Guns...a recommendation for home protection…

[dr]

I’m not a gun person in fact I’ve really owned one….my former wife had a couple but we seldom used them...fortunatly...

With that said beginning this Spring I’m going to be spending more time at a little place I have out in the middle of nowhere and want something for protection….there’s only intermittent cell service, closest neighbor is over a mile away, area renown for meth labs, pot patches, you get the picture.

I’m thinking about a shotgun as well as a handgun….any and all recommendations will be appreciated….if it’s any consideration I’m a big boy…..Local(knoxville) vs gunshow/nationwide, big box vs. small shop…new vs used....typically as a consumer I buy on price; is that smart…information on ammunition and or any good (concise) websites would be appreciated as well..

I’ll probably only have them in the house and possibly on the boat…would a carry permit be needed there?


Again, thanks…
David

[vrod02]

by from a local shop used, 12 ga.shotgun pump pistol grip. I'm a revolver guy so 357 mag. practice with 38's . Forget a lic. its your 2nd amend. right. I keep my guns fully loaded, chambered, safety off!! Only way to have them.

[Rumblefish]

by from a local shop used, 12 ga.shotgun pump pistol grip. I'm a revolver guy so 357 mag. practice with 38's . Forget a lic. its your 2nd amend. right. I keep my guns fully loaded, chambered, safety off!! Only way to have them.

Its 3am.. your asleep.. you hear a noise.. and in a woooozy state of dream you spring up to focus your hearing on a person whom is creaking the floors below as they come inside your home....

You will never hit a thing with a hand gun in the dark in this state of mind. (unless your a navy seal)

Shot Gun for the home is the only way!.. Sure youll take out most the artwork in the hall way, and a few chairs but odds are you leave a mark...

[RedDog]

to carry a loaded weapon away from home you will need a permit in TN. On the water, the laws get confusing - study up. Most of the lakes are TVA / Corp of Engineers including the ramps, i.e. Federal jurisdiction.

Get a permit. Takes 8 hours on a Saturday and some time chasing beuracatic crap such as fingerprinting, shuffleing forms, etc.

The previous poster is out of line saying forget a lic (sic, permit).

Violations of the gun laws will result in a felony conviction - meaning possible jail time, forfeture on gun ownership, loss of voting rights

excuse the spelling please - on google tv web app and no spell check - I'm an engineer, not an English major

[RedDog]

ditto on the shotgun recommendation - I don't follow it but then I have 30 rounds of 223 ready to go in my AR and a 1911 45 and another 40 cal auto under the mattras

Being new to guns, I can't stress enough the importance of practice at a range or farm to get really familar with the operation of any weapon you have.

[The Hedgehog]

ditto on the shotgun recommendation - I don't follow it but then I have 30 rounds of 223 ready to go in my AR and a 1911 45 and another 40 cal auto under the mattras
Being new to guns, I can't stress enough the importance of practice at a range or farm to get really familar with the operation of any weapon you have.

Good recommendations.

I would like to know more about the waterway thing. Got 357 in Roamer. Is the Roamer a house? Where can I go to find out?

[vrod02]

Well I dissagree with the engineer from my hometown. Why would I give the government my "permission" , location, fingerprints to carry a gun in my home or boat to protect me from them? just be careful with alchol, thats the biggest issue. gun possession while intoxicated is bad.

[zelatore]

I'll throw my vote in for a shotgun as well. My home protection gun is a short barreled Mosburg 500 pump 12 gauge. It's a fairly cheap gun that you can get almost anywhere (probably even WalMart). I have a pistol grip, but don't have it mounted.

I chose a pump gun over a semi-auto on the theory that the best defense gun should never have to be fired. I figure even the stupidest criminal should know what a shotgun sounds like when it's racked and will hopefully take that as his cue to leave without instigating a confrontation.

Handguns are great for carrying and offer easy maneuverability in tight confines, but you're VERY unlikely to actually hit anything. I forget the numbers, but even trained police have an incredibly low hit ratio to shots fired. How well do you expect an average Joe would do?

Rifles are for hunting. Next to useless for close-range home defense. Long and cumbersome.

Both rifles and handguns also suffer from over penetration concerns. Any high velocity round will punch right through the side of your house and carry on. And on. And on. Being in the country you may not have any neighbors, but at the very least consider the consequences of shooting through a wall or two (just how effective do you think drywalled interior walls would be at stopping something like a .357?) and hitting a family member on the other side of the house.

One last thing, if you're wife will be using it she may find the kick of a 12 gauge a bit much. Don't shy away from a 20 gauge. Better she actually uses the thing and gets accustomed to it than getting the bigger gun that she's scared of.

Get a shotgun, and then spend a lot of time putting shells through it. Best choice, hands down.

Google shotgun self defense. You'll find no shortage of information on the topic.

[BobinCovington]

I say a simple Mossberg shotgun is a good choice. Even a 20 gauge is a good size and weight, easy to shoot gun, low recoil/muzzle flash. You need to get some practice with it, learn gun safety and pattern it so you know what to expect. Maybe even mount a light on the end so you can see who you are facing in a dark hallway.
I would also read up on your gun laws and know what is considered self protection and what is not. I'm not sure if you need a permit for a shotgun, but check into to it and follow the laws. And store it in a way to keep it away from kids.

[mrfixxall]

+++ shotgun,,a over and under i think would be ideal,leave 2 in the chambers under the bed and when your ready to rock and roll just close it and your ready..no safety to mess with,,second choice would be a .38 with buck shot shells,again no safety to deal with,just make sure you have one of those crown royal bags handy full of ammo for a quick reload..

[Ghost]

I’m not a gun person in fact I’ve really owned one….my former wife had a couple but we seldom used them...fortunatly...

With that said beginning this Spring I’m going to be spending more time at a little place I have out in the middle of nowhere and want something for protection….there’s only intermittent cell service, closest neighbor is over a mile away, area renown for meth labs, pot patches, you get the picture.

I’m thinking about a shotgun as well as a handgun….any and all recommendations will be appreciated….if it’s any consideration I’m a big boy…..Local(knoxville) vs gunshow/nationwide, big box vs. small shop…new vs used....typically as a consumer I buy on price; is that smart…information on ammunition and or any good (concise) websites would be appreciated as well..

I’ll probably only have them in the house and possibly on the boat…would a carry permit be needed there?


Again, thanks…
David

Given what you describe, In order of priority, I think you'll want:

0. some GOOD means to hide them or a safe to lock them up or BOTH, as it sounds like you will be absent from the property a lot of the time. Unless you are bringing them all with you each time you visit, you want them not stolen when you arrive.

