amp hook up

[Schaf]

I will be installing a amplifier in my boat and I would like to hook it up to the battery switch. I have dual batteries and would like the amp to be able to pull from battery 1 or 2 or both. Has anyone done this hook up and was it hard? What do I need to do to hook up my power line from the amp to the switch, Also is this the right way to do it? Open to suggestions. As usual I appreciate your help. Thanks

[BlownCrewCab]

If you unmount the switch and turn it around you'll see where bat1 & bat2 are hooked, the other lug is the one you want to hook to. it's got the cable thats going to the starter. then it'll run on 1, 2, or both....

[mrfixxall]

I will be installing a amplifier in my boat and I would like to hook it up to the battery switch. I have dual batteries and would like the amp to be able to pull from battery 1 or 2 or both. Has anyone done this hook up and was it hard? What do I need to do to hook up my power line from the amp to the switch, Also is this the right way to do it? Open to suggestions. As usual I appreciate your help. Thanks

you can hook the wire to the back of the circuit breaker on the engine and make sure you run a inline fuse at that location too..it would be easier to hook it their then the battery switch..

[Z-Man]

Regardless of which set-up you choose, I would second the "inline fuse" recommendation. Either set-up is easy to do. If you are pushing a decent amount of power to subs, I would recommend adding a cap. This way your lights aren't dimming when running down the lake at night.

[blackhawk]

If you unmount the switch and turn it around you'll see where bat1 & bat2 are hooked, the other lug is the one you want to hook to. it's got the cable thats going to the starter. then it'll run on 1, 2, or both....

I have a Perko switch and removed the cover and hooked it up this way. And definitely use an in line fuse. I ran mine through a fuse, then to a capacitor, then to two amps.

[Schaf]

Any other suggestions. I talked to a installer and he said to go right to the battery but that just doesnt seem right. That battery would always wear down then. Has anyone had there installed by a pro installer? If so where did they connect the power cord from the amp. Thanks..

[blackhawk]

Any other suggestions. I talked to a installer and he said to go right to the battery but that just doesnt seem right. That battery would always wear down then. Has anyone had there installed by a pro installer? If so where did they connect the power cord from the amp. Thanks..

You can hook it directly to the battery. But if it gets low and you switch to the other battery your amp won't turn on. I hooked mine to the output post of my switch so it will follow whatever battery I happen to be using. Either way will work but hooking to the output of your switch is more convenient IMO.

[blackhawk]

Here's a pic of the install I did on my Pantera. I had to start from scratch as there wasn't a stereo in it when I bought it.

I installed a 4 6.5s with crossovers to a 4-channel 1000 watt amp, 2 10" subs to a single channel 1000 watt amp with remote bass adjustment, a 1 farad capacitor an Alpine head unit with Upod controls.

[BlownCrewCab]

Not to ba an Azz, But I consider myself a pro installer and to the switch is how I would do it (with a fuse of course) then you won't have to run a cable from the C-breaker back into the cork pit, and it won't drain only one Bat. The installer who told you to hook it to the bat probably doesn't know boats and how your bat switch works.

[yeller]

blackhawk, how do you like the amps? I've been checking them out. Seem like a hell of a deal for what you get.

[blackhawk]

blackhawk, how do you like the amps? I've been checking them out. Seem like a hell of a deal for what you get.

So far so good. They are by no means top of the line but I did a lot of research on them and they got great reviews. And I love the remote bass control on the sub amp. I think I paid $300 for both amps.

BTW they are mounted in my rear seat storage.

[yeller]

So far so good. They are by no means top of the line but I did a lot of research on them and they got great reviews. And I love the remote bass control on the sub amp. I think I paid $300 for both amps.
BTW they are mounted in my rear seat storage.That's exactly where I was planning on mounting mine.

[Donzi Vol]

Here's a pic of the install I did on my Pantera. I had to start from scratch as there wasn't a stereo in it when I bought it.

I installed a 4 6.5s with crossovers to a 4-channel 1000 watt amp, 2 10" subs to a single channel 1000 watt amp with remote bass adjustment, a 1 farad capacitor an Alpine head unit with Upod controls.

