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DickB
02-08-2009, 09:11 AM
I want to try adding trim tab controls to my steering wheel. I have factory-installed Bennett tabs with the tab switch on the dash to the right of the steering wheel. Outdrive trim control is on the throttle, which I find perfect. However, I have to take my right hand off the throttle to adjust the tabs. I think tab switches on the left side of the wheel, which could be operated by thumb, would work well – hands remain on wheel and throttle. I'd like to give that a try.

I don't like the idea of messing with clock springs or brushes to make wired electrical connections through the wheel. I think wireless is the way to go.

Livorsi has a wireless setup with a radio transmitter in the hub of the wheel and switches mounted to the wheel. I considered this, but rejected it for several reasons: it's expensive, Livorsi insists upon doing it for you, and it's irreversible without replacing the wheel. Lectrotab has a wireless switch setup, but it's meant to be attached to the dash and draws power through a wired connection, so that’s out. I like the ergonomics of the Insta-Trim tactile switch. I imagine a smaller version of that switch mounted to the spoke of the wheel, integrated with a wireless transmitter. I think it would be easy to slide a thumb over and raise or lower one or both tabs without diverting the eyes with a switch like that.

I’m implementing this concept using two devices: a switch assembly with a battery-powered wireless transmitter for the wheel and a wireless receiver/controller behind the dash that attaches to the Bennett wired switch.

For the wireless link I’m using Linx components. Linx makes easy-to-use radio-frequency (RF) modules, ICs, and component building blocks, as well as a few complete transmitters and receivers.

The receiver/controller, mounted behind the dash, receives the RF signal from the integrated switch on the steering wheel. It decodes the RF signal and simulates Bennett switch closures to the stock hard-wired system. The receiver/controller employs a Linx receiver module, decoder IC, some discrete components, and relays. The receiver/decoder converts the port/starboard up/down button presses into the proper pump active/pump reverse and port/starboard valve contact closures. I’m using common automotive relays in the controller, as these are capable of handling the Bennett system current loads and are relatively inexpensive. I have already assembled a breadboard proof-of-concept prototype, and have a few parts on order to complete a working prototype. I expect to have this completely built and working in one to two weeks.

Linx offers a few complete key fob transmitters for about $20 that are functionally perfect for this job. You probably have a fob like this in your pocket for your car. The fob uses small rubber switches that are not suitable for this application due to their size, shape, and tactile characteristics. I’m using the guts of the fob: a circuit board with battery holder and battery. I’m adding a circuit board on top of the Linx board that contains four tactile switches. On top of these I’m placing custom rocker switch caps. These components are all held in a custom enclosure.

I started working on the enclosure this weekend, and got much farther along than I expected. I hit on the idea of using PVC plumbing materials from the local hardware store for this. The plastic facilitates RF transmission, and PVC is relatively easy to work with basic hand tools. The enclosure is a pipe end cap and the switch caps are harvested from the side of larger one, making use of the sidewall curvature. The switch/transmitter is about 2” in diameter and 1” tall. It’s a bit bigger than it needs to be, as the PVC is over 1/8” thick, way more than it needs to be. I think the diameter is about right. Smaller switch caps would probably be harder to use. But the enclosure could be a lot thinner (not so tall), especially if a single, custom circuit board were used rather than the standard Linx board and added switch board.

I think a billet aluminum enclosure would look sharp, but this is beyond my current skills and tool set (anyone interested?). As the Linx transmitter guts employs an integrated antenna, the case needs to allow a path out for the RF energy. I think a billet aluminum case with plastic switch caps and a plastic base would work, especially if the base is offset or overhangs the metal spokes of the steering wheel, which it probably will in my case. The Linx RF components have a range of up to 1000 ft with proper antennas. Since I will be operating at only a few feet at most, the RF transmission can be heavily attenuated and still have plenty of margin to operate. So an aluminum case is a possibility. A small external antenna – just a length of wire – could also be employed.

I’m attaching some photos and hand drawings (I’m not CAD capable yet) of the switch/transmitter components.

