New to Donzis

[jdebevec]

I'm interested in eventually purchasing a 22' classic. This will be my all-purpose boat. I have several questions regarding their abilities.

1.) How is the hole shot? This is not something I find discussed very much. Do they get on plane quickly? It looks like many "all-purpose" boats plane in around 3-4 seconds. Can the 22 compare to that? How fast does it accelerate after that?

2.) Since this will be my all-purpose boat, I'd like to be able to waterski and wakeboard behind it. Is it practical to use for either one of these? How about barefoot?

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated! Thank you.

[Just Say N20]

As a starting point, we must understand deadrise. Deadrise is the amount of angle a hull has when you measure the angle made by the bottom of the boat, and a horizontal surface as the other line.

As a general rule, the more deadrise a hull has at the transom, in a runabout length boat (for this discussion, ≤22'), the deeper a hole the back of the boat makes when coming on plane. This can be improved with the use of trim tabs.

Ski boats have very little deadrise, and consequently get on plane very quickly, and experience almost no bow rise. They seem to almost just go faster, rising up out of the water in a very flat way.

The shallow deadrise also produces a very small wake.

Most of the Donzi Classics (16', 18' & 22') have 24 degrees of deadrise at the transom. This is what allows them to do such a great job in rough water for relatively short boats. This tends to make them push aside more water as they run, which translates into a relatively large wake.

I love the classics, and have owned 3 of them. I did a tremendous about of waterskiing behind my 18, as well as barefooting. Speed is no problem, and there is certainly enough acceleration to pull virtually anyone out of the water.

However, I would be painting a fanciful picture if I were to suggest they will be a great all around boat. They seat 5 people comfortably if you have NOTHING else in the boat. Storage is minimal at best, especially for a 22 foot boat. They don't have swim platforms, or boarding ladders although both have been added after the fact by people attempting to over come the re-boarding issue. Carl C modified the bow portion of his boat to create a small cuddy to address the storage issue, and provide a place to get out of the rain, should the need arise.

If you have a pontoon boat, or a dock to serve as "home base" to hold the cooler full of munchies and liquid refreshments, ski life jackets, skiis, wakeboard, ski rope, ski harness, etc., then you could have a viable situation. If you are going to take all this stuff with you as you head out for the day. . . . not so much.

First and foremost, they are designed to be awesome sport boats. They look spectacular, are "nicely" horsepowered so they perform well, have a hull designed to handle decent water for small boats, and seat people.

Buying a Donzi 22 Classic as your "all around" boat would be like buying a Ferrari for your family car. There are many other boats in this size range the perform well, and have a ton more storage space, and come with a swim platform/boarding ladder.

If you love the look, buy a 22, and then be ready to compromise in the areas mentioned above.

[jdebevec]

Thank you for the very honest and thorough response. I did read about the boarding ladders and Carl C's bow modification, which is a brilliant idea! That's something I can see myself doing. I'm always tinkering.

As far as practical? Yes, I would like to be able to have two or three of us in the boat and go out for the weekend (maybe just to go camping). I would think I'd be able to haul some amount of gear. However, even though this will be my all-purpose boat, I don't necessarily need it to be the most practical.

I do love the look of them and they have a tremendous following. I'm sure this is due to the fact that they perform and handle well and are built well. I think the majority of my use would be just cruising and I like the idea of being able to comfortably cruise big lakes and still maintain a comfortable ride.

I really do enjoy acceleration though. I'm curious about the difference between an 18' and 22' in this area. Has anyone ever had a feeling in the 22' that it's sluggish to come out of the hole or to accelerate? Or, do you get the feeling that it's very fast out of the hole?

You mentioned bow rise. I was under the impression that there may not be alot of bow rise with the 18 or especially the 22 due to the bow length.

Thanks for all of your help!

[Crystal Pro]

Our 22z works well and is a nice compromize. There are a few out there for sale and they make great projects.

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o176/avicontrol/Donziontapps.jpg

[Carl C]

Of course it depends on the power package but the 502/496 models leap on plane and accelerate like a bat out of hell. I don't ski behind mine because this is not a boat you can put just anyone behind the wheel. I think it would be easy to ski behind though, the wake isn't real huge. Barefooting? I don't think so. I would want a boom for that.

[jdebevec]

I'm interested in a boat with a 454 magnum. That's still gotta be quite a bit of power for this boat, right? You can never have enough, but I would think it would be enough for good hole shot and what? Maybe 65 mph?

