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View Full Version : Great info from the Pacific NW on an ILMOR 22



Lenny
01-24-2008, 12:04 PM
From a fella I have been chatting with.
we did a shelby 22 last year with a 625hp ilmor that ran 102mph. We went 4 inches higher then a stock 22 and still could go higher. The boat planed like a ski boat and the acceleration was incredible! I don't know how fast zero to eighty was but it was awesome! The boat handled better at 100 modified then it did at 75 mph stock. The balance with the lighter motor was Great! This is the most fun I've had driving a boat! Good luck and feel free to call if you have any questions. joe

I am going to see it next week and get pictures.

...apparently Carson (DONZI) has been up to see this boat a few times. I spent about an hour on the phone to Joe. What a wealth of info. I could go on for hours about what we went over, and what they have done but I will keep it brief. Next week it comes back in for a transplant and is getting the 710 Ilmor transplant. 625 right now. I will go see it next week when it arrives and hang out with JOE.

103 MPH (GPS) top speed.
380 K-planes
Shelby hull (up 2" from stock)
IMCO shorty (up another 2")
Changed out the IMCO RH 2" shorty from RH to a LH hand one and made ALL the difference in the world.
1:36 gear set right now (changed from 1:50)
30" TURBO prop

He said that last summer, the fella (I will keep the owner anon) raced everyone on the Lake. (Lake Washington)
No one can touch this boat from 0-90. Nordic, Nortech, Fountains, nothing.

He said it is ROCK stable and that at WOT it feels like a ski boat, rides flat and true, totally predictable. An abosolute joy to drive and the most fun boat he has EVER driven. He said that as a RH boat it would all but corkscrew and roll over when they hit the throttle from idle. The change to a LH drive fixed ALL of this. His ONLY REGRET is that they didn't raise the "X" dimension 5". They are putting an IMCO LH 3" shorty on it next week along with the ILMOR 710 transplant.

He said that the hull LOVES losing the 350-400 pounds in the rear.
Also, he has recently done a 3" raised "X" 22C with the 6.2MX in it and it turns the SAME numbers as the 496 MAG HO 22.

He does not want to be bombarded with calls, but will chat your ear off and give you anything you want to know or will offer up all the rest of the stuff you do not know. GREAT GUY, and a wealth of knowledge. Also, he said that all this info has been going back through Carson to DONZI. So I think we can expect FACTORY boats in this similar configuration in the future.

The owner will remain anonymous.

This is great new info for sure and over a year old. Pics to follow. He has really done his homework. Can't wait to see it.

undertaker
01-24-2008, 02:43 PM
Interesting....:propeller:

BUIZILLA
01-24-2008, 03:23 PM
Also, he has recently done a 3" raised "X" 22C with the 6.2MX in it and it turns the SAME numbers as the 496 MAG HO 22. that definately matches what i've personally seen done....

ITTLFLI
01-24-2008, 04:05 PM
Tell him to bring that beast to AOTH this year!! I hear the bar has been raised!!!

DONZI
01-24-2008, 04:18 PM
Our 1st un-official triple digit 22 ??
There must be some trade off"s with those drive heights?



Look forward to the pics. !

Lenny
01-24-2008, 04:32 PM
Tell him to bring that beast to AOTH this year!! I hear the bar has been raised!!!

I do not know if he is into travelling 2800 miles (5600 2 way) with a boat in tow. It is not all that appealing of an experiance. :D

Byron, the "bar" gets raised next week. The boat gets the ILMOR 710 mid-week. I will be there :)

Lenny
01-24-2008, 05:40 PM
What happened to the original thread about this boat??
I just replied to it after lunch today.....
I poofed it as it had your name in the title at top and there is NO WAY to edit the top part of a post, only the body of the message. And I know how you feel about the name thing. So I poofed it and re-did it as this at about 12:30pm your time.

