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View Full Version : Bellhousing/coupler casting # on 1970 2+3 W/351w



mopargreg
05-31-2009, 07:29 PM
Well, today I figured I give my new 1970 2+3 a good going over before I make my 1st trip on the water with it, so I lifted the hatch, checked all the bells and whistles, swithes and so on...Replaced the bildge pump (cleaned the bildge), soldered some wires under the dash (hate butt connectors), filled the fuel tank full and found out I need a fuel sending unit (gauge doesn't move), but other than the little things all checked out good.........While I was under the hatch I was looking at the bellhousing/coupler housing and found these casting #'s on it (hm cast big and then these #'s under the hm C8HM-4A50-MB2, what does HM stand for? I know the #'s are a part or casting # for that piece.

thescooter
05-31-2009, 07:32 PM
holman - moody

MOP
05-31-2009, 08:13 PM
In the spring the gas gauge float can be stuck, mine was this spring. Pull the access cover and give the sender a thump with a block of wood it may free it up it did on mine.

mopargreg
05-31-2009, 08:32 PM
Does this mean my 351w is a Holman-Moody engine? The engine is painted gray, any telltale on color of engine? The guy I got the boat from said he was told it was a Holman-Moody boat but felt that it wasn't, there are NO call outs or tags riveted to anything on the boat.... The engine, carb & distributor do have some ID tags on them if this would help in ID'ing if it's a HM engine. It does have a 270 drive w/power trim. Any idea's?

mattyboy
05-31-2009, 08:33 PM
yes it is a holman moody casting number it is on the bell housing??? not a 351w casting number though it would be a C9 are you sure the boat is a 70??? most likely a 302 boat swapped out to a 351 or someone replaced the bell housing and the 270T is much newer than a 70 so I would say the boat was repowered and older than a 70

mopargreg
05-31-2009, 08:43 PM
Yep, for sure the boat is a 1970, hull ID # is 18370 , now the casting # might have been on the coupler between the bellhousing and outdrive transome plate, can't remember, I'll do some more checking of #'s tomorrow when it's daylight if this would help ID what it is, let me know...... Thanks, Greg

mattyboy
05-31-2009, 08:54 PM
18370 has no relation to 1970 it means the 370th 18 built there is no digit representing the date in the early hull numbers, the casting numbers on a 70 would be C9 or E0 C8 is 1968

MOP
05-31-2009, 08:59 PM
Find the block casting numbers this link will tell you the block size: http://raceabilene.com/kelly/hotrod/engine2.html

The numbers are by where the starter mounts.

Phil

mattyboy
05-31-2009, 09:06 PM
18386 is a 71 so it could be a 70 but the casting number C8 is off and holman moody's were ford blue ,but gray paint don't mean it is not a holman moody that someone painted
also the HM serial numbers for the 351 were in the 4000 series so the 4A50 would make it the 1050th 351 to leave Holman moody my 69 351w was 4127

Donzi Racer
05-31-2009, 09:23 PM
Does this mean my 351w is a Holman-Moody engine? The engine is painted gray, any telltale on color of engine? The guy I got the boat from said he was told it was a Holman-Moody boat but felt that it wasn't, there are NO call outs or tags riveted to anything on the boat.... The engine, carb & distributor do have some ID tags on them if this would help in ID'ing if it's a HM engine. It does have a 270 drive w/power trim. Any idea's?

Greg, when you say power trim are you talking about the outdrive will trim while underway or that it will tilt up when trailering? Hull # 370 could be a 1970. We had 1968 barrel back with #217 on it. #238 hull # was one of the very 1st bevel back 18 foot boats instead of being a Barrel Back. If it was a late 68 or early 69 then to go to # 370 by end of 1970 would be possible, but may be a early 1971. Seems like a lot of the earlier 18's came with Holman Moody's. I got tickled out of something me nephews boss said once. He said I do not care what the guys name was that put it together, it is still a FORD. I have not EVER been a Ford enthusuast until some of our Donzi's had 289 or 302 Holman Moody motors and they run so sweet & smooth. I have come, around as far as early boat motors anyway. ha ha Great boat! Including a picture of the H/M 289 in our last Barrel Back which is now another members ride. Tom

mopargreg
05-31-2009, 09:42 PM
Bellhousing and coupler are Ford blue, engine block, heads and intake are painted gray(not fresh paint, vintage) ....Engine has plain chrome valve covers (look to be factory ford, not new or jap junk) , firing order on cap is for 351. Title says it's a 1970 boat.... Would it having a 270 drive have any effect on engine size from factory..?

mopargreg
05-31-2009, 09:48 PM
And power trim in the water and on the trailer, screwdrive.....It's mount on the left side of the transome under the rear hatch, next to the trim tab res. and pump assy....

