22' Classic Handling and Performance?

[TXDONZI]

I am in the process of purchasing jeffaf's 94 22' Classic with a 454 Magnum EFI, Bravo drive system with stock tabs.

I have talked to two different people about handling. Both of the people I have talked to say that these boat have some funny handling characteristics. They porpoise from 35-45 or so mph, ride rough, can be squirrelly and handle badly in anything more than 2' chop if not running directly into the waves. Can be quirky when adjusting the tabs at most all speeds and at times down right dangerous at times.

I had thought that these issues pertained to the Blackhawk model only? I had also heard in the past that these things are like a go cart on steroids and handled and rode like a dream. Why are there so many different opinions on the 22' Classics?

Also that the performance is all over the place which I understand that with the different engine, out drive and propeller combo's what is the best setup?. What are the structural differents of the different years of production as I have read there are issues to look for?

I love the 22' Classic styling and just want to know what to expect out of it!!!

Tt

[MOP]

Most of that sounds like a bunch of Milarky! Porpoise yes some but no worse then any other deep V, it is fairly easy to get rid of. A touch of tabs at cruise speeds or play with props, the Mirage was a pain but the Turbo did away with it. There are very few boats of this size and weight that will do as well as 22, cross chop is tamed by rolling the bottom towards the waves it rides softer and dryer. There is an X dimension issue with many the late boats but a 94 is fine.

Phil

[zelatore]

It's all relative my good man.

Everything depends on you're point of view. I bought a very similar boat to the one you're looking at earlier this year ('01, 502, Mirage+ prop on a Bravo I). My past experinece had been with smaller run-abouts and much larger yachts. Compared to the 18' bow rider I was using on the delta last year, the Donzi is a real wave-crusher. The same waves that would have had me headed for the trailer with the other boat are only a minor annoyance with the 22. I'll attribute most of that to the hull form and weight.

Now if I'd had maybe a 30'+ off-shore and moved down to the Donzi 22 I'd have felt like it rode like crap in comparison.

There aren't many boats of similar configuration that run as well in nasty water, but you do still need to remember it's only a 22.

There are a couple more variables as well. For one thing, what one guy thinks is unbearable another thinks is just fine. How do you define that over the internet? Pretty tough. Another thing is that a LOT of people seem to exagerate the conditions they are boating in. I hear people talking about how they blast through 4 or 5 foot chop at 50 mph. Maybe they do, but I'd never take my boat out in that sort of condition. I think it's more a case of the waves looking really big from such a low boat. I suspect if I took those same guys out on the same day on one of my Carvers they'd think the waves were about half that size. Just think about it for a second...if the waves were really 4 to 5 foot, that would mean if you were standing in the water the waves would be up to around your shoulder...would you really be running in stuff that big? I'm not calling anybody a lier, I just think things get exagerated in the 'heat of battle'.

As for handling issues, I was a little concerned when I got my boat and took it pretty easy at fist. Heck, even with a summer of time under my belt, I still think pretty hard before attacking that big cruiser's wake. I've had a few rough landings, but nothing too bad. I do get some porposing at mid-range speeds, but I think a little more practice with my tabs will take care of that (I've also got a plan to put indicators on this fall). I also get some pretty hairy chine walk when going for max speed and trimming the drive out a lot, but that's about the only time. Again I think this can be cured by practice, trim indicators, and maybe a different prop if/when I get around to experimenting. Or if somebody wants to donate an external steering system I'd be willing to give that a try as well...:wink:

If I was to sum it up I'd say the boat has it's quirks, but nothing a little seat time won't cure. Hey, it's basically a vintage design - what do you expect? I'd certainly not call it dangerous, but then again I think a little common sense goes a long way toward curing most 'dangerous' things. A lot of people would say lane splitting on my bike is danerous...but I do it every day for about 30 miles and rarely have an issue. Of course, I'm not doing wheelies down the center line either; I'm riding in my comfort zone. Conversly few people would call a 7 knot trawler dangerous but if you try to cross the Columbia bar on an ebb tide on the wrong day in one it might be the last thing you do. Common sense again...

