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Le 3ieme Moo
07-10-2008, 06:22 PM
Hey all,

I have a Classic 16 with the stock 190HP Merc. I'd like to upgrade. Looking for better hole shot and easier trim. It's a real pain to get a flat ride as is now. Would the best bet be the current Merc 260 and would trim tabs help?

Thanks!

LM

smokediver
07-10-2008, 06:33 PM
dude ... leave it alone !!! LOL ... :smash:

Donziweasel
07-10-2008, 06:44 PM
I have a new 355 cid coming to replace my Merc 5.7L in my 16. It only has 260 hours and is around 330 hp. Let me know is you are interested.

smokediver
07-10-2008, 07:14 PM
ohhh... the wiring harness is different between a fuel injected set up and a carbed one .. i think it is a 9 pin connector and only 8 are used in the carbed set up ...the 9th pin is low oil pressure/ overheat buzzer ... just something to think about ...

mike o
07-10-2008, 08:22 PM
I have a 95 16 with a 4.3 /4 barrel. Id love to have the v8 thru hull. I tried to find a v8 to buy but none around at the time. Im happy with the 4.3 overall. Id sell mine and look around for one like smoke divers old ride... all changed over for 10k, before i would rip mine apart. I guess the 350 isnt much faster or can be slower (so I have read on posts) than a 4.3. If ya gonna go for it ... might as well go for the stroker, and get it over with. That seems to be the trend, If ya got the $$$$$$

glashole
07-11-2008, 07:10 AM
why don't you just try to add tabs first?

BigGrizzly
07-11-2008, 09:52 AM
Tabs can help to tailor the ride for you. As for the 260 engine package it is a common and inexpensive upgrade. Some people here get carried away with horse power on the small Donzis. Our 16 has a 302 FVord in it and we are happy with it just the way it is.

Donziweasel
07-11-2008, 10:08 AM
I admit I am a little power hungry. 390 hp in a 16 should be fun though. I would think 190 horse is not very much in a 16 though considering they offered engines from the factory up to 270 horse.

My Mercruiser is a 1997 with Vortec Heads, Edelbrock manifold, Comp 264 cam, 600 CFM Holey double Pumper. I am only looking for 1500.00 for it with 260 hours.

BTW, the 260 in a set and forget drive, right? If so, tabs would be a HUGE improvememt in my opinion. Heck, they a re huge improvement with a trimmable drive.

Sweet little 16
07-11-2008, 04:41 PM
the factory offered the 16 with a 290 hp sbf and a 330 hp and a 350 hp sbc options back in the day

smallblockford
07-12-2008, 04:07 PM
back in the day that was flywheel horsepower today the manufactures rate it at the prop shaft it helped out insurance for a little while. so what is 190 today would be a little more.

4.3 is a good moter i like the over kill of a built 350 but that isnt for everyone.

who ever says a 350 swap is cheep needs to rethink that saying even if you do it yourself and own a marina.

i am still working on mine. bought a shell of a 16 for 4000$ and i think i have 20,000 in it an i am not done.

smallblockford
07-12-2008, 04:12 PM
350 swap takes exhaust manifolds different ignition module, diff gear ratio in drive or prop switching sometimes both, a wiring harness is nothing.

i think i would do some tabs like someone else suggested and if i wanted speed i would take the heads and mill them freshen up the valves and put it back down but that isnt worhth it,

my father who has been around boats forever used to allways say back when we were selling bajas now i am doing checkmates that once you hit a certain speed it takes a lot of horsepower to gain a couple of mile an hour. i have seen guys buid big blocks in 235 bajas up another 100hp and only get 2 mile an hour. but it sure is fun trying to beet the odds

Le 3ieme Moo
07-13-2008, 01:51 AM
why don't you just try to add tabs first?

Yep .. Who makes the best kit?

m

mike o
07-13-2008, 08:33 AM
350 swap takes exhaust manifolds different ignition module, diff gear ratio in drive or prop switching sometimes both, a wiring harness is nothing.

i think i would do some tabs like someone else suggested and if i wanted speed i would take the heads and mill them freshen up the valves and put it back down but that isnt worhth it,

my father who has been around boats forever used to allways say back when we were selling bajas now i am doing checkmates that once you hit a certain speed it takes a lot of horsepower to gain a couple of mile an hour. i have seen guys buid big blocks in 235 bajas up another 100hp and only get 2 mile an hour. but it sure is fun trying to beet the odds
So for the non mechanical types like myself.... If I wanted to buy weasels motor for example... His carbed motor to replace my 4.3, (carbed) . I would need a different wiring harness? Would the motor mounts have to be relocated? Any expense issues with the bolt up to the 4.3 drive train, to keep it thur prop exhaust (like to like ), same y pipe (since all 4.3 are stock thru prop (to my knowlege), besides buying a new prop ??? And I guess new exhaust manifolds, v-8 ignition module, since I guess he's keeping his old ones. what would the labor cost be for the swap with all nessesary parts???? just ballpark guess. Then I can divide the upgrade costs by the mph gain, or better more powerfull..... or selling mine and up grading to a newer fuel injected v-8 year 16.............