1. pistol with a holster you can carry on your own land (at least) as you are out walking/working/whatever if you choose to. A gun in the house won't help you if you run into trouble outside and a long gun will be too big and in your way for many things. I like Fixx's idea about shotshells for the pistol.

2. 12-gauge shotgun. If it is for home defense,I'd recommend a semiauto/pump with at least 5 rounds, more if you can. A two-shot double-barrel is not enough shots for home defense in my view, no offense to Fixx, who is probably a better shot than I am. :) Though I would agree that if you do have an over/under double barrel, it's GREAT for reliability and simplicity. Easy to know what you have in it. Easy to keep it cracked open, and then shut each night, ready to go. But if you're using it for home defense out in the sticks, two shots may not be enough and reloading in a life-or-death situation in the dark is a test no one wants to have to pass.

3. rifle. Something with a LOT more range than the first two. Probably around 30 caliber. 30-06, .308, 30-30 something very common like that. Maybe scoped, a common deer rifle. This would almost never be for self-defense at night, so think long range with good vision. No worries about flash. Anything at night will be close range, pistol/shotgun.

4. As has been noted, set aside time to practice. If you haven't had some jams while practicing, it's not enough.

[John C in PA]

Here are my recommendations and comments:
handgun: buy a Ruger SP101 revolver with the 3" barrel and chambered in .357 magnum. Its stainless so it won't rust, the 3" barrel is better for accuracy, and being a revolver if you have a misfire you just pull the trigger again. And its built like a brick ****house!
handgun ammo: buy .38 Special target loads for practice and full power .357 hollow points for carry ammo. Fire a box of the .357 to give you an idea of the muzzle blast and to sight in the gun. NEVER carry handloaded ammo.
shotgun: about the best and most reliable is a Remington 12 ga. pump action Model 870 in the black (I hate the word "tactical") finish. The barrel is 18.5" and easy to swing. The action is smooth and the stock is polymer so it won't tend to split if wet. Make sure you remove the plug that restricts the number of rounds for waterflow hunting.
shotgun ammo: you can practice with Walmart cheapo ammo. Buy the lowest velocity they sell so it won't beat you up. For home defense, buy 12 ga. 00 Buck "low recoil" self defense ammo as the powder selected has a power curve that won't beat your shoulder up.
I DON'T recommend that you buy a pistol grip shotgun. Unless you practice with a SWAT team its way too difficult to hold the shotgun steady at the back end. At home defense range the shot spread isn't that wide so you don't want to handicap yourself.
I DON'T recommend using any high velocity rifle round for in-home use as the muzzle blast will disorient you. Outside the home .223 is fine. Buy a Vortex flash suppressor to really minimize muzzle flash.
be 100% legal. If you get caught its a felony and you will have to forfeit your guns and gun rights permanently. A good gunshop should help here. You will have to research carry laws on the water as they probably vary depending who is responsible for the water (private, state, local, Corps of Engrs).
PRACTICE, PRACTICE, PRACTICE.
John C

[mrfixxall]

Dont forget to teach the wife too:yes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bpFDHO-tqUY&feature=fvw

[jstrahn]

One more person on the shotgun bandwagon. Mossberg makes a home defense model that has an 8 shell capacity. Inexpensive and configurable.

[Phil S]

All good info...nearly every post mentions practice though, which is great advice.

See if there's a shooting range / gun shop in your area. Most will let you try out any gun you like for a small fee and the cost of the ammo (obviously, in hopes you will buy from them.) It's a great way to try a lot of different guns. I'm a 357 fan for a handgun personally. Keep in practice with whatever you decide on though.

With kind regards,
Phil S.

[BobinCovington]

I am learning a few things after reading this...

A good shotgun is a great solution for home defense

Practice and Gun Safety are everything

A lot of Donzi owners are willing to give some good advice

If you are a criminal type, don't break into a Donzi owners house or try to steal their boat, judging by this thread, they all have shotguns or pistols and are ready to take care of business. :wink:

[Conquistador_del_mar]

Some good advice here. As mentioned, a pump shotgun will have both deterrent capabilities with the sound of the action and it has a capability of 5 rounds typically - Mossberg's 500 with the short barrel is cheap, but very reliable. Another very popular home defense gun is the Taurus Judge which holds 5 rounds of 410 shotgun shells or 45 colt bullets. You can chamber in any order or all the same. When it came out a few years ago, they were hard to find since so many people were buying them - easy to find now. As also mentioned, practice shooting if you get a gun so you don't have to learn under adverse circumstances. Bill

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mossberg_500

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taurus_Judge

[Just Say N20]

All great advice.

Practice, practice, practice.

Revolvers don't jam.

And if I could add a couple more things, find a place (most likely on some rural property) you can shoot your weapon, and touch off a round or two WITHOUT hearing protection. You need to know how L-O-U-D it really is. And it will be louder when fired inside.

All your practicing will be done with ear and eye protection on. This will not be the case if you need to use a weapon for self defense, whether at home or elsewhere if you are legally carrying.

The other thing is to have an absolute attitude that should things escalate to the point where it is going to get ugly, you must believe that no matter what happens to you, you are going to win. You have to acknowledge mentally that you could be physically harmed, or even shot, but you have to have the attitude to overcome no matter what. Can you fire your weapon with one hand, especially if it is your non-dominant hand?

Sorry to sound like this, but there is so much more to self/home defense. Read up so you will be prepared. You need to know how big a distance between you and an adversary is "safe."

When I took the Michigan concealed carry class, the instructor asked how far away someone had to be, for us to be safe. Most people said between 5' and 10'.

To make the point, he had each of us perform the following exercise. We were to stand facing a target (8.5" x 11" piece of paper, which is about the same size as the human torso hit zone) with our gun in our hand, aiming at the ground about 5' in front of us. We were about 15' from the target. The second instructor was going to stand next to us, with his hand on our shoulder.

When he lifted his hand, he would begin running away from us, off to the side. The moment he lifted his hand off our shoulder, we were to raise the gun and fire (2) shots at the target. When we fired the first shot, he was going to drop a set of keys, and when we fired the second shot he was going to stop.

This was a crazy situation to start with because it was skewed heavily in favor of us. We already had the gun in our hand, and we knew in advance what was going to happen. You will never be even close to that prepared in a real situation. It was also very eye opening. I was the 2nd fastest person to get the shots off. When I shot my first shot, he was 17' away. He was 21' away when I got the second shot off. And I only hit the target once. Most people hit the ground before the wall the target was on.