You can probably see that a wide variety of sizes and shapes of the switch caps and case could be used. For example, the new Bennett euro or the Livorsi switch shapes could be emulated if that were preferred.

There was a thread a while back lamenting the fact that many projects are worked in secret and then sprung on the board when complete, as opposed to displaying and discussing works in progress. That thread prompted me to share my current project as a work in progress. Comments are welcome.

mjw930
02-08-2009, 09:37 AM
Very inventive project. I was looking at the Linx site and noticed they have a another transmitter that can be configured with 1 - 8 buttons and has the proper orientation for the up/down action you're looking for.

http://www.linxtechnologies.com/images/Products/OEM-Products/series/MS-Compact-Handheld-Transmitter.png

Getting one of these in a 6 button configuration would be easy to mount on a wheel spoke in a horizontal orientation and wouldn't require any fabrication. You cold have both tabs and the drive in one small package.

DickB
02-08-2009, 09:56 AM
Yes, that looks like a good choice. I'm not sure about the keypad, though - how easy it would be to locate the desired switch by feel. But I may get one and try it out.

Mr X
02-08-2009, 10:01 AM
Cool concept, I tought about it as well.
I did not do it because........
I was affraid that I might blow over backwards if my cell phone started ringing.

hot shot
02-08-2009, 10:06 AM
For top mount throttle only wayne at sunsation boats came up with a throttle with trim and tab switches built into it and he has given the rights to that to livorsi, its trick the trim is operated with your thumb and the tabs with your index finger... but only available in top mount.... I am thinking to switching my 22c to top mount just for that option.... there are pod's available to make the change.... just a thought Mick

mjw930
02-08-2009, 10:51 AM
For top mount throttle only wayne at sunsation boats came up with a throttle with trim and tab switches built into it and he has given the rights to that to livorsi, its trick the trim is operated with your thumb and the tabs with your index finger... but only available in top mount.... I am thinking to switching my 22c to top mount just for that option.... there are pod's available to make the change.... just a thought Mick

One thing to remember, if you use the pre-packaged products from Linx the total investment, apart from time, is about $80. Livorsi won't even pick up the phone for $80 ;)

hot shot
02-09-2009, 08:44 AM
you got that right

Lenny
02-09-2009, 10:25 AM
Tab control on top of the throttle was what I saw on the Blackhawk at Cumberland last year. Seemed to work VERY well.

MOP
02-09-2009, 10:32 AM
Curious what frequency these operate on, it could be some spooky if someone accidentally triggered the tabs a high speed. Not to spook anyone but I would be darn sure the frequency was far and away from the many items that use various ones. IMO on a fast boat I would stick with wired controls if these things could be triggered by something else.

Phil

Lenny
02-09-2009, 10:36 AM
Curious what frequency these operate on, it could be some spooky if someone accidentally triggered the tabs a high speed. Not to spook anyone but I would be darn sure the frequency was far and away from the many items that use various ones. IMO on a fast boat I would stick with wired controls if these things could be triggered by something else.

Phil

I agree Phil. My neighbour (500' away) has radio controlled race cars (small 18" ones.) Anyways, sometimes when he is playing with them the volume on my Denon reciever in the shop goes to MAX volume. !!! Scares the $hit out of me, (not to mention my sub-woofer and speakers)

I like the nailed connection way. :yes:

MOP
02-09-2009, 12:30 PM
I brought up the issue as many years ago I spent months and a fair bit of $$$ building a remote control airplane, I was a real nice plane to fly I had a ball for a few weekends. One weekend out of the blue I lost it, come to find out a kid of one of the other flyers was playing with a walkie talkie against what his father told him. Hi dad being a friend went out and bought me a new kit, I salvaged most all of the rest but down deep I was super crushed and never did put the kit together. Thinking about it I still hate the little Chit!!!!!!!!!

mjw930
02-09-2009, 01:41 PM
They have 3 versions of the product, each of them operating on either 315Mhz, 418Mhz or 433Mhz (standard frequencies in the US and Canada for garage and automotive remotes).