Donziweasel
07-13-2008, 08:40 AM
Not sure, might have to move motor mounts. I have a lot of time in this engine. I finally got it screaming and running really well. Out of the hole it is fast, but from 40-50 mph, it is amazing. Oil Pressure 40 psi when first started, drops to 22 at idle after running a while. Temp never above 160. Always run in fresh, cool, mountain water.

smallblockford
07-13-2008, 08:53 AM
moter mounts move forward, exhaust horns are the same. i will try to dig up the prices on the parts. 2 v 8 exhaust manifolds, one ignition module i think they are around 300$. if it was me i would put the silent choice to it if you have to be quite in some places thru hulls are part of the fun of the v8.

smallblockford
07-13-2008, 08:56 AM
ohhh... the wiring harness is different between a fuel injected set up and a carbed one .. i think it is a 9 pin connector and only 8 are used in the carbed set up ...the 9th pin is low oil pressure/ overheat buzzer ... just something to think about ...

i think your harness would be correct but there would be nothing to modifing it to work. i am in the process of doing my 16 now. i will count the pins on the connecter i thought they would be the same early mercs had less pins. of corse the newest harness that came out a few years ago is different but there are adapters made from merc.

mike o
07-13-2008, 10:35 AM
Not sure, might have to move motor mounts. I have a lot of time in this engine. I finally got it screaming and running really well. Out of the hole it is fast, but from 40-50 mph, it is amazing. Oil Pressure 40 psi when first started, drops to 22 at idle after running a while. Temp never above 160. Always run in fresh, cool, mountain water.
Im sure your motor is great, I was kinda putting in perspective using your motor as and example (which sounds like a hell-of-a- deal). for moo, and what golden-rod meant in his post, spending alot of $$$ going down this change- over ,in real dollars and cents for people like myself who own only an adjustable wrench....... having owned v8 straight inboard ski boats and wooden boats with v8, I kinda miss the sound - power. I looked for 2 yrs for a super clean 16 at the right price, color, ect and couldnt find one with the v-8 and bought the 4.3. So, after a year with the quiet 4.3 and its hull capabilitys I feel MY 16 is underpowered.....and, I would consider going down this road. But I have a few issues, a 2 mile no wake zone to get out on squam lake here in N.H.... switchable exhuast is ILLEGAL (for some stupid reason), strickly inforced 92 decabel ( there goes the stroker out the window) noise law, and kinda waspie H20 5-0, and a 40mph speed limit on the lake, which they let ya do 50ish, ( I try for 60 when nobody's lookinnnnnng). I wonder, when its all said and done what the $$$ would be.. change it or buy an 2000ish 5.0. efi?????????

Donziweasel
07-13-2008, 11:09 AM
I waited until I found the right 16 also. My two criteria, other than being a good clean boat, were a v-8 and thru hull exhuast. Mine actually came with the 5.7L, I think it was the last year they offered it (1997), now it is a 4.3 or 5.0. The only problem was the boat ran high 50's in Iowa, where it came from, and a miserable 47 mph at my altitude. Hence the mods. 270hp(sea level) to 330 hp(sea level).

I am just looking to get something out of the engine. If anyone in interested, make me an offer.

smallblockford
07-13-2008, 04:35 PM
dont waste your time with a 5.0 all you are doing is adding wheight not much more power i dont think any more in my opinion for the wheight it is the same wheight as a 5.7 but the 5.7 makes more torque and power. switchable exhaust is supposed to be illegel in all the states if it is over the decibal limit open. i have brand new checkmates that have corsa switchable it is called quick but quite call corsa they can prob tell you about how to get around that. there are diff tips. this stuff is not cheap.

mike o
07-13-2008, 07:26 PM
I agree totally on the non net gain of the 5.0L on the newer 16's than mine. thats y weasels motor is such a great deal for an up grade for somebody

Donziweasel
07-13-2008, 08:10 PM
I agree in the 4.3 vs. the 5.0. Power gain is only 30-40 hp, but weight gain is way more. Stay with the 4.3. Someone on these boards actually had a supercharged one. You don't see many 5.0 boats, but a hell of a lot of 4.3's. Had my 16 out today, ran great. My engine would push you well north of 60 mph.