So for me, my "safe" zone was at least 21' because that was the amount of ground an attacker could cover before I could simply raise a weapon I already had in my hand and fire an accurate shot. Add the adrenalin in your system during an actual attack and you will be in worse shape. We were told in a high adrenalin situation you loose up to half of your fine motor skill ability.

Because I have a gift for stating the obvious, this isn't just an, "I have a weapon so I'm safe" situation.

And you have to practice. A LOT.

[BUIZILLA]

that Taurus Public Defender with .410 5 shot is pretty cool

[cutwater]

Well I dissagree with the engineer from my hometown. Why would I give the government my "permission" , location, fingerprints to carry a gun in my home or boat to protect me from them? just be careful with alchol, thats the biggest issue. gun possession while intoxicated is bad.


by from a local shop used, 12 ga.shotgun pump pistol grip. I'm a revolver guy so 357 mag. practice with 38's . Forget a lic. its your 2nd amend. right. I keep my guns fully loaded, chambered, safety off!! Only way to have them.

With all due respect, that's possibly the worst advice I've ever heard... You're advising him to commit a weapons felony?

I took the carry class in Knoxville. You can either do two weeknights or one Saturday. Eight hours of class is well worth avoiding (1) never being able to own a firearm again (2) never voting again (3) trouble finding work for the rest of your life (4) let's say it together, "JAIL TIME"!

[cutwater]

Also, I love silky-smooth Colt revolvers, the AR platform, and long range bolt actions. But let's be honest... A high capacity 12 GA pump and a Glock 23 (or similar semi-auto) is probably the best and most inexpensive way to protect yourself in the event of a home invasion.

Boring? Yes. But extremely effective.

[JeffH]

AND PLEASE, SAFETY 101... SAFETY ON AT ALL TIMES... until target acquired and ready to fire...

[Fishermanjm]

im not sure about carring one on the boat,,,,, the coast guard might have something to say about that,,, just make sure you can handle whatever you settle on purching practice makes perfect,,,

[Ghost]

SAFETY ON AT ALL TIMES... until target acquired and ready to fire...

I will respectfully disagree with this. It's absolutely not what the police who instructed me said, anyway. At the useful range of a pistol (the threat will be CLOSE), after being woken up in the middle of the night, I think the last thing you need is to remember, and be able, and take the time, to take the safety off. If you practice SO MUCH that you do this in your sleep in a split second, I suppose it may be different. But I think there is definitely a different school of thought here.

In fact, a lot of guns are deliberately designed without a safety.

[Ghost]

I think Vrod's point is about the decision analysis between dead and doing something technically illegal. Or, to frame it more accurately, the risk of being dead versus the risk of being arrested/convicted.

I would ask that people consider that the probabilistic math on that choice is perhaps not as cut and dried as some who have criticized his position might think.

[cutwater]

I think Vrod's point is about the decision analysis between dead and doing something technically illegal.

I would ask that people consider that the probabilistic math on that choice is perhaps not as cut and dried as some who have criticized his position might think.

If he's talking about carrying illegally for the 4 to 6 weeks between now and when his carry permit arrives, sure. Go for it. But if he's talking about deliberately not getting the permit for the remainder of his lifetime just because he doesn't want to take an 8-hour class... it's a no-brainer.

I just re-read Vrod's post, and I still think it sounds more indignant than practical... Pretty sure he's talking about the latter.

[Ranman]

Lots of good info here...

Here's an interesting choice. Probably on the exterme end for home defense, but check out this almost released offering from Kel-Tec. This looks to me like the ultimate home defence shotgun.

14+1 rounds of semi automatic 12 gauge shells in a 26" Overall length for around $800.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/news/preview-kel-tec-shotgun-ksg

[Ghost]

If he's talking about carrying illegally for the 4 to 6 weeks between now and when his carry permit arrives, sure. Go for it. But if he's talking about deliberately not getting the permit for the remainder of his lifetime just because he doesn't want to take an 8-hour class... it's a no-brainer.

I just re-read Vrod's post, and I still think it sounds more indignant than practical... Pretty sure he's talking about the latter.

Agreed, except the last part. While I can see why Vrod's tone could come off as you describe, I don't think that was really what was intended, which is why I posted. My sense was that Vrod's tone had more to do with disgust at historical 2nd amendment abuses than it was suggesting "don't bother to take a course and don't bother getting a permit that you can get." (It's an even more interesting question in states like mine where virtually no one CAN get a carry permit of any sort.)

Regards,

Mike

[Rootsy]

Each of the 50 states have their own ownership / carry / storage / use laws and on top of that are the Federal laws.

Intrastate possession, carry, use, etc is pretty easy to decipher and adhere to. Interstate gets more tedious as you must comply with the visiting states laws.

Take Michigan for example. Open carry without any form of permit is perfectly legal, except for spelled out CEZs. Concealed carry is only allowable to the ordinary citizen via shall issue permit (after completing a course and paying the piper). The CPL comes with it's own set of reduced CEZs. Then there is the loophole in the law that elminates all CEZs in the state (not Federal ones though) for CPL holders if a CPL holder open carries. Anyone may also conceal carry on their own property.

Transport laws are very specific. A CPL holder may remain locked and loaded and keep the gun holstered, in a compartment, on the seat, on the dash, whatever. A non CPL holder must unload and case a handgun and store out of reach of occupants. If the vehicle has a trunk it must go in there. No one can carry loaded long guns in vehicle.

Now for a non resident, in order to bring a handgun into the state (not passing through on travel) and carry it, they must possess a CPL from their home state that is recognized by Michigan. Otherwise you may only bring long guns into the state. They must obey all Michigan firearm laws.

Michigan also has a zero tolerance policy on alcohol and firearm use and possession outside of your own home. .02 is it... Watch swigging the cough medicine and carrying...

What I am getting at is regardless of political belief, opinion, etc one should fully educate themselves about the governing laws of where they wish to purchase, store, carry or use the weapon.

That said... A shotgun with the shortest, legal length barrel is a very good choice for home defense. 00 or 000 Buckshot is a good choice of load. In an adrenaline flowing situation you won't even notice recoil. A light may be a nice addition. LASER - eh... not my thing and I've never felt a need for one. My Ithaca Mod 87 with the smooth bore slug barrel is my choice for home defense.

