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View Full Version : Time to Move Up?



slapshot11
11-10-2008, 02:23 PM
I've been thinking about moving up to a bigger boat for a while and now something has come along. I really like the old school look of the Pantera 28's
and their reputation for a rock solid ride. One has become available in my area and has really got me to thinking about pulling the trigger.
Any sense for what a 22' Donzi Classic is worth these days? I know that some of you have seem the boat at Lake George. In fact several of you rode in it for last years Poker Run. It's the 1999, white hull with a black stripe, 502MAG EFI (415 HP) and about 250 hours. The Team Slapshot crew.
I know that the market stinks now but it works both ways.
I wouldn't be able to run with you guys in the Lake George Classic Donzi Club Poker Run but maybe a could I be a card stop instead.
What do you think?

jl1962
11-10-2008, 02:36 PM
Norm -

Don't do it!
Don't leave the Classic Family. Besides, if you think your boat is too small, take a ride w/ me! I'll show what too little boat feels like! :shocking:

Besides, with a Donzi - you don't just get a boat, you get all of us! :bonk::yes: :wink:

-Jay

VetteLT193
11-10-2008, 02:40 PM
There is a 2000 on boattrader asking 22k. It seems that the 22's get to a point and the prices are based on how nice and what power instead of age...

you see mid 80's boats in the mid 20's all the time but they are all redone and have more power. I just saw a nice '86 for 10k asking. the late 90's boats I haven't seen one for less than the high teens and tend to max out (stock) in the mid to upper 20's.

I'd think in really nice shape you'll be in the 25k (asking) area, but I don't know the boat personally so take if for what it's worth... I also do my searching in the south east so that could be a factor ...

VetteLT193
11-10-2008, 02:41 PM
Oh, and another 'keep it' factor is you can probably keep it for another 10+ years and not lose a dime...

roadtrip se
11-10-2008, 03:43 PM
To answer the man's question, this boat is a very, very nice 502 22. I would put it at about a 9.5 out of 10. I've ridden in it. No hops, no strange noises, and gorgeous. I would peg it somewhere in the $27-29 range, not knowing what it has for a trailer under it.

Norm, if you must step up, then really step up and go twins. A single engine beast in the 25-30 foot range with stock, reliable power is going to be an absolute tank getting onto plane, slower punch in the mid-range, and probably right around the same top end. I am sure several folks here with this sort of boat will jump in to defend their choice, but the truth hurts. I've been there having owned a 27 Fountain with a 500HP. I lasted a year in this dog, before I stepped up to a 32 with 500s and got a boat that had some snap.

If you got the itch, I would look at the Scorpion Donzi 28. It is an impressive package, gets up and goes, has great mid-range and top end, and won't eat your lunch in fuel economy.

That or just stay in what you have and enjoy. You can always hop into the HP wars with us fools and put a hurt on Haver next year. Cheaper than buying a new boat!

My two bits...

Dr. Dan
11-10-2008, 04:03 PM
:angel:Norm I am absolutley right there with you...I have gone back and forth and I keep coming up with no matter what I am keeping the Classic. I know no matter what I would regret selling it the second I did.

So as the money is not that big of deal for us successful bastards...just buy the 28 or another boat and use it as you see fit. You need to really evaluate how you want to use the new boat...otherwise it will just become a bigger 22 and you don't need that.

I too have been seriously looking at the exact same thing....its painful to be sure.

Good Luck

Danny :shades:

fast fun 2
11-10-2008, 04:25 PM
Norm, this is Johnny, Jasons son. The guy with the pantera is Elite Marine on oso if it helps. That will be a real nice runner. :cool:

slapshot11
11-10-2008, 08:29 PM
Man,...you guys are making this even tougher than I thought. :bonk:
Johnny, you're right, that's one of them in the mix.

dp2002mt
11-10-2008, 08:32 PM
does any one know what size the gauges are used in the new 18 ft donzi classic,im looking to update my gauges and want to use the same size as the new boats,livorsi gauges, thanx for your help

mjw930
11-10-2008, 08:35 PM
does any one know what size the gauges are used in the new 18 ft donzi classic,im looking to update my gauges and want to use the same size as the new boats,livorsi gauges, thanx for your help

:hijack:

You might want to try posting this in a separate thread......

mjw930
11-10-2008, 08:47 PM
A clean 10 year old stock boat is a mid $20's boat with a decent trailer. A new, custom trailer and some adds like external steering or aftermarket exhaust might push it in to the upper $20's but only to the right buyer.