Each version has a security mechanism that will prevent the type of issues you are talking about. This is not the same as model airplane / boat remotes as it has a much shorter range and is designed to actuate a relay, not a servo.

HS FAMILY
The HS family is based on the Linx HS Series encoder and decoder. The HS Series uses CipherLinx(TM), a remote control encryption technology that provides ultimate RF security and unprecedented features. CipherLinx(TM) technology never sends or accepts the same packet twice, and changes codes with every packet sent. The HS series also provide a wide range of innovative features including the ability to establish user groups and button level permissions.

MS FAMILY
The MS family is based on the Linx MS Series encoder and decoder. The MS Series uses a random fixed address with 224 possible combinations to give a high level of uniqueness and a reasonable level of security. The address is created by the user with the press of a single button, eliminating the need for awkward DIP switches. MS series also provide a wide range of innovative features including the ability to establish user groups and button level permissions.

HOLTEK FAMILY
The Holtek family is based on the Holtek HT640 encoder and HT658 decoder. These allow the creation of up to 1,024 unique addresses set with DIP switches.

BUIZILLA
02-09-2009, 02:09 PM
speaking of transmitter's....

I figured out the garage door dip switch configuration of my aSShole neighbor's opener.... drives him nuts to watch it go up and down.... makes a perfect comedy scene... :pimp: :eek: :cool:

I think he has it disconnected now because I saw him open it manually yesterday :kingme:

sorry for the hijack :lookaroun:

Lenny
02-09-2009, 02:29 PM
You got too much time on your hands Jim. :yes: Let me guess, you have figured out the codes for his pets bark collar too ... :nilly:

BUIZILLA
02-09-2009, 02:47 PM
it was luck, my new opener has all 3 set to the top position of the three settings, right out of the box...

his must be also... :cool:

MOP
02-09-2009, 06:10 PM
speaking of transmitter's....

I figured out the garage door dip switch configuration of my aSShole neighbor's opener.... drives him nuts to watch it go up and down.... makes a perfect comedy scene... :pimp: :eek: :cool:

I think he has it disconnected now because I saw him open it manually yesterday :kingme:

sorry for the hijack :lookaroun:


U B Bad!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:rlol:

DickB
02-09-2009, 10:31 PM
Clearly, safety is a concern, which I have taken into consideration as I chose my design. As has already been stated, it is not just frequency but also a digital code that must match between transmitter and receiver.

I'm using 418MHz. Here's what Linx says about this frequency choice:
"418MHz is a good frequency to use in the U.S. as it is not very crowded. This gives the least likely chance for interference, therefore the best performance"

I'm using the MS series encoder/decoder. The receiver's decoder will only respond when the preprogrammed digital address or code matches. The possible address combinations are not 224 but 2 to the 24th power or over 16 million. It's extremely unlikely that another transmitter's address would match and could "take over" and move the tabs up or down. More likely but still rare would be another transmitter on the same frequency stepping on my transmitter. This is unlikely because of the physical proximity of my transmitter to the receiver versus the distance to an offending transmitter. Received power falls off at the square of distance, so the receiver sees 25 times the power from my transmitter 2 feet away as from an identical transmitter just 10 feet away. However, if another transmitter were broadcasting at the same time on the same frequency with sufficient power to interfere, without a digital address match the receiver would simply not respond. If that were to happen, I still have the wired switches on the dash, which would of course remain operational.

DickB
02-09-2009, 10:37 PM
If wireless tabs make you nervous, then this item is probably not for you:
http://www.yachtcontroller.com/

Lenny
02-09-2009, 11:02 PM
Sounds very cool :yes: I love the idea. I wish it worked for trim/tilt, throttle, running lights, tach, speed GPS, oil pressure, water temp, etc etc etc...

Say goodbye to wiring harnesses short of power to the senders.