Handgun? Whatever fits you and you can handle and shoot well. A good quality gun in a sufficient chambering is a must and most of the main stream manufacturers have no issue providing such. The last thing you want to occur is a FTF, FTE or a stovepipe in a self defense situation. Practice regularly with it and shoot your self defense ammunition (though it is pricey) so that you know if the gun will run it flawlessly or not. My S&W M&P 40c is both my carry gun as well as my head board bump in the night weapon. You can accessorize as you see fit - light, night sites, LASER, so on and so forth...

JMHO....

[cutwater]

Mike,

Gotcha. Yeah, in TN the permit is EASY EASY EASY to get... Actually probably too easy considering how some of the people in my class handled and shot a gun :nilly:

I agree with the 2nd Am sentiment. But like I said, in my state they will basically give you the permit if you don't have any felonies on your record, so it's essentially as non-discriminatory as the 2nd amendment. (The principle still chaps me, though :) )

[JeffH]

The second post states that he keeps the gun loaded and OFF safety at all times. Careless and dangerous!

I am quite sure that is not the safest way to store a weapon... I was just making the point ON SAFE UNTIL READY TO FIRE!

If that means taking it off safe 10 seconds, or whatever, prior to firing fine. But loaded guns are the ones that kill... and those that are thought to be unloaded or on safe kill the most! I unfortunatley know this 1st hand. Widow and kids still here in Texas wondering "how it happened"

Stay Safe!

Jeff

[MOP]

I have two rifles and a 20ga shot gun! That being said I recently attended a seminar given by local LAW boys here on this very same subject, An interesting point that was brought up was the most important thing to have by your bed side was your car keys not your gun. That brought quite a roar of laughter, one guy even said what stick them up the intruders butt!!! They said it takes a "Split Second" to push the panic button on your keys, this will distract the intruder giving an extra moment to gather yourself, remember the intruder will be out of his element you will gain the upper hand and more than likely not have to pull the trigger as he will haul AZZ! My car keys have not left my bed side since! I also I picked up a Ryobi motion detecting alarm, not much bigger than the palm of your hand if you are close to it when it goers off you will wet your drawers. Under $40 I would recommend it for anyone!!! Save your ammunition!!!!

http://www.ryobitools.com/catalog/tek4/security/RP4300

A quick edit the shot guns barrel has been shortened 18-1/4" and has 00 buck in it in case I encounter a real hard azz!

[BobinCovington]

If we are on the subject of protecting your home and family...yes guns are an effective means, but with a potentially violent and permanent outcome. But being surprised greatly reduces your effectiveness (and your ability to use the firearm with intelligence and safety).

Having an alarm that chimes if a door or window is opened in the middle of the night takes the surprise element out of the equation. Most alarms have a chime function and there is a simple product called a voice alert that has 5 or 6 channels with wireless sensors that can be placed anywhere (side yard, back porch, stairs).

You will be awake and have your senses in much better condition and know the status. You can set it up where you will hear if someone is standing by your back door trying to break in, before they are ever in your house. You still need to make the absolute right call when faced with an unknown person on whether to pull that trigger, but better that you are not groggy in a life threatening situation.

One other note, your family will need to know that you have this installed. Nothing like a teenager coming in late at night and unannounced to turn into a potentially horrible outcome.

Be safe, be smart, be right

[The Hedgehog]

Lots of good info here...

Here's an interesting choice. Probably on the exterme end for home defense, but check out this almost released offering from Kel-Tec. This looks to me like the ultimate home defence shotgun.

14+1 rounds of semi automatic 12 gauge shells in a 26" Overall length for around $800.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/news/preview-kel-tec-shotgun-ksg

I really like that for home defense. Chances of taking out an intruder with that vs my 357 are MUCH better.

[jstrahn]

The car keys are a good point.

I would also advise having a phone within immediate reach. Call 911 immediately. Even if you just put the phone down after you dial, they'll be on the way within minutes.

[dsparis]

Home protection kit

[Rumblefish]

Home protection kit

Was that shot from the evidence Technitions i-phone .. Nice arsenal!

[dr]

Thanks to everyone for the advice/information….it reminds me a lot of Chinese food in that there’s just too many choices, however I ‘think’ I see some common threads….for those in Knoxville (Reddog/Tim)…are there rural/wilderness areas where shooting is allowed… years ago I recall an area near the marina in Lenoir City or the Norris watershed or Royal Blue…also any particular commercial ranges you’d recommend…again…thanks…

[BUIZILLA]

I tried my GM and Acura keys and neither activated the panic alarm on the vehicles from the bedroom area

[vrod02]

With all due respect, that's possibly the worst advice I've ever heard... You're advising him to commit a weapons felony?

I took the carry class in Knoxville. You can either do two weeknights or one Saturday. Eight hours of class is well worth avoiding (1) never being able to own a firearm again (2) never voting again (3) trouble finding work for the rest of your life (4) let's say it together, "JAIL TIME"!

Wrongo ! reread, again, knoxville just happens to be are home turf. YOU DO NOT NEED a carry permit in your house or boat! You guys are worse than the liberals we are fighting.:wrench:

[vrod02]

Once again I re-read the WHOLE thread. Home and Boat has nothing to do with conceal. I'm on target , look at the original ? dorks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

P.s. Jeff H needs protection! Not a gun, someone willing to hold a gun and protect his sorry arse!

[OFFSHORE GINGER]

Lots of good info here...

Here's an interesting choice. Probably on the exterme end for home defense, but check out this almost released offering from Kel-Tec. This looks to me like the ultimate home defence shotgun.

14+1 rounds of semi automatic 12 gauge shells in a 26" Overall length for around $800.

http://www.keltecweapons.com/news/preview-kel-tec-shotgun-ksg I am sold along with a lazer site and to tell you the truth i will be ordering one next week !!!!!!!! For real .

[Phil S]

I’m not a gun person in fact I’ve really owned one….my former wife had a couple but we seldom used them...fortunatly...
With that said beginning this Spring I’m going to be spending more time at a little place I have out in the middle of nowhere and want something for protection….there’s only intermittent cell service, closest neighbor is over a mile away, area renown for meth labs, pot patches, you get the picture.
I’m thinking about a shotgun as well as a handgun….any and all recommendations will be appreciated….if it’s any consideration I’m a big boy…..Local(knoxville) vs gunshow/nationwide, big box vs. small shop…new vs used....typically as a consumer I buy on price; is that smart…information on ammunition and or any good (concise) websites would be appreciated as well..
I’ll probably only have them in the house and possibly on the boat…would a carry permit be needed there?
Again, thanks…
David


Check with your local law enforcement agency about carry permits etc. Better to be safe than sorry on that subject 2nd Amendment or not. Used vs. new ? Your choice and preference, but most well-known brands of guns will last for years with use and cleaning...ie.,...don't feel compelled to buy new. You've obviously read a lot of different "schools of thought" on this thread, and I'm sure there are plenty more. Do try to find a place you can try out several guns before you buy one though...then practice with it a lot.