In the 28' range any of the classic 24 degree traditional hull boats are going to be mid 60's performers on stock merc power. 500 hp will get you into the low 70's unless you find a lightened race layup. It will take 600+ HP in a 28' Pantera to break into the 80's.

OTOH, there are plenty of modified bottom boats in the 26' - 30' range that will run very well on one motor. You might want to look at a late '90's, early 2000's vintage Velocity 280 (26' + platform) or a Super Boat 30' (Y2K model). With singles in the 500HP range they are 80 mph boats in pleasure configuration. At full song these boats will use 30% - 40% less fuel than a 28 Donzi with twin scorps.

BUIZILLA
11-10-2008, 08:55 PM
there's an extremely clean 28 Powerplay down here with 500's, that right, twins... :wink: tad over 30k will buy it..

not that I would jump.... :eek:

The Hedgehog
11-10-2008, 11:08 PM
To answer the man's question, this boat is a very, very nice 502 22. I would put it at about a 9.5 out of 10. I've ridden in it. No hops, no strange noises, and gorgeous. I would peg it somewhere in the $27-29 range, not knowing what it has for a trailer under it.
Norm, if you must step up, then really step up and go twins. A single engine beast in the 25-30 foot range with stock, reliable power is going to be an absolute tank getting onto plane, slower punch in the mid-range, and probably right around the same top end. I am sure several folks here with this sort of boat will jump in to defend their choice, but the truth hurts. I've been there having owned a 27 Fountain with a 500HP. I lasted a year in this dog, before I stepped up to a 32 with 500s and got a boat that had some snap.
If you got the itch, I would look at the Scorpion Donzi 28. It is an impressive package, gets up and goes, has great mid-range and top end, and won't eat your lunch in fuel economy.
That or just stay in what you have and enjoy. You can always hop into the HP wars with us fools and put a hurt on Haver next year. Cheaper than buying a new boat!
My two bits...

The truth hurts? Tex and I both have 10-15 mph on the Scorp ZX's ANY day.

And I can walk off and leave a 27 Fountain with a 500hp like it is going backwards. Got a warranty too.

I do agree with you on the stock thing though and big single beasts are not for everyone.

For me it was to do something different. I wanted to go real fast and do it on one. It is not really any cheaper. At least to get to 80 or so. If you want to run in the 90's with Scorps you would have to drop some coin. I would love to see someone do it. It would be a cool project and I have heard rumors about it. If I was romping on it in big water I would probably think long and hard about twins. Lake Cumberland is about as big as it gets for me and my single will take that in style.

I would do a big single again

mattyboy
11-11-2008, 08:21 AM
Norm,

DON"T DO IT selling my classic was one of the biggest mistakes I have made
never mind the money for the gas in a 28 footer just think about the money spent in a wardrobe change I mean the embroidery to have those big green eyes put on a black shirt and what will the new team name be team putty tat or something like that. ;)


seriously i do regret selling the classic but i also know i have a need for something bigger and not quite a 28 i was looking at a 24 deep v and having spent some time around the Pantera guys last year up in lake george they do have the same type of comradary that we have and the boats do run well and do have classic lines
true you can't run with us in the spring in Lk George but I think I could work on the committee to let you do a card stop but you would need a blindfold or something to cover your eyes but there would be no reason why you would not be welcomed at the fall picnic ;)

either way don't retire the team uniforms ;)

good luck

Dr. Dan
11-11-2008, 08:57 AM
:shades:Norm... consider that there is nothing quite like the 22 Classic for a drivers boat...and I agree with Roadtrip on the value range?