Hope it works :yes:

BigGrizzly
02-10-2009, 10:12 AM
Sounds cool BUTTTT. I prefer thr hard wire system simple but effective Mine is mounted like a turn signal from bennett.

zelatore
02-10-2009, 06:35 PM
If wireless tabs make you nervous, then this item is probably not for you:
http://www.yachtcontroller.com/

I've installed a couple of those - pretty cool, and decent range. The last one I did as on a 42' Carver. I had it sitting about half way down a dock and I decided to see how far away I could get and still hit the thrusters. Eventually I was standing on the levee a good 250' away from the boat and still had control.

I briefly considered trying to drive the boat around the marina like a giant bathtub toy but thought better of it.

DickB
02-11-2009, 07:50 PM
Sounds cool BUTTTT. I prefer thr hard wire system simple but effective Mine is mounted like a turn signal from bennett.
I didn't see one on the Bennett site. Two levers for two tabs?

harbormaster
02-11-2009, 08:00 PM
livorsi wireless control does not work with bennett trim tabs.
Ben there.
Done that.
Got the t-shirt.

DickB
02-12-2009, 08:34 PM
livorsi wireless control does not work with bennett trim tabs.
Ben there.
Done that.
Got the t-shirt.
I'm curious - why exactly didn't it work?

DickB
02-12-2009, 09:02 PM
I completed assembly and checkout of my receiver circuit board. I’m just using a stock breadboard for now, so it’s not the prettiest, but functional. The RF module is on the underside of the board out of view. The board will drive four automotive relays, one each for pump pressure; pump reverse, port valve, and starboard valve. I temporarily connected some LEDs in place of the relays to verify operation. A simple ¼ wave wire antenna on the receiver seems to give more than enough range. The logic on the receiver board converts a single transmitter switch press into the two relay activations needed – e.g., press the top of the port rocker switch and the receiver board activates the pump pressure and port valve relays. Of course both port and starboard tab switches may be activated simultaneously, and the receiver responds with pump pressure, port valve, and starboard valve relays all activated. The relays will be wired so as to prevent an attempt to activate pump pressure and pump reverse simultaneously.

yeller
02-13-2009, 10:45 AM
I may want to replicate this some day. Do you mind posting a schematic with parts list?

Conquistador_del_mar
02-13-2009, 11:45 AM
I completed assembly and checkout of my receiver circuit board. I’m just using a stock breadboard for now, so it’s not the prettiest, but functional. The RF module is on the underside of the board out of view. The board will drive four automotive relays, one each for pump pressure; pump reverse, port valve, and starboard valve. I temporarily connected some LEDs in place of the relays to verify operation. A simple ¼ wave wire antenna on the receiver seems to give more than enough range. The logic on the receiver board converts a single transmitter switch press into the two relay activations needed – e.g., press the top of the port rocker switch and the receiver board activates the pump pressure and port valve relays. Of course both port and starboard tab switches may be activated simultaneously, and the receiver responds with pump pressure, port valve, and starboard valve relays all activated. The relays will be wired so as to prevent an attempt to activate pump pressure and pump reverse simultaneously.

I am getting a kick out of how you think outside the box and have a good understanding of electronics. You are reminding me of myself almost 30 years ago when I would design things like a MPG calculator display using inputs from a Flowscan gasoline sensor and driveshaft sensor. Things like what you are trying to develop might have a consumer market. Bill

DickB
02-13-2009, 09:46 PM
I actually have turned a few niche automotive electronic devices that I initially made for myself into low-volume hobby products. This one has a few challenges – for example, the components need to be FCC certified.

I’m happy to post the schematic. Actually, Lynx has already published most of it. I don’t have a parts list together yet, but I’ll get one eventually. Visit bipesauto.com/tabs (http://bipesauto.com/tabs)

yeller
02-14-2009, 12:05 AM
Excellent! Thanks for the link. Just what I was looking for.
What you're doing would be perfect for me as I have to drive my boat with the tabs. I'd love to keep my hand on the throttle, but true be told, 80% of the time it has to be on the rocker switches.

Trueser
02-14-2009, 07:34 AM
Another option would be a foot control wired.

Or what Gero has works for him.

wrussellw
02-14-2009, 09:01 AM
I have throttle and foot controls for my trim. Once you get used to the foot controls they are great