The funny thing is, all of my seat time is either in my dad's '77 20' Thompson, which is just as heavy as the 22 Classic, or my 10' GW Invader with a 70 Horse Merc.

The Thompson only has 160 hp and poor compression, but still runs 32 mph! It takes a while to get on plane but it also rises about 2-3 feet out of the water once on plain due to the super deep v hull. It handles very well for a big boat. My dad's currently in the process of repowering it. Maybe 240-260 hp.

My GW can get pretty scary, but it is unbelievably stable for what it is. 44mph on GPS 4 inches above the water. I'm going to be selling it if anyone's interested ;) I once had a Johnson 28 h.p. on it and with that power, it would be awesome for a kid. You really can't flip it.

Anyway, thank you all for such great replies. There's something quite different about this Donzi group of people compared to the Camaro and Trans Am forum I belong to. You all seem to be very genuine and less critical (everyone's a mechanic on a forum, right?) Thanks again.

Josh

[Just Say N20]

The classics are actually pretty nice for 'footin if you aren't into all kinds of tricks.

Because of the wake they make, the trough just outside of the first wake wave is nice and smooth. You aren't likely to be cutting across the wake though.

They do have plenty of power, and a 454 will be more than enough.

I also have no idea of your age. As someone who has climbed into a classic about a million times ( :wink: ), if you are a very fit sub-40 year old, it most likely won't be a problem for YOU. Women on the other hand, could be a problem. If you get a boarding ladder, you will also have to find a place to store it. Someone on here did a great job making a custom bracket to hold a ladder in the engine compartment.

And, if climbing up on the outdrive, besides the obvious risks there, a nicely waxed engine hatch can be a nasty place for a wet body to negotiate on their way to the cockpit. Add a brew-sky or two and you get - Slip! Bang! Slice! OUCH!

I'm not trying to talk you out of it. Shoot, I did that very thing you are talking about for 10 years. I was more into the Donzi as a performance sport boat, but I also happened to like skiing. I also only had about 2 friends, so I was never going out with a full boat of people AND all the necessary toys/equipment.

[Carl C]

It's not a ski boat. It's a hot-rod that takes skill and seat time to learn to drive. There is not even a place to stow a ski and, like N2O said, boarding is tricky and there is no swim platform and if you put one on you will catch hell from this forum ;). There are no drink holders. We will look forward to your stories about how the boat scared the hell out of you the first few times out. But we love these little boats and they can go where other small boats dare not tread. You better think about what you really want.......

[mattyboy]

if tow sports are your main criteria, i would stick with a classic that was designed for it or more friendly towards it like a 16 or an 18
both of which will pop a skier out of the hole a lot faster then a 22

as a family of 4 we got around just fine with tubes skis boards in our 16, my 16 was no speed demon but it would get to WOT 60 mph faster than any other boat i have been in. if you got on it too hard from the get go you could put it right on it's back or if you had a 45 yr old overweight buddy trying to re-live his youth on one ski you could dislocate shoulders.
now there is a time even a boarding ladder don't help getting back in :0

i do believe we even went to a picnic on an island in the CT river with 8 people of course it took 2 trips ;) in the 16

I would take a 16 over an 18 if water sports were my goals, an 18 more for cruisin with friends and a 22 or bigger for cruisin long distances with friends on bigger water.

i always get a giggle from the 22 is a drivers boat statement, it has been made by alot of 22 guys it is true, but then an 18 or a 16 is a drivers drivers boat. I have driven all three and the 22 is a great boat don't get me wrong but it is not as nimble or responsive as an 18 or 16 but in it that difference lies the 22's ability to handle higher speeds and bigger water.
but then again who goes skiing in 3 footers ;)

ask a 22 guy who gets a ride in a 16 at 60 it feels to them with the wind in the face and proximity to the water that they are going much much faster

all good boats :) other things to take into account is your water ,your storage and towing vehicle so pick a boat that fits

[gcarter]

Wait'll your fishing buddies want you to take them fishing!!!:confused::nilly:
I told them they could fish on an innertube that I'd be pulling at my minimum planing speed..........

[jdebevec]

So, trolling at 25 mph, huh :wink: I'm not much for fishing. When I'm on the water, I want to be cruising or some water sports. My idea of fishing would be possibly sitting on the bow or the stern and throwing a line in for 30 min. That would be my attention span.

