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Carl C
11-09-2007, 09:57 PM
I picked up a pile of different performance mags from the 60s &70s at the flea market today. This pic is from the 12-67 issue of Race Boat. It has 2 550 H&M engines. Allen Brown is driving.

Carl C
11-09-2007, 10:10 PM
This boat was an entry in the 1982 Gold Cup hydoplane races. It had 2 Cosworth engines. It was owned by Don Aronow and driven by Buck Thornton.

olredalert
11-09-2007, 11:24 PM
-----"DONZI Baby" has been found and is in Marine City area awaiting restoration sometime in the near future. Brownie won the 1967 Miami-Nassau race with with this very boat in 1967. Prior to his change to Holman-Moodys in 67 it ran two Chev 409s. Interesting thing is they were back to back and fed the same V-drive. As a little added bonus it is serial #1. V-drive box itself is gone but much of the propulsion setup is still with boat but not on it presently. This will be one very cool restoration. Wish I was doing it, but at least with Dick Weavers help I tracked it down. Much thanks go to Dick..........Bill S

Carl C
11-10-2007, 06:22 AM
-----"DONZI Baby" has been found and is in Marine City area awaiting restoration sometime in the near future. Brownie won the 1967 Miami-Nassau race with with this very boat in 1967. Prior to his change to Holman-Moodys in 67 it ran two Chev 409s. Interesting thing is they were back to back and fed the same V-drive. As a little added bonus it is serial #1. V-drive box itself is gone but much of the propulsion setup is still with boat but not on it presently. This will be one very cool restoration. Wish I was doing it, but at least with Dick Weavers help I tracked it down. Much thanks go to Dick..........Bill S That's cool, Bill. I'd like to hear more and see pics if you hear anymore about it. There is a lot of cool nostalgic reading here but little about Donzi; It seems that Bertrams and Scarabs pretty much ruled the day. Here are 2 pics from the 6/7-1968 Hot Boat. The boat is a "Magnum-Donzi" purchased from Don Aronow. Don is the third man in the second pic, which is from the same page.

gcarter
11-10-2007, 06:46 AM
Not to hijack this thread, but if anyone's interested in how such a system looks, take a look here; http://www.surfury.co.uk/design.htm and scroll about half way down the page.
And a note on the same site explaining the problems of such a system;
“The reasons were problematic and we never did completely iron them out; but we did form one theory to getting underway. We had to start on one engine and get that revving to 1,200 -1,300 rpm, we then had to match the revs with the second engine before engaging them together with the dog clutch. Unless you got the power between the two engines exactly the same there was bound to be a degree of “fighting” between them both, one either trying to help or hinder the other. I believe that it was during the short period of getting the speed up between the two engines that damage could be done. We were always the fastest boat - if we wanted to be. We very often ran number two, just as slow as we reasonably could but keeping an eye on the leading boat – just about two hundred yards behind.”

Carl C
11-10-2007, 08:14 AM
Not to hijack this thread, but if anyone's interested in how such a system looks, take a look here; http://www.surfury.co.uk/design.htm and scroll about half way down the page.
And a nore on the same site explaining the problems of such a system;
“The reasons were problematic and we never did completely iron them out; but we did form one theory to getting underway. We had to start on one engine and get that revving to 1,200 -1,300 rpm, we then had to match the revs with the second engine before engaging them together with the dog clutch. Unless you got the power between the two engines exactly the same there was bound to be a degree of “fighting” between them both, one either trying to help or hinder the other. I believe that it was during the short period of getting the speed up between the two engines that damage could be done. We were always the fastest boat - if we wanted to be. We very often ran number two, just as slow as we reasonably could but keeping an eye on the leading boat – just about two hundred yards behind.” This guy had twice the trouble synchronizing then because this 1933 monstrosity had FOUR Packards!

gcarter
11-10-2007, 08:23 AM
Yep, difficult, but if I remember correctly each engine had a clutch, which isn't saying that it was ever easy.

boatnut
11-10-2007, 10:54 AM
There is a lot of cool nostalgic reading here but little about Donzi; It seems that Bertrams and Scarabs pretty much ruled the day.

From my recollections (west coast POPRA/APBA offshore):
-Those days were ruled initially by Bertram and then by boats with Arronow involvment: a few early Donzi prototypes and then Magnum, Cary and Cigarette. Almost no Donzi production boats in offshore in the 60/70's. Donzi's real presence in offshore has only happened recently.
- Scarab was first built in very limited numbers by Larry Smith on the west coast (he splashed and modified a 28' cigarette initially) with a 29' model that first raced about 74 or so in the modified production class. Larry later worked a licensing/royalty deal with Wellcraft and then became a real presence on the offshore circuit.
- The early to mid 70's production offshore racing was ruled by Magnum hulls with Volvo drives (stock 270,280 drives) -- the world changed when Merc came out with the TRS Drives and shoe horned them into enough production boats to qualify for the production offshore class. Bye bye Volvo.
-On the tandem engine topic, we had a POPRA offshore entrant that raced a 24' Spectra hull (west coast boat that evolved from the Campbell) and he used two BBC engines hooked serially to one V-Drive. I think his name was Barry McGowen.

smoothie
11-10-2007, 02:40 PM
The tunnel outboard with twin mercs Hot Boat mag bottom left is the Switzercraft "wing" the boat actually lifted off the water and rode the prop...

Carl C
11-10-2007, 06:14 PM
The tunnel outboard with twin mercs Hot Boat mag bottom left is the Switzercraft "wing" the boat actually lifted off the water and rode the prop...Yup. In that race the inboards and outs ran together. That boat was fourth overall & first of the outboards......................................... .................................................. ..........Someday they will look back at our modern boats in awe when their boats are all jet turbine powered or whatever........:eek!:

olredalert
11-10-2007, 11:15 PM
-----Carl appears to be loyal to this area as Miss America X is also right here alive and well in Algonac where it was built. The Mayea bros. (Mays Craft, arguably the worlds finest wood boat builders) finished a restoration on this historic boat you just wouldnt believe unless you saw it. The 6000 horse beauty was shown around this area during this past summer. Absolutely stunningly beautiful. As a tie in with DONZI, George Desmond would have felt right at home as all four of those humungous race tuned Packards were direct drive. If they were running the boat was moving, much the same as Mighty Mouse!!!!!!!!
-----Pictures of Brownies old DONZI will have to wait a bit as it is tucked away for the winter in a pretty inaccessable storage building, but I will get some when possible. In the mean time "HORBA" has bunches of pics of the early 28 DONZIs in competion. Many of DONZI Baby.........Bill S

smoothie
11-11-2007, 08:31 AM
Back to the old magazines....heres one I picked up off of ebay.
http://www.donzi.net/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=28221&d=1176212808

gcarter
11-16-2007, 08:26 PM
This guy had twice the trouble synchronizing then because this 1933 monstrosity had FOUR Packards!
Look at what I found........one of the gear boxes and VEE drive;
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MARINE-GEARBOX-3-1-STEP-UP-MISS-AMERICA-X-WOODEN-BOAT_W0QQitemZ300170411133QQihZ020QQcategoryZ50442 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Also notice it's a gear up drive....that's really significant.

Carl C
11-16-2007, 08:34 PM
Look at what I found........one of the gear boxes and VEE drive;
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/MARINE-GEARBOX-3-1-STEP-UP-MISS-AMERICA-X-WOODEN-BOAT_W0QQitemZ300170411133QQihZ020QQcategoryZ50442 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Also notice it's a gear up drive....that's really significant. It's a small world, huh? That is from the same boat in the pic. If you blow up the pic it says Miss America X above it. Nice find George!:eek!:

Stan24
11-17-2007, 08:54 AM
Man, this stuff is great, gotta love the history. The person lamenting the lack of Donzi presence in offshore racing in the old days, should remember that just as "Harley" or "sportster" meant what you aspired to in motorcycles, "Donzi" was the word that symbolized high performance boating. This site is dangerous, its Saturday morning and I have a million things to do, and here I sit reliving th old days of my true passion.

Gearhead99
11-18-2007, 07:26 AM
Back in the mid to late 60's I was on Barnaget Bay every year. My father was a gun-ho fisherman. Ran his Luhr's up and down the bay. In and out of both Barnaget and Manisquan Inlets. I was a teenager and a Donzi flew past us on one of the trips. Of course, this young Gearhead, was ALL EYES and EARS. My father and his fishing buddies just shook their heads and said, "Damn Donzi's". I said, "That's Kool". They didn't agree.

That was the battle cry of Donzi then. Even was their telex address, if I remember correctly.

Fond memories....now I have to get up and do some work around the house. UGH !!!

Carl C
11-18-2007, 05:41 PM
Man, this stuff is great, gotta love the history. The person lamenting the lack of Donzi presence in offshore racing in the old days, should remember that just as "Harley" or "sportster" meant what you aspired to in motorcycles, "Donzi" was the word that symbolized high performance boating. This site is dangerous, its Saturday morning and I have a million things to do, and here I sit reliving th old days of my true passion. This site has made me late for work a few times too! Apparently the Classics and other smaller Donzis were never raced :(. Maybe there just wasn't a class for them or maybe they weren't competitive :boggled:.

