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roadtrip se
03-18-2009, 01:15 PM
What's not to like?

1) All new cars built in the States qualify without regard to the OEM nameplate.

2) It gets the biggest polluters off the road and incents people to buy vehicles with better overall fuel economy.

3) It puts the people in the supply chain, dealer network, and in the factories back to work.

4) If you mustride the bus, turn that old clunker in baby.

Oh wait a minute, the same folks who are probably driving these things are the same one behind on their mortgages. Interesting idea...


A heap of stimulus: 'Cash for clunkers' bill could jumpstart new auto sales'

David Shepardson / Detroit News Washington Bureau

WASHINGTON -- A wide-ranging program that would give consumers turning in old clunkers cash vouchers worth up to $5,000 to buy new, more fuel-efficient vehicles was introduced Tuesday in Congress.

The bill aims to boost car sales in the midst of the recession, help struggling consumers buy new cars and cut pollution by taking some of the oldest, dirtiest cars off the road.

An earlier version of a so-called "cash for clunkers" incentives ran into union opposition that it could end up favoring imports. To avoid that problem, this new measure awards an extra $1,000 for vehicles assembled in the United States.

"It's good for Detroit and good for America," said Rep. Betty Sutton, D-Ohio. "There is a sense of urgency with car sales slumping." Sutton added that higher sales could keep jobs in the U.S.

The bill proposes giving consumers vouchers to buy new, more fuel-efficient vehicles in exchange for turning in vehicles at least eight years old. The program is dubbed the Consumer Assistance to Recycle and Save bill, or CARS Act.

Sutton noted that 60 percent of vehicles in the United States are old enough to qualify. The bill would award higher vouchers for vehicles assembled in North America -- up to $5,000 -- versus up to $4,000 vouchers for vehicles assembled outside North America, and would not apply at all to vehicles made outside North America. The proposal was endorsed Tuesday by Detroit's Big Three automakers and the United Auto Workers.

To qualify, consumers would have to buy a vehicle more fuel-efficient than their current car or truck. The new vehicles also would have to be priced at $35,000 or less.

The bill would offer a $7,500 cash voucher starting in 2010 for plug-in electric hybrids that get 100 mpg or more. Car owners also could turn in their vehicles in exchange for a mass transit voucher worth up to $3,000.

Rep. Candice Miller, R-Harrison Township, is among the initial co-sponsors.

GM chairman and CEO Rick Wagoner told reporters in Washington Tuesday that a bill to offer cash for older cars -- often dubbed "cash for clunkers" -- could benefit the auto industry.

"These kind of programs can have a huge impact," Wagoner said, saying it could boost consumer confidence. "It would be very helpful to have something like that here in the United States."

He pointed to a roughly 15 percent increase in auto sales in Germany last month over a year ago after they introduced a similar program. According to published reports, the German "scrappage" incentive boosted new-car registrations during February to the country's highest level in a decade.

Ford Motor Co. also praised the bill.

"The 'CARS Act' legislation is a win-win-win for consumers, the environment and energy independence," the company said in a statement.

"By providing incentives to purchase a new vehicle, the legislation would help reduce consumer costs, jumpstart the economy and help support millions of good jobs in every state across the nation."

Alan Reuther, legislative director for the United Auto Workers, said the union also supports the bill. "We believe it will stimulate sales of new vehicles, and thus help the industry and create jobs for American workers," Reuther said.

The bill could help speed the improvement of the fuel efficiency of the auto fleet. Automakers must increase the efficiency of their vehicles by at least 40 percent to a fleet-wide 35 mpg by 2020.

You can reach David Shepardson at (202) 662-8735 or dshepardson@detnews.com.

Ghost
03-18-2009, 02:00 PM
This is interesting. (Though it is funny to me how people (the folks quoted in the artlcle) pitch this stuff, calling it "win-win", without looking at where there actually are costs. I mean, if it's truly all win, why not give them $40,000 instead of $5000, and then it won't matter about the mortgages? They can buy the new car free and clear, and get a nice one to boot. Or give them $740,000 for the clunker, and solve both the car and mortgage crises? WHEEE--win-win!) :)

Lenny
03-18-2009, 02:02 PM
We have had that here for a while now todd. $300 for just turning one in, (had to have been licenced and injured for the previous 6 months minimum, and be 1996 vintage or older.