Just one question. When you have that system cranked, do fish float to the top? Seems like fishing with dynamite! I'd love to hear it, though...bet it's awesome.:eek!:

[yeller]

I think the reason the "pro installer" suggested going directly to the battery is because he is worried about power loss. It is drilled into these guys heads that every single connection results in some power loss and every bit of power loss results in reduced sound quality. Well this is true, the loss is so minute that it is barely measurable and not even remotely detectable to the human ear.

I vote for connecting to the switch.

[Schaf]

I like that...


I vote connect to the switch... Wait its my thread.

[blackhawk]

Just one question. When you have that system cranked, do fish float to the top? Seems like fishing with dynamite! I'd love to hear it, though...bet it's awesome.:eek!:

Honestly it's not that loud. Don't get me wrong it rocks pretty good when you're in the boat but I went for more of a "balanced" sound.

[zelatore]

A couple of points:

1- I'm sure the above comment about the 'pro' installer not knowing boats is the case. You definitely want to run it through the selector switch.

2- just looking at the pic of the amp installation above, I'd say there is a much bigger issue for power loss than possibly having one extra connection in the power cables. That would be cable size. Although I can't make out what brand those amps are, and I doubt they really deliver 1000w (at least not RMS) based on your comments about them being less than top of the line, it looks like maybe 6 gauge power cables. That's on the borderline.

Assuming you actually are drawing 1000 watts, that's nearly 85amps at 12vdc. With the amplifiers mounted under the rear seat they are pretty close to the batteries, but given a few twists and turns let's figure it's about 10' of cable round trip from the positive to the amp and back to the negative on the battery. 6 gauge is the minimum recommended wire size and that's with a 10% voltage drop. For a 3% drop, you'd want to up the wire size to 4 gauge.

Obviously, cable size goes up considerably based on length and load.

Just an FYI for planning your installation.

[blackhawk]

A couple of points:
1- I'm sure the above comment about the 'pro' installer not knowing boats is the case. You definitely want to run it through the selector switch.
2- just looking at the pic of the amp installation above, I'd say there is a much bigger issue for power loss than possibly having one extra connection in the power cables. That would be cable size. Although I can't make out what brand those amps are, and I doubt they really deliver 1000w (at least not RMS) based on your comments about them being less than top of the line, it looks like maybe 6 gauge power cables. That's on the borderline.
Assuming you actually are drawing 1000 watts, that's nearly 85amps at 12vdc. With the amplifiers mounted under the rear seat they are pretty close to the batteries, but given a few twists and turns let's figure it's about 10' of cable round trip from the positive to the amp and back to the negative on the battery. 6 gauge is the minimum recommended wire size and that's with a 10% voltage drop. For a 3% drop, you'd want to up the wire size to 4 gauge.
Obviously, cable size goes up considerably based on length and load.
Just an FYI for planning your installation.

The amps are about 4' away from the battery and switch and they are 4 gauge with 12 gauge speaker wire. Both of the amps are 500 watts RMS and 1000 watts max.

[yeller]

....Although I can't make out what brand those amps are, and I doubt they really deliver 1000w (at least not RMS) based on your comments about them being less than top of the line.....That is my biggest complaint about how manufacturers rate amps. Even top of the line amps these days are rated at max and not RMS. Even RMS ratings aren't worth chit if they don't say at what THD.

Back in my day, only the sleazy cheap companies would rate at max power. There was a push by all the major companies to rate at RMS (like the home systems). It was called 'adhoc' ratings. Obviously that fell to the way side as everyone rates max these days. The few companies that will include a secondary rating at RMS normally rate at 1% THD. That value used to be reserved for the low end market. Any respectable company rated wattage in RMS at 0.05% THD.

[blackhawk]

That is my biggest complaint about how manufacturers rate amps. Even top of the line amps these days are rated at max and not RMS. Even RMS ratings aren't worth chit if they don't say at what THD.
Back in my day, only the sleazy cheap companies would rate at max power. There was a push by all the major companies to rate at RMS (like the home systems). It was called 'adhoc' ratings. Obviously that fell to the way side as everyone rates max these days. The few companies that will include a secondary rating at RMS normally rate at 1% THD. That value used to be reserved for the low end market. Any respectable company rated wattage in RMS at 0.05% THD.

I agree but in their defense it's all about marketing. If everyone else is going to market their amps at peak wattage then you put yourself at a disadvantage with the average consumer if you don't. And informed consumers will check out the full spec sheet anyway. It's just like the inflated hp claims in snowmobiling and marine industry. :D

And I have yet to see an amp that doesn't list RMS wattage. But I have noticed that some companies rate RMS at 1% like you stated. The Pioneer amps I looked at did. The amps I bought are rated at .05%.

[zelatore]

Yellar, sounds like we both were playing with mobile audio around the same time frame. I'm betting you remember when the Punch 45 was considered a hot little competition amp because you could run it down to very low impedance and extract a lot more power than the nominal 45 watt rating.

Personally, I moved on years ago and I haven't installed an aftermarket stereo in any of my cars/trucks/boats in years with the exception of the equipment I put in my 32 Carver about 5 years ago, and that was a very modest sony/kenwood system.

Once I started trying to go fast, I realized I didn't have much use for a lot of $$$ and Lbs. tied up in stereo equipment that could instead go into motor, suspension, tires, etc...

Not to say nobody should do it - certainly a LOT of people like to crank up the stereo be it on the water or street.

(I fear I am slowly turning into a curmudgeon :doh: )

[cutwater]

Well this is true, the loss is so minute that it is barely measurable and not even remotely detectable to the human ear.

So true Yeller... just like people who say they can hear the difference between high-quality solid wire and high-quality braided wire. Skin-effect at 20kHz? NEGLIGIBLE.

[blackhawk]

Yellar, sounds like we both were playing with mobile audio around the same time frame. I'm betting you remember when the Punch 45 was considered a hot little competition amp because you could run it down to very low impedance and extract a lot more power than the nominal 45 watt rating.

I still have a Punch 45 out in my garage. I just can't bring myself to get rid of it! And it came in handy as a loaner last year when my buddy toasted his Pyle amp.

[Carl C]

Remember that most auto amps are rated at four ohms also. An amp that puts out 100 watts rms per channel at 8 ohms becomes 200 watts per channel at 4 ohms; 400 watts per channel peak and add both channels and a 100 watt per channel amp suddenly becomes an 800 watt amp:eek!:. Those #s are approximations and some manufacturers even have the gall to rate at 2 ohms which roughly doubles the number again. Yessir, wattage ratings mean very little now days. And don't get me started on the power lines being pushed at car audio shops. Some of it is bigger than jumper cables.:doh:

[zelatore]

Remember that most auto amps are rated at four ohms also. An amp that puts out 100 watts rms per channel at 8 ohms becomes 200 watts per channel at 4 ohms; 400 watts per channel peak and add both channels and a 100 watt per channel amp suddenly becomes an 800 watt amp:eek!:. Those #s are approximations and some manufacturers even have the gall to rate at 2 ohms which roughly doubles the number again. Yessir, wattage ratings mean very little now days. And don't get me started on the power lines being pushed at car audio shops. Some of it is bigger than jumper cables.:doh:

Yeah, but in all fairness, I've seen some costco-quality jumper cables that were about 12 gauge...

I don't use it for stereos, but I buy 4/0 cable by the spool for inverter installations. When you're trying to pull 300 amps or so over any distance at all, you find you can't get big enough cables. Expensive stuff, and a PITA to run since it's about 1" in diameter.

[RickyR]

The problem with hooking the leads to the back of the "Perko" switch is that if you drain one battery, you then would have to switch to the other battery for starting the engine.
No problem so far, but you can't then go back and switch to "all" once the engine is running (unless you have the switch that allows that).
So my point is you then can only rely on that one battery to get you home (since the other is dead).

My solution is to add another "perko" switch just next to the one you presently have.
All you would need is a set of 2 heavy jumper lines and lugs.
This way, you can choose which battery you want to use for your amp, or both, without having to mess with your engine and charging system, by turning the switch to your choice.
You can then run your stereo to that lead too..

Ricky

[blackhawk]

The problem with hooking the leads to the back of the "Perko" switch is that if you drain one battery, you then would have to switch to the other battery for starting the engine.
No problem so far, but you can't then go back and switch to "all" once the engine is running (unless you have the switch that allows that).
So my point is you then can only rely on that one battery to get you home (since the other is dead).

My solution is to add another "perko" switch just next to the one you presently have.
All you would need is a set of 2 heavy jumper lines and lugs.
This way, you can choose which battery you want to use for your amp, or both, without having to mess with your engine and charging system, by turning the switch to your choice.
You can then run your stereo to that lead too..

Ricky

I have always ran mine off battery one. I have only drained the battery 2 or 3 times. When I did I simply turned the perko switch to "all" and fired it up. I know it's hard on the altenator but I don't make a habit of it.

[RickyR]

Another option is to have a deep cycle "house" battery and a Blue Seas ACR isolator.
On my boat, I have 2 starting batteries (one for each engine) , and a house battery that everything runs off of.
When the engines are running, they are charging everything. then when they are off, the house battery runs the electronics and lights.
If I ever drain the deep cycle down, the starting batteries are always full for getting me home.

Ricky

[zelatore]

Looks like Ricky beat me to the punch...

I was going to say that on larger boats, you would have a dedicated starting battery for the engine(s), then a dedicated deep cycle battery(s) for the house loads. Under normal circumstances, the two never power each other's equipment, but you have the option of cross-connecting them through a parrallell switch in case your starting battery goes down. You charge both of them off the alternator through an isolator which allows one charge source to supply multilple batteries without them discharging back through the charge wiring.

Sounds complicated, but it's not that bad.

Although in reality, we're getting a bit over the top for a simple stereo installation. Unless you're planning to have a ton of power or love to sit at the beach all day with a mega-watt stereo cranked up for hours on end without running the engine, you shouldn't need to worry about any of this.

[blackhawk]

Although in reality, we're getting a bit over the top for a simple stereo installation.

More like WAY over the top! :D

Hook it up to the switch.

[Schaf]

Thanks for all the help. Remember i will ony be running 4 jlm650 70rms with a jl 4300 4x75 @ 2ohm. I dont thing it will be a problem Not to much power there. I havent bought the jl equipment yet. DOes anyone have any other suggestions. I have heard the m650s and i think they sound great. Thnkas again for all the imput.

[Schaf]

Decisions decisions. Ok what if i put the amp under the bow right in front of the storage locker. Laying flat. DOwn side that I see is longer power wire. Up side no drilling in to the fire wall. What are your thoughts? Thanks again..

[zelatore]

I know others have installed amps in this area.

Downside:
longer cable runs for power
can't show it off for the bling factor
a little harder area to crawl into for the install

Upsides:
it's not in a hot engine room
don't have to drill any holes that would be visible if you take it out.
shorter runs for signal wires

I think you can make either location work.

Now stop talking about it and get out your tools! :)

[yeller]

Schaf, did you ever listen to the Polks. I'm now leaning towards them, but as yet, have to hear them. JL's are great speakers. If they're in your budget, go for it.

As far as mounting the amp. I'd think you'd have less chance of picking up motor whine if it was up front because your RCA cables will be much shorter. I personally don't like the idea of mounting in the engine compartment. Too much heat IMO.

[glashole]

Schaf, did you ever listen to the Polks. I'm now leaning towards them, but as yet, have to hear them. JL's are great speakers. If they're in your budget, go for it.

As far as mounting the amp. I'd think you'd have less chance of picking up motor whine if it was up front because your RCA cables will be much shorter. I personally don't like the idea of mounting in the engine compartment. Too much heat IMO.

and the chance of it blowing up

[blackhawk]

Schaf, did you ever listen to the Polks. I'm now leaning towards them, but as yet, have to hear them. JL's are great speakers. If they're in your budget, go for it.
As far as mounting the amp. I'd think you'd have less chance of picking up motor whine if it was up front because your RCA cables will be much shorter. I personally don't like the idea of mounting in the engine compartment. Too much heat IMO.

I agree there's a lot of heat in the engine compartment. I put my amp and sub in the bow on my Donzi. Yes it is a long power and ground cord but it's not like were trying to squeak every last ounce out of these set-ups. Plus I always use a capacitor which helps.