:D :D :D

Tony
01-24-2008, 06:01 PM
There must be some trade off"s with those drive heights?

I agree. In fact, I bet I can toast him from zero to 40 :propeller: :propeller: :propeller:

Holy crap...an Ilmor 625, then upgraded to a 710...
Give me a minute while I wipe the drool off my keyboard!

:beer:

BUIZILLA
01-24-2008, 06:05 PM
Todd wants to know what's happening with the takeout 625....

anonymous, definately

Lenny
01-24-2008, 06:31 PM
Todd wants to know what's happening with the takeout 625....
anonymous, definately

I just got off the phone with Todd. He said that Madpoodle would graciously take his HP500 AND 22C off his hands for 15 grand so that he could start fresh in this new fashion :D

...man, what are friends for :smash:

I will concentrate on the motor mount arrangement and stringer/strengthening modifications when taking photos.

Lenny
01-24-2008, 07:03 PM
Todd wants to know what's happening with the takeout 625....

I have asked him to ask the owner what is happening with it. I will relay it here.

Lenny
01-24-2008, 08:23 PM
You can usually find used ILMOR's on OSO for sale section.
I have talked with Joe Malich about this boat on several occations. He is our dealer in Washington State. Great guy!!

Mr X

Joe just sold 2 525 HP Ilmors and one 625 for $22,995 Each. :eek:

This boat belongs to a fella on Lake Washington that wanted a 22 Classic ( 2" SHELBY in this case) capable of ANY speed and money was no object. Now he has that and it is about to get wilder. :eek:

The part that upsets me the MOST is that it is 70 miles from me, has been around for a while (a year) and I did not know of it :( I thought I knew where EVERY 24 degree DONZI remotely close to me was, who owned it, what their wifes favourite color was etc etc etc... Apparently NOT.

My question is,... (wait for it) , is, as this transpired a while ago, and was done locally by a local performance Boatyard for a private owner (un-named :D till I get him to join this website :) ), what is the purpose of DONZI's interest in this " consumer level project? "

As told to me, (by the boats' builder(s) today,) DONZI showed interest in what these local boat folks were/had doing/done to this boat.

Does DONZI have an Ilmor hankering for use in a small Classic or is a larger CLASSIC on the Horizon with Ilmor power coming ?

This is starting to make sense, as is the SHELBY boat and the 2" higher X from 2 years ago.


the Shelby 22 at the Miami show. Sorry, not great pix, looked much better there, great display with the car next to it. 496 HO mounted two inches higher. Engineer from Donzi at the show said it did nearly 80mph. Bravo X, SportMaster, Mplus. Tough to plane off tho, a little too high he thought. They almost put a 625 V-10 Ilmor in it with an ITS.

Probably NOT tough to plane off once you LOSE 350 pounds from the transom ! :D

???

98shovel
01-24-2008, 08:38 PM
hey lenny
im close whats her fav color






der assoratset

Lenny
01-24-2008, 08:43 PM
hey lenny
im close whats her fav color

der assoratset

Patrick, in WA, it's red, as in Ruby's and DONZI's :D

yeller
01-24-2008, 09:18 PM
I am going to see it next week and get pictures.When are you going exactly. Want company. I can meet you at the ferry so you can walk on. If you're taking the US ferry, no problem, I can meet you there.

Lenny
01-24-2008, 09:31 PM
When are you going exactly. Want company. I can meet you at the ferry so you can walk on. If you're taking the US ferry, no problem, I can meet you there.

I'll call you. Yep, that would be fun. I will tell ya which day works once I talk to the owner and when it is getting dropped off. I am thinking THURSDAY as I want pics with the existing motor OUT for stringer and mount clarification for folks interested. ITS on back I believe. I think we should try and get Steve and Mike involved too so it can be a gathering of 3 22 DONZI owners in presence ( and one lowly 18 Donzihead. :rolleyes: )

:)

yeller
01-25-2008, 12:24 AM
I should be ok for Thursday. Definately give me a call. :thumbsup:

roadtrip se
01-25-2008, 09:00 AM
This just shows how small this world really is.