Are you going to tow the new boat..if soooo what ya got to Tow it with? Don't say the Jeep? I would keep looking for another boat and keep the 22.

Unless you are under some time contraint to pull the trigger ... take your time..and you will find some nice boats...

I have been looking for 5 months or so...and I can't believe the choices. I have looked at Pantera, Active Thunders, Formula, Fountains and Cigs. Odds are I am going to pass for now, timing isn't right - among other things.:angel:

So I will likely have to suffer with a Z06 or a Shelby GT 500 instead...I will try to suck it up...but it will be tough.:kingme:

Anonymous :wink:

SilverBack
11-11-2008, 09:12 AM
To answer the man's question, this boat is a very, very nice 502 22. I would put it at about a 9.5 out of 10. I've ridden in it. No hops, no strange noises, and gorgeous. I would peg it somewhere in the $27-29 range, not knowing what it has for a trailer under it.

Norm, if you must step up, then really step up and go twins. A single engine beast in the 25-30 foot range with stock, reliable power is going to be an absolute tank getting onto plane, slower punch in the mid-range, and probably right around the same top end. I am sure several folks here with this sort of boat will jump in to defend their choice, but the truth hurts. I've been there having owned a 27 Fountain with a 500HP. I lasted a year in this dog, before I stepped up to a 32 with 500s and got a boat that had some snap.

If you got the itch, I would look at the Scorpion Donzi 28. It is an impressive package, gets up and goes, has great mid-range and top end, and won't eat your lunch in fuel economy.

That or just stay in what you have and enjoy. You can always hop into the HP wars with us fools and put a hurt on Haver next year. Cheaper than buying a new boat!

My two bits...


A clean 10 year old stock boat is a mid $20's boat with a decent trailer. A new, custom trailer and some adds like external steering or aftermarket exhaust might push it in to the upper $20's but only to the right buyer.

In the 28' range any of the classic 24 degree traditional hull boats are going to be mid 60's performers on stock merc power. 500 hp will get you into the low 70's unless you find a lightened race layup. It will take 600+ HP in a 28' Pantera to break into the 80's.

OTOH, there are plenty of modified bottom boats in the 26' - 30' range that will run very well on one motor. You might want to look at a late '90's, early 2000's vintage Velocity 280 (26' + platform) or a Super Boat 30' (Y2K model). With singles in the 500HP range they are 80 mph boats in pleasure configuration. At full song these boats will use 30% - 40% less fuel than a 28 Donzi with twin scorps.


RT...My 25 ran 65 MPH with the stock 502 MAG. That is not too bad for a stock engine. I think that it would have gone high 70's or 80 with just the Procharger upgrade. I do agree that some of the bigger deep v cabin boats are not that sporty though in their stock configuration.

MJW...I agree with you totally...I would have been better off with a Velocity or Eliminator but I love Donzi's.

The Hedgehog
11-11-2008, 09:16 AM
RT...My 25 ran 65 MPH with the stock 502 MAG. That is not too bad for a stock engine. I think that it would have gone high 70's or 80 with just the Procharger upgrade. I do agree that some of the bigger deep v cabin boats are not that sporty though in their stock configuration.

MJW...I agree with you totally...I would have been better off with a Velocity or Eliminator but I love Donzi's.

I am not sure that the Velocity has quite the ride quality cruising across snotty water at 60 mph as my 26ZX.

Once Silverback gets it ironed out he should be one of the faster singles.

SilverBack
11-11-2008, 09:24 AM
I am not sure that the Velocity has quite the ride quality cruising across snotty water at 60 mph as my 26ZX.

Once Silverback gets it ironed out he should be one of the faster singles.


Thanks Hedge Hog!! On the lakes that I run on ride is NOT a problem!!

