PDA

View Full Version : Bow lift ring got loose



TheFees
12-09-2007, 06:23 PM
My 1987 18 classic has a bow lift ring problem. One day I was riding along, and noticed it was bobbing about. So I stopped, and it lifted right out. I have it of course. I saw some rusted metal where I am sure the supporting bracket would go. What is left of the supporting bracket was pinched between the locking nuts. So my question is, what is involved in repairing it. Is it possible to have a bracket made, or buy one, and is it possible to mount it, and reinstall the bow lift ring again, without removing the whole top of the boat? The lift ring assembly is in fine condition, a wire brush to the threads should be all that is needed to clean it up, and the exposed chrome is very nice.
The scary thing is that when I had my body shop, I used a couple of chains, and hoisted the boat, supported by an I beam in the ceiling, then slid the Myco trailer out, had is sandblasted and then refinished it, new stickers from Myco etc, upgraded the steps by replacing with thicker metal. Everything went well, and I felt relieved when I placed the boat back on the trailer. It bothered me seeing it dangling from the ceiling over the concrete floor below. When a couple of years later, I saw the lift ring loose, I reflected on the trailer time, and got a little flush. :eek:
Any help on how I can replace the lift ring in the bow would be appreciated. Thanks ahead of time.

olredalert
12-09-2007, 10:54 PM
------I believe its fabrication time. Either find another 18 to look at to give you an idea what the bracket looks like or possibly find someone here on the sight who has already taken a pic. Make yourself a template and find a half-way decent welder-fab man. You have the opportunity to make the bracket better and stronger since you have to make it from scratch so do it. Shouldnt cost you much but some time and a few bucks for material and time.......Bill S

TheFees
12-10-2007, 01:14 PM
Thanks for your input, I think fabrication is the way to go. When I phoned Donzi after they were bought by OMC, they said, all we have are a couple of molds, and no records. So there position at the time is that they do not have even the parts listings for the boats, let alone the parts.
Here is an interesting note. I bought my boat in 1989, and I phoned Donzi to ask for a replacement switch on the dash for the running lights, a new blower for the motor compartment to let in fresh air, and something else, I forgot what, it has been a long time, and after taking the order I asked them if they would accept Visa, and they replied, "Oh that is all right, we will just send them to you" So I replied, "I bought the boat used, so I am not entitled to a warranty" and they said, "No problem, we will send them to you anyhow" They did go bankrupt. But I was super impressed along the way.

Anyhow, if anyone has the top off of a 1987, or therabouts classic 18, and they can take a few pictures of the front brace that holds the lift ring, I certainly would appreciate it. A measurement or two, just height, and width, and how far the plate sticks out of it, or whatever dimensions would seem neccessary to fabricate it, I would appreciate it. A picture does say a thousand words.
PS: The boats are the same throughout so many years, so any year would be a help, I just do not know if the inners on the bracket, or glass that holds it are any different, therefore I asked for something closer to 1987. So if they are the same, the information would be appreciated.

VetteLT193
12-10-2007, 01:26 PM
are they different on the new boats? Meaning, can you buy whatever they use now from Donzi ?

gcarter
12-10-2007, 02:39 PM
Here ya go.....
This is off the 22, but I'm sure it's the same. That's a 3/4" rod.
Couldn't be much simpler.:smash:
Plate is 3" X 2" X 1/4", bolt spacing is 2", hole diameter is 3/8".
Pipe is approx. 1" O.D. with a wall thickness that allows 3/4" dia. threaded rod to pass through X 3" long, centered on the plate. All steel.
I can't get the nuts off, I'll eventually have to saw the rod. I always replace it wit SST anyway. That solves that problem.

TheFees
12-10-2007, 07:59 PM
Vette, I will have to look into that.
GCarter, thanks for the photos, and the plate measurements. That is a great help, thanks again. I notice the rod on the 22 is the same width, but appears longer, which would make sense. I enclosed a pic of what I have. I was thinking of converting the threaded rod to stainless as well, and was entertaining the idea of making the support bracket out of stainless too. I have a friend with a cruiser, who works in metal fabrication, and he said he could make something out of stainless for me. Haven't spoke with him in a long time though.
When I saw your pics, I thought of how the 2 welds on either side of that tube would have to be done right, or the whole boat would be wasted. Could you imagine someone using an 18 or a 16 as a yacht tender, and the whole front of the boat depends on those 2 tiny welds. :shocking:
What do you think is the best way to replace the threaded rod, and not crack the cast piece when removing. WD40 it for a week? :) and where is the best place to get a stainless rod in that thread count and size?

Tony
12-10-2007, 08:05 PM
1967 Ski Sporter...

gcarter
12-10-2007, 08:29 PM
I got the SST rod from the local machine/fab shop. I can't remember the thread....3/4-12 or something like that. I bought a standard 36" piece and had them saw it to the lengths I wanted. It was maybe $40.00. Had a nice piece left over.
You might be able to get it at McMaster-Carr ( www.mcmastercarr.com ) also, but your local machine shop would have a vested interest in cutting it as it's not easy to do.
Use penetrating oil and let it soak of course. The brass casting shouldn't split. I stuck the rod in a large vise and a jack handle through the eye. They will eventually come off, just not easily. I wouldn't heat it unless I had to.