Donziweasel
07-14-2008, 08:07 AM
Not illegal in WY, ID or MT either. They have decible limits, but I have nver heard of them being enforced.

They are definetly illegal in NH. Was reading another board and they said that dealers will not sell a boat with switchable if it is going to be operated in NH.

gold-n-rod
07-14-2008, 09:39 AM
I agree in the 4.3 vs. the 5.0. Power gain is only 30-40 hp, but weight gain is way more. Stay with the 4.3.

Sorry, but yours and my experiences are NOT the same.

The only mod to my 16 w/5.0 is the GLM manifolds, thus saving +/- 100#. She runs 62 on GPS. Show me a 4.3 that will do that!!!!!! BTW, she ran just a tick under 60 with the iron boat anchor manifolds, so the GLMs got me 3 mphs.

If the 4.3's are so great, why do we see so many owners looking to hop them up?

While I would forgo the 5.0 for a 5.7 IF I was upgrading, there's no need to trash talk the 5.0's that Donzi is currently offering. It's a fine combo.

Donziweasel
07-14-2008, 10:21 AM
No offense meant Gold-n-rod. I guess I meant that if you were going to convert a 4.3, go to a 5.7, not a 5.0. The money will be about the same, but the 5.7 doesn't weight much mor than the 5.0 but has better performance. I agree the 5.0 is faster, and seems to run in the upper 50's to low 60's, but the 4.3 can run mid-50's.

Damn, people are testy around here these days.

mike o
07-14-2008, 11:00 AM
Not illegal in WY, ID or MT either. They have decible limits, but I have nver heard of them being enforced.

They are definetly illegal in NH. Was reading another board and they said that dealers will not sell a boat with switchable if it is going to be operated in NH.
I guess its legal on the boat, but its Illegal if they are operable...... This is what i was told when I inquired about having them installed and coverted to thru hull....Then I read some posts (on this wealth of information site), that had I invested in this.... I would have the 4.3 tru hull tractor tone and bagged the whole Idea....(which I havent heard yet by the way, before I ruffle anybodys feathers would does).... This is where Im at, and y Im interested in this topic. It is beyond me what legislator woke up and tought this law is nessesary...... I know sombody that has to go through 5-6 no wake zones on (WINNI) to let her rip. I would THINK , the switch to quiet, would be considerate TO all the neighbors, if you had say a barely legal exhast, on a hot summer nite, where you can here everybodys conversation across the lake............

BigGrizzly
07-14-2008, 11:18 AM
What really happens is there are some really loud boats out there, so several complaints are lodged, politicians get a hold of this and have no idea what a decibel is and read a book and decide what is ok:eek!: then pass something just to do it. Then there is the pwc thing of pollution the legislators get confused with air vs noise pollution- a real term. and ban them for the wrong reason. Law is a wonderful thing.:smash::smash::smash:

mike o
07-14-2008, 11:44 AM
What really happens is there are some really loud boats out there, so several complaints are lodged, politicians get a hold of this and have no idea what a decibel is and read a book and decide what is ok:eek!: then pass something just to do it. Then there is the pwc thing of pollution the legislators get confused with air vs noise pollution- a real term. and ban them for the wrong reason. Law is a wonderful thing.:smash::smash::smash:
totally sir. The early noisey jet skis, I had one of course (untill it got banned). all most put themself out of business untill the manufactures figured out they had to make them quiet, because they where getting kicked off all the lakes, (around here away).... Now there everywhere , and 3 times as powerfull and really quiet.........

The Hedgehog
07-14-2008, 11:50 AM
Sorry, but yours and my experiences are NOT the same.
The only mod to my 16 w/5.0 is the GLM manifolds, thus saving +/- 100#. She runs 62 on GPS. Show me a 4.3 that will do that!!!!!! BTW, she ran just a tick under 60 with the iron boat anchor manifolds, so the GLMs got me 3 mphs.
If the 4.3's are so great, why do we see so many owners looking to hop them up?
While I would forgo the 5.0 for a 5.7 IF I was upgrading, there's no need to trash talk the 5.0's that Donzi is currently offering. It's a fine combo.