Last time I checked, a new F-350 Diesel was more than $300.

http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/canada-cash-for-clunkers-ca300/

handfulz28
03-18-2009, 03:38 PM
What's not to like?

2) It gets the biggest polluters off the road and incents people to buy vehicles with better overall fuel economy.

Oh wait a minute, the same folks who are probably driving these things are the same one behind on their mortgages. Interesting idea...

The theory is nice, but the reality is a joke. How many people driving around in pre-1996 cars can afford a new car payment? Instead it will be ripe with fraud by people buying $300 "rollers" and getting free money for their down payment.

Or will it make that $2,000 "first car" for the teenager in the house now cost $5k?

Just more evidence of an ignorant congress.

roadtrip se
03-18-2009, 05:44 PM
Finally, one program comes along that might actually have an impact now as opposed to some "pork-lette" pet project for a Demo buddy that just drives people to more dependence to big government.

We have 3.5M people in the auto biz here hanging on by a thread as people watch the news, get scared to death, and won't buy even so much as a steak much less a new car. As much as cutting everything to the bone sounds great, and I typically agree with it, the economy is not going to recover without something more than a $13 per week pay raise. Heck, let's go back and get the AIG bonuses, and all of the other money they used to light their cigars with on those junkets, and that should more than pay for the costs of the program.

Lenny, the program must be utilized for a new car with better fuel economy, not a 350 beast and it would be 2000 vehicles on down.

Handful, read the article again. This is for a new car. You would get to make the claim once. Used car prices are going up any way, because there are fewer people trading vehicles in and supply is down. The day of the $2000 clunker is about gone any way, at least anything a caring parent would allow their teenager to drive.

Not perfect, the vouchers for mass transit and the fact that the same folks that might be able to take advantage of this program might be in too much trouble to get financing, but it has worked elsewhere, so why not here? If the German number holds up, we are talking about 1.35M vehicles, which puts alot of people to work and might save some jobs, hair-brained Congress or not. I'm still confused about how paving all of our highways generates any long term job prospects, but jump starting the auto biz does preserve some jobs and maybe generate a few new ones long term.

BigGrizzly
03-18-2009, 06:07 PM
Thecash for clunkers will get paid the same way the digital tuners did they have run out of money I have been waiting since october for my rebate check.

handfulz28
03-18-2009, 06:21 PM
Handful, read the article again. This is for a new car. You would get to make the claim once. Used car prices are going up any way, because there are fewer people trading vehicles in and supply is down. The day of the $2000 clunker is about gone any way, at least anything a caring parent would allow their teenager to drive.

I understood it is for a new car purchase. And I don't mean to bash an idea that would help the industry. But I certainly don't see it as anything that would clean up the roads significantly because I believe the assumptions are wrong about who would take advantage. Clunker drivers own what they do because they can't or won't make payments. The pent up demand for cars is less because of affordability than it is because of the availability to obtain credit. Or perhaps people are scared sh!tless that no matter which American brand they buy the manufacturer won't be around in a year or so. Unfounded fear, but fear none the less.

I'm sure I'm not the first with the nefarious idea of buying a $300-500 "clunker" to get my $5000 voucher for a new ride. And then what happens to the clunkers? Scrap yards overflowing with stuff nobody wants. Sacrifice the few for the greater good I suppose.

So you know I'm not all doom and gloom, how about we figure out how to license those mini Dmaxes and stuff em in H2s and sell 'em around the world? I'm having trouble getting GM to settle on a firm price for the Hummer brand...:wavey: :convertib:

HOWARD O
03-18-2009, 06:55 PM
Thank heavens, this is a great idea. I thought I'd never be able to unload this old gas guzzler. I never understood why they thought it was a good idea to put a 427 cubic inch engine in a lightweight fiberglass body back in 1967! No wonder I can't sell it! :rolleyes:


(no, I don't really own a 427 vette :rolleyes: )

roadtrip se
03-18-2009, 09:53 PM
coming up over hickory this weekend at the big lake...very much ready.

As for the clunker program, it will never see the light of day in this age, too much going on that can't be controlled by the plutocrats and can't be used to pull the people into the blessing of more government...Help business jump start the economy? Please...