They were having the bass boat races the other day when I went to the lake and in the few minutes that I was on the water I ran down several of those 100 MPH bass boats and they all went and docked up until I left. The wind was gusting up to over 35 MPH and it was very hard for them to run. I guess some times a 25 that will go around 80 can beat a 100 MPH bass boat!!

The Hedgehog
11-11-2008, 09:44 AM
Well, you also need to bring some reality to the discussion. Sure, a seriously modded single can beat stock twins. But, there is no way a heavily modded single is going to run without issues nearly as long as a stock twins boat.
Int the end, your final decision depends on your budget, and your tolerance for pain.

The biggie is drives.

Shanghied Again
11-11-2008, 09:55 AM
I made the move up trail if I went back to do it all over again, I would buy a 22 Classic. I miss my 22ZX the boat was just a lot of fun. I have a 16 outboard that I am going to get ready this winter so I can trailer with ease.
I now have a Donzi 33ZX that I love but limited to use. With a bigger boat comes, Bigger truck, Bigger gas Tank, Bigger expense. Example!
Poker Run $750 or better entrance fee.. Hotel $250 night, Towing depending where $120 close $800 far. Drinking and eating $1000 and the biggest gasoline for the boat $1200 a typical Poker Run can cost me $3,820. Ouch!
When I had my 22 running from NJ to Kentucky was only $1500 total. I use to be out every weekend running my 22 and it if it was today would cost about $120 to run Now its over $750 to run my 33ZX for the weekend. I go to coves now and hang out to keep the cost down, so I lost having the fun of blasting around the bay. Keep your 22 believe me if I sold the 33ZX thats the boat I would buy.

SilverBack
11-11-2008, 09:55 AM
Well, you also need to bring some reality to the discussion. Sure, a seriously modded single can beat stock twins. But, there is no way a heavily modded single is going to run without issues nearly as long as a stock twins boat.

Int the end, your final decision depends on your budget, and your tolerance for pain.

Poodle..you are right but just remember that when it comes to Hedge Hog, Tex and myself ..... REALITY and even SANITY very rarely come into the picture. If it did we would not have our boats.

BUIZILLA
11-11-2008, 10:44 AM
you won't gain anything in usable cockp1t space.... :popcorn:

BigGrizzly
11-11-2008, 10:49 AM
Norm I will be blunt, Don't do it. There are several reasons to do it but 1,000's why no to.

undertaker
11-11-2008, 01:26 PM
I made the move up trail if I went back to do it all over again, I would buy a 22 Classic. I miss my 22ZX the boat was just a lot of fun. I have a 16 outboard that I am going to get ready this winter so I can trailer with ease.
I now have a Donzi 33ZX that I love but limited to use. With a bigger boat comes, Bigger truck, Bigger gas Tank, Bigger expense. Example!
Poker Run $750 or better entrance fee.. Hotel $250 night, Towing depending where $120 close $800 far. Drinking and eating $1000 and the biggest gasoline for the boat $1200 a typical Poker Run can cost me $3,820. Ouch!
When I had my 22 running from NJ to Kentucky was only $1500 total. I use to be out every weekend running my 22 and it if it was today would cost about $120 to run Now its over $750 to run my 33ZX for the weekend. I go to coves now and hang out to keep the cost down, so I lost having the fun of blasting around the bay. Keep your 22 believe me if I sold the 33ZX thats the boat I would buy.


Very well said.....I owned and 28ZX and 33ZX and Frank is right on:nilly::nilly:...I now own a 22 classic and am having a ball with it.....

Good Luck in your decision..:):)

Undertaker:)

fast fun 2
11-11-2008, 03:01 PM
Norm, if it helps our Avanti is the same bottom as a 28 Magnum, which the 28 Panter was moldeld after. Id be happy to take you for a rip. I took Jay for a ride, I think he liked it.:yes: lol

jl1962
11-11-2008, 04:21 PM
That was a nice ride John. :) Mostly I enjoyed just watching you run the boat- at 15, you're a better driver than most of us will ever be - myself included.:yes:

But back to the thread.......Norm, I have 20 guitars and one of them is always just right. If you can have an entire fleet of boats (SM, MED, LG, XL), go for it! If you're gonna have just one, a 22 is tough to beat in terms of performance, affordability, fun (remember fun?) and ease of use.

Matty - don't despair....your next Donzi is just around the corner and it's a buyer's market.

JL

The Hedgehog
11-11-2008, 07:50 PM
Poodle..you are right but just remember that when it comes to Hedge Hog, Tex and myself ..... REALITY and even SANITY very rarely come into the picture. If it did we would not have our boats.

Word!

Yeah yea, I know that it costs more to overhaul my engine and I get to do the top every 200 hours and won't get 600 hours on my bottom end. But there is NOTHING like the sound of our 800+ hp big blocks. Or that surge when you lean into it at 75 mph.

Some of these guys are just to responsible. That needs to be understood when dealing with folks like us:pimp::smileybo::drinkbeer::pimptwo:

The Hedgehog
11-11-2008, 08:13 PM
Responsible? Your barking up the wrong tree there sir, just ask anyone here that knows my boats and I.... :kingme:

I have heard rumors about that:shocking:

Stein
11-15-2008, 02:20 PM
Slapshot - PM sent.

Brent

bob haver
11-16-2008, 08:40 AM
To answer the man's question, this boat is a very, very nice 502 22. I would put it at about a 9.5 out of 10. I've ridden in it. No hops, no strange noises, and gorgeous. I would peg it somewhere in the $27-29 range, not knowing what it has for a trailer under it.

Norm, if you must step up, then really step up and go twins. A single engine beast in the 25-30 foot range with stock, reliable power is going to be an absolute tank getting onto plane, slower punch in the mid-range, and probably right around the same top end. I am sure several folks here with this sort of boat will jump in to defend their choice, but the truth hurts. I've been there having owned a 27 Fountain with a 500HP. I lasted a year in this dog, before I stepped up to a 32 with 500s and got a boat that had some snap.

If you got the itch, I would look at the Scorpion Donzi 28. It is an impressive package, gets up and goes, has great mid-range and top end, and won't eat your lunch in fuel economy.

That or just stay in what you have and enjoy. You can always hop into the HP wars with us fools and put a hurt on Haver next year. Cheaper than buying a new boat!

My two bits...
norm DON'T DO IT your boat is beautiful, you will never see this happen EVER again in our life time but smacker aka todd is right on the price, that will be the only time i will ever agree with (THE SMACKER)!!!!
btw SMACKER YEA YOU TODD you need to bring your boat to put a hurt on me:bonk::shocking::cool::boat:

hot shot
11-16-2008, 09:32 AM
Ya... With that totally stock 502
My vote.... DON'T DO IT... I'm with poodle & gris and the bays

hot shot
11-16-2008, 09:34 AM
My typin needs a little burshin up sorry griz and the boys

bob haver
11-16-2008, 09:51 AM
yea mick its stock,btw beautiful job on yours love it now we can't let norm sell his ride:nilly:

roadtrip se
11-16-2008, 10:55 AM
btw SMACKER YEA YOU TODD you need to bring your boat to put a hurt on me:bonk::shocking::cool::boat:

to get focused on putting a little work into the SE over the winter, after buying our SS cruiser.

Exactly what I needed, thank you.

the Smacker...

Air 22
11-16-2008, 01:09 PM
Norm...don't do it...you have a great boat...:wink: :yes: You dont wanna have regrets.....although they do say the the 2 happiest days owning a boat are the day u buy it....and the day u sell it...:nilly:

hold on to it.....:yes:

bob haver
11-16-2008, 01:10 PM
to get focused on putting a little work into the SE over the winter, after buying our SS cruiser.

Exactly what I needed, thank you.

the Smacker...
hey smacker talk to bravo 2 i think he might be able to help you on a flight to glens falls through net jets:yes: NORM DON'T DO IT