I had been hearing rumbles about this boat for months.

As inferred, I have been intriqued by this engine package ever since they announced it in 550 form.

There are structural, rigging, and tuning issues that come up with this package because of its size, weight, and power.
While I continue to hit Ted for updates on his version of this, I can only imagine what he is going through to make this work.

Frankly, I question how a stock rigged boat from the factory could keep from coming apart without a bunch of modifications for strength.

Lenny, your pics should be very revealing.

As for all of you with the high quality offers on the RT Somerville Edition, I sincerely appreciate your sense of timing and compassion in stepping up in my moment of need. Please go back to whatever you were smoking and send me some.

"Banjo Boy"

Tony
01-25-2008, 12:47 PM
After e-mailing out of curiosity, I got a nice reply from Bob Mason at the Ilmor Marine USA headquarters in Plymouth, MI.
While admitting very few actually pay retail, here are the listed prices on the Ilmor engines:

570 $37,737
625 $43,396
710 $57,400

He goes on to explain that there are quite a few 625 "show motors", with very few hours on them, obtainable for high-20's money. Bob wrote me a lengthy, personalized reply and seemed like a very straight shooter. His phone numbers are listed below in case anyone is interested in talking to him.

Bob Mason
734-456-3642
517-403-5618 cell


:beer

zimm17
01-26-2008, 08:43 AM
This boat belongs to a fella on Lake Washington that wanted a 22 Classic ( 2" SHELBY in this case) capable of ANY speed and money was no object.
Must be nice...

yeller
01-28-2008, 10:08 PM
Lenny,
You still going this week?

Lenny
01-29-2008, 12:26 AM
THAT's the plan. I had to cut a "Ministry of Forests" job today, picked up 160 sheets of a specialty product shipped from Oregon at Van Kam, delivered to my storage area and have a three day cutlist and deliveries.

Great money, but it $ucks up the fun part of my life. I will get back to you tomorrow. :yes:

Shanghied Again
01-29-2008, 09:02 PM
Just adding my 2 Cents: Being on the inside of Donzi and seeing how things work I don't see Donzi putting that kind of horsepower in a 22, There are to many problems that can result in a production company building an Insurance Nightmare. To all of us that can handle a boat of that caliber no problem but to a novice a boat like that can be a death sentence. I remember when I built my Superchraged 22ZX Donzi made me sign a waiver and my warranty was no longer valid. plus were would the money value be would you pay $100K for a 22?

Ranman
01-30-2008, 08:46 AM
Just adding my 2 Cents: Being on the inside of Donzi and seeing how things work I don't see Donzi putting that kind of horsepower in a 22, There are to many problems that can result in a production company building an Insurance Nightmare. To all of us that can handle a boat of that caliber no problem but to a novice a boat like that can be a death sentence.

How is this any different from any other builder that produces 100+MPH boats. Skater, Fountain, Cigarette, Hustler, Outer Limits, etc will sell to virtually anyone with a large enough bank account. How are they able to continue selling their 100, 150 and 175MPH machines to anyone with money and not have issues? I realize the boats are bigger, but the speeds are faster and just as dangerous.

Shanghied Again
01-30-2008, 09:23 AM
Ranman: Its more of a liability from insurance. Most Marine Insurance has a speed cap for certain boats and if a company builds a boat they have to stay within a spectrum for speed to size are they won't get certified. Most boats that run over 100mph are 35ft and above. Some boat are uninsurable and have to go to Loyds of London or Self Insured.
All boats have a limit on Horsepower; Custom boat builders will exceed the limits and these boats will become the owners responsibility.
I don't think Donzi will put themselves in a situation were a boat can bring on any extra liability to themselves no matter how much money a customer wants to spend on a boat.
thats why you will see in the brochures engine limitations.
Rated HP.

roadtrip se
01-30-2008, 09:37 AM
Randy, go check out OSO and Speedwake for the Smoke on the Water or Flash Gordon accidents, if you want to see why boat manufacturers and insurance companies are taking a closer look at the liability exposure in our hobby.