Donzi Racer
05-31-2009, 10:00 PM
And power trim in the water and on the trailer, screwdrive.....It's mount on the left side of the transome under the rear hatch, next to the trim tab res. and pump assy....

Greg, I cannot wait to see that thing. That power trim is so nice on an earlier Donzi. It is not original but it is soooo nice. Tom

JimG
06-01-2009, 06:08 AM
Matty, my boat is a 1970, and is hull 18-355. So his boat is most likely a 1970.

To me, it sounds like a block replacement and possibly an outdrive change to 270. Mine is a 250, and the numbers match the foil plate.

Mopargreg, have you checked the foil plate between the seatbacks to see if the drive/bellhousing numbers match?

Jim

olredalert
06-01-2009, 08:11 AM
-------Mopargreg,,,Getting to this a bit late but, all that bellhousing with the HM on it means is that your boat most likely started life with a Holman-Moody/Volvo engine and drive package. Any small-block ford could have been reinstalled at a later date, and many if not all other early Volvo drives could have gone on the transom at a later date. The original Volvo drive for your boat would have most likely had a Holman-Moody embossed plate on it........Bill S

Bobby D
06-01-2009, 08:24 AM
Here is a 1970 stamped plate with HM CP number EOHM-4042-1-RW-I/O 290 4V, and compression is 9.5 to 1.
Boat is a ski sporter.
E= 351
0 = 1970
HM= Holman Moody
4042 = serial number
1 = is the rotation (I believe)
RW = raw water
I/O = inboard/ outboard
290= HP
4V = 4B carburetor

mattyboy
06-01-2009, 09:02 AM
Matty, my boat is a 1970, and is hull 18-355. So his boat is most likely a 1970.
To me, it sounds like a block replacement and possibly an outdrive change to 270. Mine is a 250, and the numbers match the foil plate.
Mopargreg, have you checked the foil plate between the seatbacks to see if the drive/bellhousing numbers match?
Jim


Jim
exactly what i was getting at, it could be a 71 too the bell housing casting is from a 68 though so maybe that was replaced as well from an older boat


Bobby D is close on the Holman Moody number but is off a little


E0 = 1970
HM = Holman Moody
4 = 351 block
042 = 42 block cast that year
1 = standard automobile engine rotation
RW = raw water cooled
290 = HP rating
4V = 4 bbl carb




so as I said a casting starting with C8 is from 1968 C9 would be 1969

mopargreg
06-01-2009, 01:43 PM
OK guys some more #'s off the boat engine....

Aluminum tag on coil bracket 8 E 09

4 barrel Intake casting # E6TE 9425 GB or CB hard too tell

Distributor tag: Marine SAE J1171 E5JL 2100 CA
PRESTOLITE
7020S 8 0 20

Bellhousing says COMMANDER on back side/ coupler has HM and part# C8HM 4A50 MB2

Holley carb tag: Motorcraft E8JLCA A8026

Didn't look at the foil tag behind back seat(didn't know), now I will look at that tomorrow and see what it says... Thanks for all the help...

thescooter
06-03-2009, 06:39 PM
just make the boat and the motor look and run the way you want it to.the firing order will tell you if it is a 02 or 51. that is how i did with my boat. my 1970 bertram baron has a pair of 302 h-m with volvo250's. your motor might hae been swapped or rebuilt, just so the boat and motor runs extremely reliable. there is nothing more agrivating then wanting to us your boat for the weekend and you are spending time under the hood or dash. that is my opinion. good luck with your work.

Bobby D
06-04-2009, 12:44 PM
Greg,
I have C8HM stamped on my Volvo 250 out drive tab. Tom’s motor is correct and well sorted out so if you want yours to look like it did back in the day paint it Ford blue. Also see attached information from my late 60's early 70's HM owner’s manual for 302/351 cu in engines it may help you figure things out.

mattyboy
06-05-2009, 06:59 AM
if you are gonna paint it make sure you use OLD ford Blue not NEW ford blue ;)

Bobby my fin had the same numbers C8 is 1968 and it would make sense that HM had alot of those parts fabricated in 68 that was their debut year in the marine world