With kind regards,
Phil S.

[dsparis]

VROD, I got your back

[dsparis]

Screw the batf my familys life is more important.

[Phil S]

BATF should be a Convenience Store...not a government agency..

[JeffH]

Vrod... haha, It's careless, unsafe, John Wayne types like you that give the anti gun people ammunition to shut us down.

Try walking through my door unannounced. You won't make it past the threshold...

I don't need protecting... you do from yourself:eek:

You obviously didn't read my post.. careless gun handling kills people. I know this as a friend on mine was careless and killed himself, in front of his 7 year old son and wife, on a ranch here in Texas... His poor dad sold the 20,000 acres the following month, and blames himself still.

If y'all want to keep your guns loaded and ON FIRE at all times, you get deserve any calamity that comes your way.

Geezzzz... how about a little common sense dude!

[Ranman]

I am sold along with a lazer site and to tell you the truth i will be ordering one next week !!!!!!!! For real .


It's a pretty wicked setup I think. 18" barrel. Two tubes feeding 7 x 12 gauge shells per side. No pump, semi-automatic. That thing coiuld do some work in short order.

Best to order now before they get banned...

[dr]

Wrongo ! reread, again, knoxville just happens to be are home turf. YOU DO NOT NEED a carry permit in your house or boat! You guys are worse than the liberals we are fighting.:wrench:


Well not that it's pertinent but I’m a liberal…or a progressive, or something like that…even better I think I’m a well reasoned and have the ability for critical thinking…as many ‘conservatives’ do….it’s the zealots (conservative and liberal) that concern me…

[cutwater]

Wrongo ! reread, again, knoxville just happens to be are home turf. YOU DO NOT NEED a carry permit in your house or boat! You guys are worse than the liberals we are fighting.:wrench:

In many states, (INCLUDING TN, apparently) you do indeed need a carry license to carry a loaded handgun on a boat or in a car. It is different from keeping a gun in your house. Check the law. On most lakes in TN (Eng. Corp, TVA, etc.) it is up to them whether it is legal to carry on the waterway or even have a loaded gun in your car at the ramp, however they generally won't make an issue of it if you have a carry permit.


Once again I re-read the WHOLE thread. Home and Boat has nothing to do with conceal. I'm on target , look at the original ? dorks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

P.s. Jeff H needs protection! Not a gun, someone willing to hold a gun and protect his sorry arse!

P.P.S. - IIRC, no one called you any names, so don't start the middle school antics unnecessarily. And I sincerely doubt you'd want to meet Jeff in his hallway in the middle of the night...

[cutwater]

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n68/ggunshop/twraletter.jpg

[John C in PA]

http://i109.photobucket.com/albums/n68/ggunshop/twraletter.jpg

Good reply cutwater. In PA, for instance, at Corps of Engineers lakes no LOADED guns are permitted on the property while State run lakes allow firearms if you have a carry permit or are hunting. Google is always your friend!

John C

[Fishermanjm]

"Our houses are protected by the good lord an a gun,,, u might meet them both if u show up here unwelcomed son" i think thats Josh Thompson i live by that lyric anyone else???

[cutwater]

It's a pretty wicked setup I think. 18" barrel. Two tubes feeding 7 x 12 gauge shells per side. No pump, semi-automatic. That thing coiuld do some work in short order.

I thought the same thing when I first saw the ad, but I *think* it's a pump... Maybe I'm wrong. Let me know what you think. Either way, it's pretty wicked :cool: :wink:

[Ranman]

I thought the same thing when I first saw the ad, but I *think* it's a pump... Maybe I'm wrong. Let me know what you think. Either way, it's pretty wicked :cool: :wink:

You pump it the first time to chamber a shell and/or cock it then it's all semi-auto through one tube. flip the switch pump once then bang 7 more times.

So its pump --> seven to eight bangs ---> pump ---> seven bangs ---> done

The website says "The feed side is manually selected by a lever located behind the trigger guard. The lever can be positioned in the center detent in order to easily clear the chamber without feeding another round from either magazine." I take that to mean that if the lever is selected to one of the two sides, another round, if available, will be fed from the magazine to the chamber al la semi-auto.

[roadtrip se]

You pump it the first time to chamber a shell and/or cock it then it's all semi-auto through one tube. flip the switch pump once then bang 7 more times.

So its pump --> seven to eight bangs ---> pump ---> seven bangs ---> done

The website says "The feed side is manually selected by a lever located behind the trigger guard. The lever can be positioned in the center detent in order to easily clear the chamber without feeding another round from either magazine." I take that to mean that if the lever is selected to one of the two sides, another round, if available, will be fed from the magazine to the chamber al la semi-auto.

I grew up with a Remington 870 pump and 1100 semi. Used the 870 for sky-blasting in the marshes and the 1100 for field trial gunning. The 870 never, ever jammed. The 1100 loved to jam, usually when I was trying to down a pheasant in front of 200 people.

Simpler the better. I would stick with the single pump. Seven shells should get the job done, should you need it. Good topic, as I have a been thinking on this for a long time, due to the remote areas we spend our time in. I'm thinking Remington 870 Express Tactical to stick with something I know well. Not a fan of pistols.

[Carl C]

.......German Shepherds.....

[hardcrab]

One size fits all around the house;

Taurus Judge.
Shoots .45 cowboy rounds or .410 shotgun shells.

Lots of choice in stopping power in one device.
Get the 3" chamber so you don't have to worry about the shell length.

[BobinCovington]

DR...Hopefully we helped with your decision. This subject is always a "heated" topic whenever it is brought up, but you have some knowledgeable people to help a little

Main things to think about are...



