 would go somewhere around 62-64 and it should turn around a 21-23P three blade prop. A 19P with a 260HP and 1.65 drive sounds low to me and I'm guessing it would be on the rev limiter (remember that you should be turning a bigger prop slower with a 1.65:1 vs. 1.5:1). In other words, your boat will turn a higher pitch prop as compared to a 1.5:1 boat.

Replace that combo with a 383 that makes 350+ HP (nearly 100 more HP) at the propshaft and you'll turn a 25-27P Mirage Plus to 5000 @ somewhere around 72-74 MPH.

For 383's look at the reman'd Merc offerings. That would be rock solid reliable and an easy swap from the 5.0L. One that you could do yourself if you wanted to. I've pulled my 350 at least 3 times before and it's not tough.

74? Pipe dreams. Maybe with zero humidity, on a 55 degree day, in 80 degree water, in a slight chop with the wind at your back. For a second.

Whitney and I have been pulling pretty much the same numbers with 383's and 377's for quite some time. As a matter of fact, we broke into the 70's at the same time on a cool fall weekend.

Have I bumped 72 on that perfect day? yes, but we are talking about day in and day out real world numbers.

I have that reman 383 mag in mine and Steve has a 377 in his. He has spend a bunch of time dialing it in with a shorty to hit a regular 72.

I don't taunt my driving skills, but Steve.....ask anyone that has ridden with him? I have two friends that took first in class at the LOTO shootout that were blown away with his skills.

osur866
02-24-2011, 10:44 PM
Thanks for the kind words Bill, it's all about where you boat, seat time and your set-up.

You are going to make the pull up this year to LOTO arent you??

Like I said before 72-74 on the dream-o-meter maybe but true GPS not, now if that 383/377 had a Alpha on the back maybe

This thread inspired me to change my avatar, that's the shootout weekend last year on the Skater/poker run.

Steve

The Hedgehog
02-26-2011, 09:19 AM
Thanks for the kind words Bill, it's all about where you boat, seat time and your set-up.
You are going to make the pull up this year to LOTO arent you??
Like I said before 72-74 on the dream-o-meter maybe but true GPS not, now if that 383/377 had a Alpha on the back maybe
This thread inspired me to change my avatar, that's the shootout weekend last year on the Skater/poker run.
Steve

Yes, the plan is to go to LOTO this year:rock: