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View Full Version : Whitewater rafting and my guns.....



Donziweasel
03-26-2008, 08:27 AM
As some of you know, we are looking at breaking the all time snow record for JH set previously in 1997 at 575 inches. 1997 also had another record- river flow. We measure river flows in cubic feet per second (CFS). Take a point and how many CFS goes by it in one second is the flow. Typical runoff crest on the Snake River on a decent year is maybe 20,000 cfs. 1997 hit 38,500. I ran the river at 37000 with 10 other guides and the trip that usually last 2 hours took 22 minutes. It was terrifying. 20 ft walls of water, everyone got knocked out at least once, lost all the oars and paddles, etc..... I will never do it again.

The first two years I lived here, during the summer I was a white water rafting guide. In 1997 I had retired from the river, but still ran it at 37,000 cfs. We had a mud slide which cut off the whitewater section of the Snake for a month. It was a damn good thing because it saved many lives. If people could have accessed the Snake and if the Whitewater companies had been able to run, many would have died. Every year at least 1-5 people lose their lives on the Snake, usually due to not being prepared. We put in before the slide and took the long way home when we ran it at 37,000. I don't know of anyone who ran it higher, so I guess we hold the record for the hoghest flow run on the Snake ever.

Anyway, 1997 saw flooding accross the plains and west. We almost lost Palisades Resevior Dam. If it gets hot fast this spring, we will break the CFS record. If that happens, we will see some flooding and if anyone wants to run some of the biggest whitewater Jackson Hole has ever seen, come in mid-June. Make sure your life insurance policy is up to date.

I still love the rivers and put on big river trips, like the Middle Fork of the Salmon and Hell's Canyon. Boo Boo and I flyfish all the time and still like to run whitewater. She is acually really good on the sticks and she is one of the only people I trust to row me down class IV+.

Below is a pic of me when I was guiding in 1995. That is a very young and buff me on the back of the raft. Check out those guns! Now, 12 years later, the guns and six pack are gone and the belly has expanded. :hangum:

The Hedgehog
03-26-2008, 09:46 AM
I used to boat some class IV-V and V+ stuff. I do it in a kayak though. I have boated out west and like the big water too. I guess that the most similar stuff on this coast is in West Va. I ran the New River gorge in WVA at 20,000 cfs. It had big 14 foot explosion waves, brain waves, whirlpools and lot's of funny water.

Here are a couple of pics of me running some class IV and V stuff. The eastern stuff is steep and hairy. In the day I was running creeks that approached 500-600 ft/mile in the steep sections (visualize 20+ foot drops at every turn)I will try to dig up a photo of some V+.

I have mellowed a good bit. I just bought a 6 person raft to take friends along. Ran the Ocoee and the Big South Fork just last weekend.

The Hedgehog
03-26-2008, 10:04 AM
The left pic is a nice 20 footer called Short Creek falls in Alabama. It is an honest 20 footer too. It is sort of like dropping in from the top of a 2 story house. We would try to throw tricks on the way down (high fives in the air, backwards, no paddles etc). It is a nice class IV.

The middle pic is Oceana falls in Tallula Gorge Ga. It is a nice 55 foot cascading drop. That is me right before I hit a 15 foot wall of water called "The Thing". I have seen some severe beatings on that drop. It rates a good V.

The right pic is me at Singleys Falls on Overflow Creek in Ga. It is in a section called Damnation Alley that drops 350 ft/mile. Singley's is a good 30 footer with a mean undercut at the bottom. It is a nice class V. In Damnation Alley you hit big V's all the way down. Further down the river is the toughest rapid I have ever run. It is called "The Great Marginal Monster" Think big drops, complex moves and bad undercut rocks. It is an honest V+. Goof up a line and you will get a severe beating at best. At worst you will be swept into an undercut.

mjw930
03-26-2008, 10:54 AM
I did the Cheat River Canyon run in W Va one May many, many years ago. This is one of the few class IV rivers in the North East and it was a "good" year according to the guides....

Glad I did it but I'm not rushing to do it again.

You guys are certifiable :wink:

The Hedgehog
03-26-2008, 11:24 AM
I did the Cheat River Canyon run in W Va one May many, many years ago. This is one of the few class IV rivers in the North East and it was a "good" year according to the guides....

Glad I did it but I'm not rushing to do it again.

You guys are certifiable :wink:

Actually there are many class IV and up rivers in the North East. A bunch of them are not raftable though. I can think of 5 or 6 good rafting runs off the top of my head that are up there.

My favorite secret paddling state is Alabama. Little River Canyon and Sand Mountain are both chock full of great stuff from mild to wild. Little River Canyon has some beautiful deep blue water with house size boulders every where. Sand Mountain has everything. The steepest stuff drops at 500-800 fpm. My favorite two are Johnnies Creek and South Sauty. Johnnies drops at 300 fpm. You start with an 18 footer and it starts getting better. The whole creek only has one pool and it is about 30 years long. The rest is drops, slots and slides. Constant class IV with a big nasty class V in the middle called Gorilla Constrictor. Sauty is constant III-IV action with lots of play.

To put it in perspective, the Cheat drops around 30 fpm and the Olympic Whitewater section of the Ocoee is probably 45-50fpm.

These days I have my hands full on the Ocoee. I have some good class IV 15 minutes from the house and I have not even run it yet:eek!:

Donziweasel
03-26-2008, 11:29 AM
Hedgehog, done a little kayaking in my day. The sport is exploding out here. The Snake is by far the most famous whitewater in our area, but not the most dangerous by any means. There at two small obscure rivers within 45 mileso Jackson that run class V+. I have run both, including a meatball of a rapid named Snaggletooth on the Greys river. I have always wanted to run the New and Galli, but never had the chance.

MJW, never heard of that one.

The biggest rapid I ever ran was about four years ago on the Main Salmon after the Middle Fork dumps in. It was created by a huge rockslide when the whole side of a mountain came down and ran accross the river. Created a rapid at the time that didn't have a name. Solid IV and a V at high water. It is huge and has killed people! I have now run it twice. Long tongue with a major move at the bottom to miss a big boulder. I have had two clean runs, but the other boats I was with got worked both times.

The worse accident I ever had was in 1998 on Hell's Canyon in a rapid named Granite. Monster class V. Got off my line, hit a 18 ft wall of water sidewyas and dumped the whole boat. Almost killed me and two freinds. I guess that was when I realized that I am not really invincible. Ahh, youth!

The Hedgehog
03-26-2008, 12:40 PM
You guys have some huge water out there. I would not mind doing some more of it. I would love to get up there and get on some of the big stuff. I have done some of the stuff in Colorado. It was big, fast and in your face. Not to mention that the snow melt water is cold:shocking:

The New and Gauley are nice. The New gets huge but it is not that complicated. I ran the whole gorge in about 20-30 min when it was at 20,000. One of the more memorable big water features was called "The Mouth". It is a big explosion wave (I think in Lower Keeney) that would open and close. You had to time it right or it would close on you. My friend that was about 50 yards behind me got woofed. He dissappeared. I looked around and saw him roll up in this massive waver train. Swimming was not an option. The sides of the gorge were littered with reaction waves and big pourover holes. The eddy lines were walls with nasty whirlpools. I am not sure how one would swim out. I had to pull a friend out at 6,000 on the back of my playboat one day. I popped wheelies (stern squirts) for a couple of minutes as I finally dragged him through an eddy line. I could not imagine doing it at 20,000.

The Upper Gauley is a blast. It has a couple of nice class V's and some very big IV's(the guides say that they are V's but they are not that technical). The Lower Gauley has lot's of III-IV boogie water. It is a nice relaxing run.

I would like to get back up to a nice class IV level in my kayak. That is some good fun. Class V is pretty scary. About 10 years ago I really enjoyed being at the edge of my seat all afternoon (having the crap scared out of me!) Now I would like to get back up to the stuff that is just plain fun. Until then, I will be coordinating stupid human tricks on the Ocoee in my raft.

Donziweasel
03-26-2008, 12:50 PM
Hedgehog, you should come out here one year. Probably 30 + rivers within 2 hours of us for running. They all have different personalities, from straight forward big stuff on the Snake, to small technical rivers. On many, you not see another boat, very scenic and relaxing, until you hit the juice. Plus, you can do some fly fishing between rapids. By July, no wetsuit needed.

Many guides here bolt at the end of the season for the New and Guali. I guess there season is after ours. I have heard of two rapids on those rivers and I am sure you have run them. One is called "Ejection Rock" which tends to endo boats, and the "Juicer". Would love to try those bad boys.

I have run the Ochoee, which I think is in you neck of the woods, fun river. I did a guide resume' years back and counted over 40 rivers I have run. Have you ever done a big multi day trip?

The Hedgehog
03-26-2008, 02:28 PM
I am not sure about the names of those two rapids but I have run everything on both rivers (at least on the mainstream sections). Guides have some different names for stuff than kayakers. The most famous ender spot on the Upper G is probably at Tumblehome (The bottem end of Lost Paddle). I got a double Pirouette there one time. I felt pretty sporty after that. These days with the short playboats folks are getting moves off every pourover.


I have done about 65 different runs, claim 2 first descents (one was basically a class IV ditch) and have named a rapid or two. On the other hand, I have taken some pretty bad swims. My worst was on the creek line in Lost Paddle on the Upper G. I spent a long time in a hole, got up close and personal with an undercut and pulled myself out of a seive. I got worked nicely in Pinball on Little River Canyon and took a very nasty long swim on a flooded creek in Ga one day. I lost my boat on that one. Other than that, I have had the typical hole thrashings and spankings at the bottom of waterfalls.

The Ocoee is a good play run. I will be on it Sat or Sun. It is less than 2 hours from my house. I live about 10 minutes from the Cumberland Plateau. It is the home of tons of creek runs. I also live 20 minutes from Rock Island. It is the home of the Red Bull waterfall competition and the World Freestyle rodeo.

I need to grow a new pair to take advantage of some of my local attractions.

I have never done a multi day trip but would love to some time.

Last Real Texan kayaked the Grand Canyon. I would love to do that as well.