Keep it simple and choose reliable over fancy (pump shotgun with a light is a great rig for the house)
Get some training, take a class, Practice with it and learn gun safety
Treat ALL guns as if they are loaded (even if you "know" they are not)
Test fire some rounds at different distances to see what different loads will do and what size the pattern is. (Remember that you are responsible for all of those buckshot bb's so know what is behind your target)
Keep it out of reach of untrained family members or kids


Now, I am going to check and see if there is a different thread on Right-to-life, Obama vs Sarah Palin or legalizing Marijuana...:bonk:(disclaimer- not a political view, just humor)

[RedDog]

Thanks to everyone for the advice/information….it reminds me a lot of Chinese food in that there’s just too many choices, however I ‘think’ I see some common threads….for those in Knoxville (Reddog/Tim)…are there rural/wilderness areas where shooting is allowed… years ago I recall an area near the marina in Lenoir City or the Norris watershed or Royal Blue…also any particular commercial ranges you’d recommend…again…thanks…

John Sevier Rifle Range on Rifle Range Road - in Halls. $5.00 to shoot. Google it for the hours

[RedDog]

Thanks to everyone for the advice/information….it reminds me a lot of Chinese food in that there’s just too many choices, however I ‘think’ I see some common threads….for those in Knoxville (Reddog/Tim)…are there rural/wilderness areas where shooting is allowed… years ago I recall an area near the marina in Lenoir City or the Norris watershed or Royal Blue…also any particular commercial ranges you’d recommend…again…thanks…

PM me - I'll meet you at the range and we will try several. Start with a 22 revolver and work up through several larger calibers - 22, 32, 380, 38, 357, 40, 45. I'll bring the AR-15 and a shotgun too.

Been wanting to get to the range to try my new air rifle. Been shooting it in the yard but want to see what it will do at longer distances. Remington Nitro - pretty awesome air rifle

[zelatore]

PM me - I'll meet you at the range and we will try several. Start with a 22 revolver and work up through several larger calibers - 22, 32, 380, 38, 357, 40, 45. I'll bring the AR-15 and a shotgun too.

Been wanting to get to the range to try my new air rifle. Been shooting it in the yard but want to see what it will do at longer distances. Remington Nitro - pretty awesome air rifle

Geez man, you've got all those calibers in your personal collection? The only other guy I know that into collecting is my father in law who's got stuff stashed at his house, his sister's house, his mother's house...

BTW, what caliber is the air rifle? A few years ago I bought a .177 Beeman to play with in the back yard and for some annoying pest birds. Silent shooting can be your friend! Before that I had no idea how cool air rifles could be, having only messed with walmart-level Daisys and Crossmans as a kid. Only drawback to it is it's so hard to cock Michele can barely do it, and it's about twice the weight of our little CZ .22 rifle!

[Conquistador_del_mar]

Geez man, you've got all those calibers in your personal collection? The only other guy I know that into collecting is my father in law who's got stuff stashed at his house, his sister's house, his mother's house...

BTW, what caliber is the air rifle? A few years ago I bought a .177 Beeman to play with in the back yard and for some annoying pest birds. Silent shooting can be your friend! Before that I had no idea how cool air rifles could be, having only messed with walmart-level Daisys and Crossmans as a kid. Only drawback to it is it's so hard to cock Michele can barely do it, and it's about twice the weight of our little CZ .22 rifle!

Take out the 38 and 40, but add a 22 magnum, 22 hornet, 9mms, 44 magnum, and 454 Casull and that is where I am with my pistols - I must have a problem - lol. I just like guns and shooting (target).
I still have my old .177 Crossman air rifle from when I was a kid and it still works after 40+ years and tons of lead through it - :yes:. Bill

[RedDog]

Geez man, you've got all those calibers in your personal collection? The only other guy I know that into collecting is my father in law who's got stuff stashed at his house, his sister's house, his mother's house...
BTW, what caliber is the air rifle? A few years ago I bought a .177 Beeman to play with in the back yard and for some annoying pest birds. Silent shooting can be your friend! Before that I had no idea how cool air rifles could be, having only messed with walmart-level Daisys and Crossmans as a kid. Only drawback to it is it's so hard to cock Michele can barely do it, and it's about twice the weight of our little CZ .22 rifle!
Remington Nitro .22 caliber- http://www.airgunwarehouseinc.com/py-2056-4175.html
http://ep.yimg.com/ca/I/yhst-41902112641410_2137_129737966
22 Hornet pistol sounds cool

[Conquistador_del_mar]

22 Hornet pistol sounds cool

The 8 shot Raging Hornet is awesome, accurate, and hardly any recoil with the massive size. It has not been made for a few years. I hope to take mine to the range in a few days to sight in the scope. The Cabela's case here is 18" wide for a size reference. Bill

[dr]

PM me - I'll meet you at the range and we will try several. Start with a 22 revolver and work up through several larger calibers - 22, 32, 380, 38, 357, 40, 45. I'll bring the AR-15 and a shotgun too.
Been wanting to get to the range to try my new air rifle. Been shooting it in the yard but want to see what it will do at longer distances. Remington Nitro - pretty awesome air rifle

Hi Tim…that’s a generous offer and I appreciate it. I’ll give you a call or drop you a line and we can figure something out….

[gcarter]

This sure is on subject here, but I'm wonderin' if it might also be a little political?:wink:
http://www.argusleader.com/article/20110131/UPDATES/110131031/Bill-would-require-all-S-D-citizens-buy-gun

Bill would require all S.D. citizens to buy a gun




Five South Dakota lawmakers have introduced legislation that would require any adult 21 or older to buy a firearm “sufficient to provide for their ordinary self-defense.”
The bill, which would take effect Jan. 1, 2012, would give people six months to acquire a firearm after turning 21. The provision does not apply to people who are barred from owning a firearm.

Nor does the measure specify what type of firearm. Instead, residents would pick one “suitable to their temperament, physical capacity, and preference.”

The measure is known as an act “to provide for an individual mandate to adult citizens to provide for the self defense of themselves and others.”

Rep. Hal Wick, R-Sioux Falls, is sponsoring the bill and knows it will be killed. But he said he is introducing it to prove a point that the federal health care reform mandate passed last year is unconstitutional.

“Do I or the other cosponsors believe that the State of South Dakota can require citizens to buy firearms? Of course not. But at the same time, we do not believe the federal government can order every citizen to buy health insurance,” he said.

[zelatore]

As soon as I read this I figured it was a statement about the health care law.

There are of course logical arguments to be made; I'll leave that be as it's entirely political.

But on the topic of guns (not political at all...) while I'm in favor of the right to own them, I certainly do not think EVERYBODY should! Think about it - how many people do you know personally who have just a bit too much temper as it is? Now do you want that guy carrying?

BTW, my father in law DOES think everybody should carry, all the time. In his mind this would promote more civility since everybody would know the repercussions of doing something against another person. Sounds logical on it's face, until you think of that guy with the over the top temper when your wife accidentally gets into a fender bender with him at the mall.

[Ghost]

As soon as I read this I figured it was a statement about the health care law.

There are of course logical arguments to be made; I'll leave that be as it's entirely political.