All of this is good feedback. The classic is still sounding like a fairly well rounded boat. I don't expect it to be an inboard ski boat and I don't expect to "air" it out like you can with an outboard. I understand that's not what they were designed to do, and quite frankly, that's why I'm interested in them. Those boats are fun to watch (about 6 inches of pad in the water) but it's always in calm water. I don't think they handle big water very well. I'd probably mostly be using this boat in Northern Minnesota where the water can get pretty heavy. It'd also be nice to know that I could take it to the Great Lakes if I'd like to.

You can look at "all-purpose" anything one of two ways. It performs in all areas equally well or it performs in all areas equally poor. There's not one boat out there that can do every single thing perfectly. A ski boat would be awesome to just pop out of the water, but at the same time, they're designed for 45-50 tops and not cruising long distances. The Donzi likes speed but slower out of the water.

One more I haven't heard much of yet. For those of you that enjoy watersports with your classic, do you run a different prop? I've just been in the mindset since I started tinkering with my 10' boat that it's usually necessary to switch out your props depending on what you're doing that day. It sure doesn't take very long and then you've got it made if you want to ski but cruise the next day or that afternoon.

Oh, and I'm 27, so I don't think I'm old enough yet to have any problems getting in and out of the boat in the water :wink: The engine hatch is strong enough to walk on, right?

[jdebevec]

Yet another one... Are they susceptible to chine walk? I can't imagine that they do very bad since there is so much wetted surface. I've only experienced that in boats that get up on a small pad.

[Planetwarmer]

The engine hatch is very strong. I haven't tried to wake board behind my 22C, because I like to wake board between 14 and 20 mph (depending on what I'm wanting to do). My classic doesn't plane out until 23 or 25 mph or so.

I have always viewed a 22C as an old Corvette. They aren't the fastest, they aren't the best handling, they aren't the most user friendly, and they aren't the most comfortable, BUT they are the coolest.

That being said, I have never really seen my 22 as being difficult to drive at all. As a matter of fact, I really enjoy driving my 22. I don't view it as being a hand full at all. It handles rough water surprisingly well, even for a larger boat.

My boat has a 454, and I can feel acceleration when I push down on the throttle no matter how fast I'm going. With the tabs down and the trim down, it hops up on plane very quick. This is not a boring boat to drive at all. If you are worried about the speed of getting on plane, you have nothing to worry about, it will plane out faster than most boats on most lakes. It is a sport boat, designed by a famous racer.

Like I said, its like a 67 corvette with a 427. There are quicker cars, faster cars, and more comfy cars, but not too many as unique or as cool.:convertib:

[jdebevec]

Nicely put!

[gcarter]

Yet another one... Are they susceptible to chine walk? I can't imagine that they do very bad since there is so much wetted surface. I've only experienced that in boats that get up on a small pad.
Some boats combined w/certain props can be a handfull, others not.

[z33donzi]

if you want power and a nice ride i have a z33 crossbow that needs some loven and a new owner i have it listed here and heres a you tube link http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNBbYu8Sv1w&feature=channel if you have any questions about my z33 please call me at 270-899-0229 thanks i hope you find what your looking for

[z33donzi]

if your looking for power and a nice ride i have a z33 for sale heres a link to you tube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNBbYu8Sv1w&feature=channel this is a great boat it needs a little loven but has new power and is in great shape if you have any question please contact me at 270-899-0229 thanks i hope you find what you are looking for

[Bamboo Loui]

if your looking for power and a nice ride i have a z33 for sale heres a link to you tube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNBbYu8Sv1w&feature=channel this is a great boat it needs a little loven but has new power and is in great shape if you have any question please contact me at 270-899-0229 thanks i hope you find what you are looking for

If you have the size of water that this boat needs-- I would do this before a 22c

[DickB]

Just Say N20 (http://www.donzi.net/forums/member.php?u=4270), your first reply was an excellent summary of the Donzi Classics. Mine did scare the hell out of me the first few times I drove it. I still love it after 7 years. BTW I am 58 today and have no problem boarding.

[FISHIN SUCKS]

Wait'll your fishing buddies want you to take them fishing!!!:confused::nilly:
I told them they could fish on an innertube that I'd be pulling at my minimum planing speed..........
Testify George.........you're the king:kingme:!!!