Sweet little 16
11-19-2007, 06:04 AM
Apparently the Classics and other smaller Donzis were never raced :(. Maybe there just wasn't a class for them or maybe they weren't competitive :boggled:.
well that post is going to stir up a "HORNET" nest :p :popcorn:

boatnut
11-19-2007, 10:14 AM
Apparently the Classics and other smaller Donzis were never raced :(. Maybe there just wasn't a class for them or maybe they weren't competitive :boggled:.
For the most part they were too small for the offshore racing -- however as many of you know, the offshore classes in the 70's were very different than they are today. We raced APBA's production classes then (only could afford to race on the west coast, typically so. Calif but sometimes SF). Our races were usually at least 100 miles and frequently had legs that were 20 miles or more -- so you couldn't see your destination (typically a buoy or anchored boat). Our easiest race each year was to leave Marina Del Rey in LA and race out and around Catalina, spend the night at Catalina, and then run back to LA the next day (we called it the Rookie Run). Catalina is about 26 miles off the coast. These races were FUN, all about navagation (no GPS or electronic navigation, compass only) and building a boat that could stay together thru hours of consistent brutal pounding --even how batteries were mounted could mean finishing or not finishing. Today most offshore races are circle races set up so they can be viewed by spectators (sponsors like that) and it is primarily about speed. In our races, the winner might average less than 50 mph if the water was rough enough -- or even less in some cases. So, a classic Donzi would not compete however a properly set up 22 could have kicked butt in some of our calmer races but they didn't exist then. The most consistent production boat in that era was the 27' Magnum hulls and later the 28' Cigarettes, 29 Cary etc.
However, we can't say the Classic Donzi's didn't race -- just not in the offshore classes (might have been a few exceptions somewhere?). In 1968 and 1969 in Lakeport, CA I was watching APBA sanctioned boat races (e.g. 280 hydros, SK circle boats, etc.) and they had a new class for sterndrive boats. A red barrel back Donzi was a winning boat, and another (kind of a British green 18 Donzi) was also a competitor. It was my first Donzi experience and I was hooked. Sometime later I saw an ad for an 18' Donzi in the SF paper and to make a long story short it was the red boat I had seen in the race ----I bought it for $3400. and proceeded to blow the engine a week later in the middle of SF bay (another story). I bought if from two brothers that owned a meat packing company -- they towed it with a company truck that had "You might be able to beat our boat but you can't beat our meat" written on the side (or maybe it was the other way around :) ).
Anyway, that was a lot of words to say that Classic Donzis have been raced.
Ed

Sweet little 16
11-19-2007, 10:44 AM
well i see my punn went over everyone's head

the first Donzi model lineup consisted of 2 out of 3 race boats
the 28 and the "hornet" were both raced the 16 was not raced but the hull was based on a 17 ft Wynne race boat and the fact that these boats were raced was that Don was at the helm after Don left donzi and started Magnum His race customers followed him . At that point in racing bigger faster boats were coming out so donzi faded from the races as did Magnum some years after Don Started Cigarette, really the birth of what we have today as the boats got bigger and faster 35+ footers and Don Moved from company to company with his next new boat then someone figure out wave frequencies and that a 41 foot boat was just right ;)

so I would say Don's Classic Donzis were raced ;)

Carl C
11-19-2007, 11:01 AM
Thanks for the history Ed and SL16. I own a ton of old performance boating mags and pics or anything related to Donzi lake boats are extremely rare.

Sweet little 16
11-19-2007, 11:26 AM
after Don left Donzi, Donzi was really not present on the race circuit until the vision and hard work of Steve Simon ( may he rest in peace ) came along with the new 38zr and stirred all those old echoes of Damn Donzi with a ton of victories in f2



wonder if Donzi will ever take a run at the big boys????
Fountain and Outer limits for an all out speed run???

boatnut
11-19-2007, 04:40 PM
Thanks for the history Ed and SL16. I own a ton of old performance boating mags and pics or anything related to Donzi lake boats are extremely rare.

Well if you have the June '75 edition of Powerboat on pg 55 you can see my partner and I won our fourth production offshore race in a row :propeller: (this was the Bushmills Grand Prix out of Redondo Beach). We were the high point production boat that year. My glory was short lived, now I have a faster boat and I can't even beat many of the tournament bass boats (70 to 80mph in case you haven't noticed). For trivia fans, I believe I'm correct in saying the first official offshore race in the US was in California, it was in 1911 and they raced around Catalina Island. Also, in mentioning the early Arronow era, we shouldn't forget that Thunderbird/Formula boats won offshore races also. Formula was Don's first boat company prior to Donzi (I think). Ed