But on the topic of guns (not political at all...) while I'm in favor of the right to own them, I certainly do not think EVERYBODY should! Think about it - how many people do you know personally who have just a bit too much temper as it is? Now do you want that guy carrying?

BTW, my father in law DOES think everybody should carry, all the time. In his mind this would promote more civility since everybody would know the repercussions of doing something against another person. Sounds logical on it's face, until you think of that guy with the over the top temper when your wife accidentally gets into a fender bender with him at the mall.

Hmmmm. While "everyone" is too absolute and mandates are of course, ridiculous, there is an interesting calculus in your Dad's point that may be a hair subtler than your description makes clear. And that is that perhaps the very temper you fear in some IS ACTUALLY IN PART A FUNCTION OF ENVIRONMENT as well as being partly innate.

Put another way, it's not just a weighing of independent factors. It's not just the fear of repercussions measured against the animal temper.

Rather, the animal temper itself may not be 100% innately decoupled from its surroundings. They say "power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely." Is it possible that the ill behavior of tyrants is not simply their animal instinct unchecked, but instead, the animal instinct itself is modified by surroundings and conditioning? My sense is that the machinery of physiology is messier than either construct, but that the conditioning metaphor may have some use in illustrating the complexities of the physiology. The internal wiring may iself be changed by the environment, just as a neural-net can learn a driver's behavior and program itself accordingly.

Just a thought.

This is not a recommendation.
The opinions expressed here are those of the writer alone.
Your mileage may vary.
Please consult an experienced professional.
Expires 12/1/10.
Do not operate vehicle with shade in place.

[gcarter]

As soon as I read this I figured it was a statement about the health care law.

There are of course logical arguments to be made; I'll leave that be as it's entirely political.

But on the topic of guns (not political at all...) while I'm in favor of the right to own them, I certainly do not think EVERYBODY should! Think about it - how many people do you know personally who have just a bit too much temper as it is? Now do you want that guy carrying?

BTW, my father in law DOES think everybody should carry, all the time. In his mind this would promote more civility since everybody would know the repercussions of doing something against another person. Sounds logical on it's face, until you think of that guy with the over the top temper when your wife accidentally gets into a fender bender with him at the mall.

Don, you're assuming that everyone would carry, all the time, and that is just as far fetched. There's a gun shop/instruction center about a mile from my office, but I could care less about it. I think MOST folks don't care to carry and wouldn't. They just want the option. Then, there's the obligation to not have any accidents in the home. Again, the vast majority of folks take good care of their weapons and keep them secured.
The truth is most deaths are caused by knives, bludgeons, and the like. They are much handier.

[vrod02]

I’m not a gun person in fact I’ve really owned one….my former wife had a couple but we seldom used them...fortunatly...

With that said beginning this Spring I’m going to be spending more time at a little place I have out in the middle of nowhere and want something for protection….there’s only intermittent cell service, closest neighbor is over a mile away, area renown for meth labs, pot patches, you get the picture.

I’m thinking about a shotgun as well as a handgun….any and all recommendations will be appreciated….if it’s any consideration I’m a big boy…..Local(knoxville) vs gunshow/nationwide, big box vs. small shop…new vs used....typically as a consumer I buy on price; is that smart…information on ammunition and or any good (concise) websites would be appreciated as well..

I’ll probably only have them in the house and possibly on the boat…would a carry permit be needed there?


Again, thanks…
David
I have no problem with this gentleman owning a rocket laucher.............:shocking:
Sorry it took me so long to respond . I'll pay more attention:wink:
Read my sig. You "Legal" guys ..... thanks!!!!!!!!!!!!! We will honor you.

[zelatore]

Hmmmm. While "everyone" is too absolute and mandates are of course, ridiculous, there is an interesting calculus in your Dad's point that may be a hair subtler than your description makes clear. And that is that perhaps the very temper you fear in some IS ACTUALLY IN PART A FUNCTION OF ENVIRONMENT as well as being partly innate.

Put another way, it's not just a weighing of independent factors. It's not just the fear of repercussions measured against the animal temper.

Rather, the animal temper itself may not be 100% innately decoupled from its surroundings. They say "power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely." Is it possible that the ill behavior of tyrants is not simply their animal instinct unchecked, but instead, the animal instinct itself is modified by surroundings and conditioning? My sense is that the machinery of physiology is messier than either construct, but that the conditioning metaphor may have some use in illustrating the complexities of the physiology. The internal wiring may iself be changed by the environment, just as a neural-net can learn a driver's behavior and program itself accordingly.

Just a thought.

This is not a recommendation.
The opinions expressed here are those of the writer alone.
Your mileage may vary.
Please consult an experienced professional.
Expires 12/1/10.
Do not operate vehicle with shade in place.


It is of course a topic open to much discussion and psychological study/debate. I can see an argument either way, however I can't knowledgeably make a strong argument. All I can do is speak to anecdotal evidence and personal observation.

I have a friend named Pat. Pat's a great guy, but Pat has a crazy temper. I've never seen him actually get physically involved with somebody, but I've seen him throwing things, cursing people, etc. (my favorite was the phone call he had while driving that led to throwing his cell phone out the window going down the interstate). To imagine somebody like Pat making the transition from verbal to physical isn't hard, and he's not a particularly violent person. I don't think I need armed Pats running around, even if their potential use of force would be tempered by the probability of equal retaliation. I don't think thought or logic come into play when they reach that point.

Of course, as you've said I could be wrong. Maybe the very nature of an armed society would temper Pat's reactions. Perhaps had he been raised in such a situation he would have learned a different coping mechanism. Perhaps if we simply raised a generation of people who were taught a proper respect for firearms instead of simply being told 'guns bad' people in general would be less inclined to use them for wrong. But now I'm getting into all sorts of societal possibilities!

This could be a psychology final: discuss the merits of a fully armed society and the changes it would engender in the public's interactions. Is it better to guard the sheep with dogs, or to make each sheep a dog?

For now I'll settle for not having Pat strapped. It's probably better for both him and the rest of us.

If I've totally missed you're point please forgive me. You used lots of big words and I've just woken up from where I fell asleep on the sofa watching TV. That may have cost me several of my few remaining functional brain cells. :shades:

[zelatore]

Don, you're assuming that everyone would carry, all the time, and that is just as far fetched. There's a gun shop/instruction center about a mile from my office, but I could care less about it. I think MOST folks don't care to carry and wouldn't. They just want the option. Then, there's the obligation to not have any accidents in the home. Again, the vast majority of folks take good care of their weapons and keep them secured.
The truth is most deaths are caused by knives, bludgeons, and the like. They are much handier.