And as someone who had a 32-footer v-hull that would click off well over 100 in ideal conditions, (and it was darn right spooky at times) I find the prospects of doing it in a 22 to be for a limited few with a high level of skill and experience.

As Frank said, the economics will limit this one any way.

The Hedgehog
01-30-2008, 10:01 AM
You should check out a policy on one of those 160 mph boats. Huge deductables, 10-15k+ a year etc. You need to be prepared to write a check for six figures personally if you have an uh oh!

Lenny
01-30-2008, 04:02 PM
Talked with Joe this AM. He is tooooo busy getting ready to attend 3 boat shows in the next few weeks, (LA and others) that he cannot tackle the motor swap prior to the shows being over. We are on for the end of Feb. I missed a call from Steve A (Blueliner) so I have an "assumption" that he is interested in coming along as well.

Will be in touch Blue and Yeller. :)

xzizx
08-29-2009, 01:24 AM
> Well Praise the L-rd!!!!
Good news about Donzi
hi-speed handling!
Real tired of negs ,born
out of limited efforts to
seek out solution.
LH it is!!

Pismo
08-29-2009, 06:43 AM
Less weight in the back..Even a little on a stock boat will help get rid of the porpoise. Like exhaust. I agree the hull hates a heavy rear end. 4-5" high needs a big engine tho I would think.

MOP
08-29-2009, 07:19 AM
I do not agree with reducing weight in the back helps to stop porpoising, as most know following Geo advice I moved weight back. Aft mounted fuel tank and dual batteries and a bit more stuffed aft, and have plans for a little more. When I go up to the 1000 Islands I fill the forward fuel tank at the land pumps, big jump between $2.75 and $3.39. The only time the boat porpoises is with fuel in the forward tank, anything above 1/4 tank and does the hip hop. All I know is that adding near 350lbs forward kills some speed and sort of ruins the ride. Once that tank is empty the boat takes on a totally different personality much for the better. I could not wait for it to burn down this year from now on will just keep a few gallons in it for backup and just eat the docks pump price.

Mr X
08-29-2009, 07:23 AM
> Well Praise the L-rd!!!!
Good news about Donzi
hi-speed handling!
Real tired of negs ,born
out of limited efforts to
seek out solution.
LH it is!!
Still keeping my mouth shut. http://smilies.vidahost.com/contrib/edoom/Thinkingof_.gif

Pismo
08-29-2009, 01:28 PM
I do not agree with reducing weight in the back helps to stop porpoising, as most know following Geo advice I moved weight back. Aft mounted fuel tank and dual batteries and a bit more stuffed aft, and have plans for a little more. When I go up to the 1000 Islands I fill the forward fuel tank at the land pumps, big jump between $2.75 and $3.39. The only time the boat porpoises is with fuel in the forward tank, anything above 1/4 tank and does the hip hop. All I know is that adding near 350lbs forward kills some speed and sort of ruins the ride. Once that tank is empty the boat takes on a totally different personality much for the better. I could not wait for it to burn down this year from now on will just keep a few gallons in it for backup and just eat the docks pump price.

I have better luck getting rid of weigh aft. Two people in the back seat, an anchor in the engine bay, etc and she won't stop porpoising. When they are gone, so is the porpoising. I am talking low speed, under 35mph, totally stock 22. Everything clears up nice at 60 with any load or distribution. $3.79 on LG..Yikes

blackhawk
08-29-2009, 05:22 PM
What happened with this boat? Did it get even bigger power? Pics, vids?

Even with raising the propshaft 4" 103mph is SMOKING with 625hp!!!

I'd love to see a vid.