RAPID TRANSIT
12-11-2007, 04:54 AM
There is an easier way if you are intrested and I think they fit. It don't hurt to call and ask I'm sure they will know for sure. Good Luck


Lifting Eye Mounting Brackets.

Recreations of the original lifting ring brackets. Originals were fabricated from carbon steel stock and welded construction. Though strong enough to support the boats when hung, they were only painted and easily rusted and over time eroded when subjected to a corrosive marine environment such as saltwater. The erosion compromises structural integrity and safety of the system. Through working on these old boats and through disassembly in restoration projects we have noted that brackets rot in areas that are unseen such as where clamped against the transom or to a bulkhead where moisture becomes trapped. We suggest that you remove your lifting ring brackets and inspect them if you plan to hang your old Donzi from it’s lifting rings.

These JT Engineering recreations in many ways match the original lifting ring mounting brackets but utilize better materials, craftsmanship and finish. Rear lifting bracket is manufactured from equivalent material size and fabrication techniques. These brackets are made to replace failing originals. Front lifting ring brackets have been beefed up as the originals in our opinion, along with FEA modeling used for validation, are a bit anemic.


We offer the rear lifting ring bracket two ways, Carbon steel in a powder coated finish, color of our choice, or a raw finish stainless steel version. The front lifting ring bracket comes in stainless only.
Don’t take a chance if your original brackets are severely corroded or compromised and you hoist and or hang your boat by the lifting rings.



These quality pieces are offered through JT Engineering, Inc. and may be purchased directly by contacting Cliff Wind @ 860 621 3563 or bertramboy@cox.net .

New2Donzi
12-11-2007, 06:06 AM
I purchased front and rear brackets from Cliff for my restoration.
You can't beat the quality of his work!
Regrads....Ed

TheFees
12-11-2007, 11:28 PM
Thank you for the help. The photo from Tony gives me the perspective of where it is with the top off. Also Rapid Transit thanks for the tip about Cliff and the stainless offer. I will be in touch about that. and George thanks for the lead on the rod, and how to get the lift eye off.
Even with all of that help, I am still stymied with the procedure to install it. Do I have to take the deck off?
I can't see how it can be installed without crawling up in there. Ouch. I figured that at the very least, you could pre-attach the rod, with both upper and lower nuts preattached, then install the deck, and tighten the cast piece down from the top, but then you will still need to get up there to secure the holding nut, snugging it up to the lift eye. So no matter how I figure it, you have to crawl up in there.
So is it possible to crawl up in there and do the whole job by replacing the bracket, and the rod etc. without taking the deck off?
Once again, much appreciated. Thanks.

TheFees
12-12-2007, 03:36 AM
If your claustrophobic crawling up there is not going to be fun.. If your not claustrophobic crawling up there is not going to be fun.. Any neighborhood kids you can bribe? Otherwise, take a flashlight, tools and a cel phone just in case :) :)

Scott,
My thoughts exactly. I gave the hire a kid approach some consideration, then I realized that relying on a kid to install a plate, that had been rusted out, needing removal, reinstall, and then everything that he was doing would determine whether the boat got wasted during a lift, all added up to= I need to lose some weight:nilly:
I could just see at the Donzi factory, they have this midget guy walking around the warehouse, and when asked what he does, he says, "I am the chief lift eye ring installer" It would be interesting to see how Donzi does do it at the factory. Knowing the proper height, or should I say how much it should extend upwards above the plate, I can see them installing the plate, and the rod with upper and lower nut tightened on the plate, leave the upper nut that secures the cast lift ring loose, drop on the deck, and install the lift ring from above, then just get someone in there to tighten the final nut against the base of the lift ring.
If they really wanted to get nuts about it, they could do some super fine measuring, and know exactly where the securing nut for the lift ring should go, anti seize it, and install the lift ring, I mentioned nuts about it, because they would have to calculate the threads to know where it would sit in a range to tighten, with the light ring front to back. (Try the impossilble huh)
Ok, ok, someone needs to go up in there for the final twist.
This is getting interesting. So many guys here at the registry have had their decks off, how did they finally secure their lift eye? Curious minds want to know.

gcarter
12-12-2007, 05:54 AM
As you can see in the picture, I had to remove it from the bulkhead. You could say that the 22 has a lot more room, and it does, but it's more a matter of perception. But you can't lay in the ski locker and do the job, my 220 # would break it. So you crawl up into the ski locker and as soon as you feel it giving, it's amazingly flexible, you climb out of the locker into the hull which has very steep sides at that point. I think the wrenches you need are 9/16", but you better take 5/8" with you just in case. Just shove everything Poodle said to include into the very end of the ski locker because it's right there at the bulkhead. A drop light works better than a flashlight. Also be prepared to get very dirty because no one has been in there since Donzi dropped the deck on. It's not fun, but do-able. At least it's cooler now. When I removed mine, it was 98* and 100% humidity. Plus I had a lot more to do, like remove the fuel fill and vent lines.

MOP
12-12-2007, 06:27 AM
If you use a stainless rod it is a good idea to use bronze nuts, stainless is prone to galling and in many cases will not come apart again. The galling is far more common then most would believe.

Phil