Josh, I can't help ya much on the handling/performance of a Classic, I've never had one. My Donzi portfolio has only consisted of the Z-boats. But someday, I will probably end up with an 18 or a 22 (maybe a 16) because I have always loved the lines!!!!! Good luck in your endevour,

tom

[jdebevec]

Well, as long as you chimed in... I'd like to hear about the Zs too.

[VetteLT193]

Donzi classics are not well rounded boats. As Carl said, they are hot rods on the water.

Water sports generally requires stuff.... Meaning, you need a ski rope, wet life jackets, skis/board/tube, etc. There is no room for this stuff on a classic. It can be made to work on a once in a while basis but if it is part of your general boating my guess is you will hate life. Even the simple things like rear facing seat(s) for your spotter are not available. someone's neck is not going to feel so good by the end of the day. There isn't even much room to get around the cockpit of a 22. Just trying to stretch your legs after a long ride can be a chore. You will more than likely need a couple of props. Cruising prop, top end prop, skiing prop.

I'd much rather ski behind my 28 ZXO than a 22 Classic. And at 28 feet it's not exactly ski friendly.

Taking a 22 out for a day of water sports is like taking a Corvette to Home Depot to pick up lumber. You can put the top down and have 2x4's sticking up in the air out of the passenger seat but it isn't exactly 'meant' for the job. Once every couple of years... no problem. Once a week. forget about it.

If you want a drivers boat that will make you smile every time you get behind the wheel a 22 is an excellent choice. If you want a well rounded machine it is not an excellent choice. I moved from a 20' Minx to a ZX for this reason.

[FISHIN SUCKS]

Taking a 22 out for a day of water sports is like taking a Corvette to Home Depot to pick up lumber. You can put the top down and have 2x4's sticking up in the air out of the passenger seat but it isn't exactly 'meant' for the job.
Now that is a funny visual:rlol::rlol:

Okay, here's my chime. Our first Z boat was a '91 24' Blackwidow w/a warmed over 454. I like to call this our comprimise boat. When my wife and I were shopping, she wanted a sunpad, a cuddy, and enough room to bring along another couple with their kids. My only criteria was that if it didn't make noise, then we don't own it. We looked at Liberators and Scarabs and then it dawned on me that I had always dug Donzi's. So, got on the internet, looking for something in our price range, and found this baby. The widow fit the bill for 6 years and then I was drunk and on ebay and ended up being high bidder on our 28ZX. No regrets, and still married. The Z boats meet our requirements for our family whereas the Classics don't. Before I/we bought the ZX, my wife had asked if we should consider anything other than a Donzi. After a few brief exchanges of thoughts, we really didn't have any interest in anything but a Donzi. The boats are great, instant recognition, but the people that we have met at various Donzi meets have been so cool and helpful, there really was no other choice for us. If you don't care about a sunpad or a stabbin cabin and you want to stay in a 22' range, then go the Classic route. If you like a little more room and want those amenitites, then go the ZX route. From what I understand, the same motor in each, the Classic out runs the ZX.

Hope this helps, just remember, advice is worth what you paid for it:wink:

tom

[Planetwarmer]

You might really like a 22ZX.

[xedmoc]

I'm interested in this whole water ski issue as well. The Sweet 16 has a ski rope fixture on the back of it. Did they not call the original 16 the "ski sporter"? ...or was that another model?
I would like to try to water ski behind mine this summer at some point now that Trueser & Company has it running for me!
Laterz,
XEDMOC
--

[VetteLT193]

I'm interested in this whole water ski issue as well. The Sweet 16 has a ski rope fixture on the back of it. Did they not call the original 16 the "ski sporter"? ...or was that another model?
I would like to try to water ski behind mine this summer at some point now that Trueser & Company has it running for me!
Laterz,
XEDMOC
--

The 16 is totally different than the 22. Especially in its original seating configuration.

[mattyboy]

I'm interested in this whole water ski issue as well. The Sweet 16 has a ski rope fixture on the back of it. Did they not call the original 16 the "ski sporter"? ...or was that another model?
I would like to try to water ski behind mine this summer at some point now that Trueser & Company has it running for me!
Laterz,
XEDMOC
--


you'll find it will do that job just fine, we towed everything behind our 16 ski sporter. mine had a lift ring not a tow ring like the newer ones.
the lift ring really wasn't meant for towing but it was stout enough to do the job. the tow ring I would imagine has some kind of backing and is made to take that kind of load.

last I saw the 16 it was towing 8 people on one of those long yellow bon aires.