I know I made a leap there; I was jumping from the proposed bill to my Father-in-law's opinion that everybody should carry. The bill made no reference to forced carry, only forced purchase. And really it's somewhat ridiculous to discuss it as even those who proposed it have admitted it's simply a stunt to draw attention to the health care law's 'shall purchase' clause.

Just last weekend Michele and I were discussing her father's opinion (I forget what brought it up) and we both agreed that while there are times we might like to carry, the majority of the time we wouldn't, even if we could. For that reason, we've never bothered even trying to get a carry permit here in CA - just not worth the hassal since we wouldn't want to bother 95% of of the time.

I've been a gun owner for years; both my and Michele's families own hand guns and long guns. Doesn't bother me in the least if an honest law abiding citizen wants to buy a gun, be it a hunting rifle or a fully automatic assault gun. However there are clearly some individuals who may not be criminals but still shouldn't own a weapon. Tuscon was an example of that. The key of course if finding the fine line between weeding out that minority of people and not infringing on the rights of the majority who are responsible and stable enough to make reasonable decisions.

[DonziJon]

TODAY: IMHO: You "Just SHOW a Gun"..and you got a Record. Think about that. :(

http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D9L4TD980&show_article=1

Just in case the article goes away: See below.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CONCORD, N.H. (AP) - A New Hampshire farmer who became a folk hero to gun rights activists after he was imprisoned for brandishing a handgun at a trespasser on his property won early release Wednesday.
The New Hampshire Executive Council voted unanimously to free Ward Bird, just two months into his three-year sentence.

His wife, Ginny, said he would come home to "lots of tears, lots of hugs and a big celebration."

Bird, 49, of Moultonborough, had sought a full pardon to clear his name. The council voted in his favor, but Gov. John Lynch (D) vetoed the pardon, saying the judicial system had given Bird's case a thorough review and he would not undermine that. The council then immediately voted to commute his sentence, and Lynch let that vote stand.

"I, like the (sentencing) judge, have concerns the punishment does not fit the crime," Lynch said.

Bird's felony conviction for criminal threatening with a firearm remains on his record. He can no longer possess guns. Attorney General Michael Delaney said a full pardon would have restored Bird's right to own and carry guns.

Ginny Bird said that during a late afternoon telephone conversation with her husband, he proclaimed that he's not a prisoner anymore.

She said that while he's disappointed he didn't get a full pardon, he told her that could be dealt with another day by applying to the court to have the conviction annulled.

Carroll County corrections officials said Bird will be released from their jail as soon as they have the official paperwork in hand, even if it's after the close of business hours. But Bird's paperwork first has to be processed by the state Department of Corrections, and it was looking unlikely that would happen Wednesday.

Bird's case has become a cause celebre since he was sent to prison Nov. 17, much to the discomfort of the farmer and scout leader whose 18-year-old daughter saw him wearing a suit for the first time at Tuesday's hearing.

"I don't need people using me as a cause," Bird told the Associated Press recently. "I just want to be home with my family."

Family members and friends formed the http://www.freewardbird.org movement and website and his saga has been tweeted and updated on Facebook. His case ignited the passions of gun rights advocates, tea party members and libertarians across the "Live Free or Die" state.

The "freewardbird" website now bears the headline, "Ward Bird is a FREE MAN."

Bird was convicted of criminal threatening with a firearm after the March 2006 encounter with Christine Harris at his remote home on a Moultonborough hilltop. The crime carries a minimum, mandatory three-year prison sentence because a weapon was involved.

He did not testify at his trial in 2008. The first time he testified under oath about the incident was at Tuesday's pardon hearing.

"As God is my witness and on the honor of my family and friends in this room today, I did not point or wave a firearm at Christine Harris," Bird said, voice quavering with emotion.

Harris didn't attend the council hearing. Victim advocate Melissa Smith told the council Harris feels "terrorized" by the number of people posting negative comments about her on the Internet.

Smith and Harris' lawyer did not immediately return telephone calls seeking comment Wednesday.

Several councilors questioned Harris' credibility during their deliberations Wednesday.

"We have information regarding a pattern of false accusations by Christine Harris," councilor David Wheeler said.

Harris testified at trial that Bird jumped off the porch and charged her car. Wheeler said the council was presented with "incontrovertible evidence" he did not.

At the time of the incident, Bird was recovering from abdominal surgery barely two weeks earlier. His doctor said he had more than 250 internal sutures and 32 staples holding his skin together. Bird said he was in pain.

"At that point I was not comfortable with any strangers being around," Bird said. "The threat was more emotional than anything."

Bird said he had a .45-caliber handgun in the back waistband of his pants during the encounter with Harris, but he insisted he removed it only to take out the ammunition clip before re-entering his house. He said he kept the gun pointed to the ground while doing so.

A full pardon is a rarity in New Hampshire. There have only been two granted in the past 15 years, most recently in 2003.

[Just Say N20]

Great. He said/she said, and they believe her so he gets jail time and looses his right to own firearms.

[VetteLT193]

If I remember right, we have some sort of readiness standard here in FL. you can have a loaded gun, but if it is locked, you are ok. In your car, boat, etc.

the concealed permit is really the way to go though. 35 states recognize the FL carry permit (and vice versa, so if you have one from your state it probably is ok here too).

Another neat thing not many know about is FL issues concealed carry permits to both residents and Non residents. So, if your state is a PITA to get a carry permit, get one down here in Sunny Fl and it probably works in your state.

To get one here you take a class at a gun show for a couple hours, fill our your forms, fingerprints, and you are good to go.

As far as home protection goes, I have two pistols. 9mm Sig and a .45 Taurus. I usually carry the .45. I stick with pistols for now because of the kids... easier to keep up and away than a long gun.

The carry permit is excellent even for occasional use. This past weekend I had a bunch of cash on me to buy a car up in Georgia. I was a whole lot more comfortable with the cash and the gun...

[Just Say N20]

The concealed carry permit in Michigan is nice because it also allows you to purchase a handgun on the spot, rather than have to go to the police station to obtain a green permit that is good for something like 14 days.

It simplifies the process greatly.

[zelatore]

There's no question a carry permit is handy even if you don't plan to regularly carry. Here in CA, to comply with every technicality of transporting a handgun without a carry permit is almost impossible, so some people get one even though all they ever do is go to the range from time to time. I've considered doing so, but just never felt like jumping through the hoops needed to do it.