No problem. I got a 4.3 that will do that down in Bama. What do you want to know about it?:smash:

glashole
07-14-2008, 11:56 AM
Yep .. Who makes the best kit?

m

I cannot answer who would make the best kit but you don't need anything special for a 16

others should chime in who have experience but I am sure your local marina could help you out, and install them for a reasonable cost

I would assume a set of bennett tabs would be just fine

good luck

I had a 16 and switched from a 4.3 to a 5.0
should have left it and saved the money or gone to a 5.7
it did go faster (maybe 5mph) and hop out of the hole faster etc
but if i were to do it again it would definitely be the 350 i would go to
or a 383......

mike o
07-14-2008, 12:09 PM
No problem. I got a 4.3 that will do that down in Bama. What do you want to know about it?:smash:
well if he dosent, I sure do... this is gettin good, 4.3 guys stickin up for themselfs, come-onnnn.........

The Hedgehog
07-14-2008, 12:51 PM
http://www.donzi.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=29315&d=1180793637

And now when the Vortec gets installed?

CrackerJack
07-14-2008, 10:45 PM
A V-8 has a better sound with thru-hull exhaust.
In my humble, and most accurate opinion.

GeneD
07-15-2008, 09:08 AM
You can use the same ignition module. It's got a better spark advance curve than the V-8.

cgentile
07-15-2008, 06:36 PM
I run a 4.3 in my 16 with Corsa headers... i have two props a 21 pitch for grunt, and the 25 pitch which i really love..
Trims tabs fix the porpoise problem for sure and are great for wakeboarders and leveling out the boat in turns with a load. And once you get above that 30mph it goes away i find.. :canada:

Just get the tabs and give it a go , you could always upgrade the motor after that , or get 18 with a nice big block!

smallblockford
07-15-2008, 06:47 PM
You can use the same ignition module. It's got a better spark advance curve than the V-8.
sensor in the distributer yes module ha i want to know were you came up with that, cuz it dont work right on the module it is stamped v 6 or v8 and next to that will be a 22 or what ever the total advance is

BUIZILLA
07-15-2008, 06:56 PM
it works.........................

however the TOTAL timing MUST be checked carefully

but it works

and works very well

smokediver
07-15-2008, 08:18 PM
sensor in the distributer yes module ha i want to know were you came up with that, cuz it dont work right on the module it is stamped v 6 or v8 and next to that will be a 22 or what ever the total advance is
the V6 module in the tbolt4 works very well with a V8 ... what gene said ..

smallblockford
07-16-2008, 07:23 AM
the v 6 i beleive has 14 dedree advance and the v8 module has 22 and a 24 advance, they use the 22 on 525 merc racing sc moters.

i have never heard of the v 6 on v8 modules working i was always taught to look and make sure it was for a 6 or an 8 although i will admit i havnt tried it

i will tell you i am not running it on my new build, i have to much compression and i am afraid that a goofy advance or a cyl firing wrong i would prob burn a hole in a piston with my luck.

modules retail for 244.76 and up

factory merc manifolds retail for 166.58 that are ecoted that is each
i would run eddie marine headers instead but they cost more
there is other aftermarket companys

and then move moter mounts have fun fiting it . every thing should swap i know forsure alll your altanator, powerstearing is the same brackets and belts swithch them over and away you go.

i would prob charge you around 800 to 900 to do it if both moters were running not just built. meaning swapping parts and both moters were all ready hot tested.

smallblockford
07-16-2008, 07:26 AM
that is with out the thru hulls know in my personal apinion putting the 8 in with out that is kinda like having a 32 ford with catalitic converters.

i like the sound put muffled tips on it

although it is easy to bolt it up with the horns and no holes.

4.3 to a 5.0 is not enough stock moter to stock moter to go through the trouble that is a fact.

5.0 with thru hulls does sound better but not a speed difference worth the time.

joseph m. hahnl
07-17-2008, 04:54 PM
Hey all,

I have a Classic 16 with the stock 190HP Merc. I'd like to upgrade. Looking for better hole shot and easier trim. It's a real pain to get a flat ride as is now. Would the best bet be the current Merc 260 and would trim tabs help?

Thanks!

LM

Trim Tabs are a Must if it doesn't have them. Why don't you just punch up the horse power in the Six cylinder. A lot less time consuming and less money too. Remember the Buick's with the turbos.They did 13's in the quarter mile.
Six's have a lot of potential. High performance parts are readily available they are lighter and consume less fuel. All things you might want to consider.