Besides, if they were all that bad how come they've been around so long and have such a loyal following? It's not becasue they're cheap or because there's a dealer on every corner. That would be Baja. :wink:

[Stevo440]

In my opinion/experience with my 2001 22c 454 mag mpi Bravo 1, I would say that the prop on the boat has ALOT to do with the way the boat handles. Just concentrating on Two related variables here Prop and outdrive Trim. Leave the trim tabs out of the equation, also hooks and ballast and whatever else there is that affects handling. I have tried only Three props on my boat, the stock 23p M+ (3 blade), the Turbo 1 25p (3 blade) and the Turbo 2+2 24p (4 blade). When I got the boat it had the 23p M+ on it and I never liked the way the boat handled/performed/rode, it porpoised alot, chine walked really bad at and near top speed (scarey to me and everyone that rode in the boat), there are more bad characteristics but it has'nt been back on the boat since I tried the Turbo 1 25p.
Well the Turbo 1 made the boat like a totally different boat, the pitch is alittle to much for the engine about 46-4700 rpm's as compared to the 23p M+ which turned 50-5100 rpm's, with top speeds being about equal 72-73 (speedo indicated not gps). But the handling/ride is wonderful and smooth over the waves headon and at diffrent angles, also the topend is stable and safe feeling, and definetly NO CHINE WALKING so from M+ to Turbo 1 a must try, or in other words "TRY IT YOU'LL LIKE IT"
Well after getting comfortable with the Turbo 1 this year I tried a Turbo 2+2 24p 4 blade and here is the outcome for the topend guys its really stable solid NO CHINE WALKING and can go faster in rougher water than I would with the Turbo 1 and would'nt even consider doing with the M+ PERIOD !!!!!!! 49-5000 rpm's at about 70-71 (speedo indicated). Next for normal cruising around it is really rough in rough conditions in other words it pounds alot no matter what the trim is and is very trim sensitive, does'nt like much at all preatty much 0 trim cruising, will porpoise with trim. I used it the first three times out and nobody liked the way the boat rode not even me, except for the way it ran top end in choppy to moderately rough conditions, I could keep up with and pull away from larger boats.
Well this weekend I put the Turbo 1 back on and well what can I say everyone loves the boat again the ride is smooth and safe no pounding and topend is great and safe feeling especially the way the boat just lifts up out of the water as you give it trim lots of it and a nice rooster tail to boot.
Well I hope I did'nt bore anybody but that's my take on this subject in simple terms.....
Still not done tryin props yet but sofar TURBO 1's got my vote..

[gcarter]

I think every Donzi owner should try a Hydromotive Q-4 at least once. In my limited experience it never blows out, never chine walks, minimises porpoising, and for a four blade prop you give up very little on top end if any.

[tiger lily]

i found a simple solution for the porpise at cruising speeds, More throttle, itll go away i almost never use my tabs

[ITTLFLI]

The hull is excellent!!

The ride depends on the set-up and driver adjustments....

[Carl C]

The 22C is not for beginners. It is a driver's boat and is very responsive to small adjustments of trim and tabs, and it needs these constant adjustments to compensate for changing conditions when driven at speed. For me this is what driving mine makes it so enjoyable. I equate it a lot with driving my Banshee ATV. When driving fast it requires your full concentration and you try to become one with the boat. You must also have confidence in the boat because there will be times when you get out of shape but she'll always come down straight. (unless you really screw up!) Good luck and have fun. Always wear your tether and wear a life jacket if the water is rough and while you are learning.

[BigGrizzly]

Lets get this straight ----People who think this boat has handling quirks usually own a Mastercraft or Ski Nautique. All V hulls will porpoise at a given speed. However at speed they are great. I bave been boating for dome 50 plus yeard and have had Donzis since 1966. What does this tell you!!! I can have any boat that I want-price permitting--and I chose Donzi. I have a 16, an 18 and a 22 Donzi. I don't always agree with some prop selections but that ia the way it is. The last time I heard that handling BS the guy bough it out from under the guy who asked that question. To my knowledge no one has ever gotten rid of a 22 classic because it handled bad. Other point the Donzi hull design is a bench mark and the most copied hull in boating history, take it from here.

[MOP]

Bravo Randy Bravo!

[Cuda]

The 22C is not for beginners.

I didn't think so. It doesn't handle a lot different than any other boat I've owned, other than the Checkmate. If you think that a 22 is not a begginer's boat, hop in a Checkmate Mx14. That'll learn ya!:eek!:

[peregrine]

I didn't think so. It doesn't handle a lot different than any other boat I've owned, other than the Checkmate. If you think that a 22 is not a begginer's boat, hop in a Checkmate Mx14. That'll learn ya!:eek!:
OH, thank God! I thougt I was going to have to get a SeaRay or something before I could buy my 22C! LOL

[roadtrip se]

The hull is excellent!!
The ride depends on the set-up and driver adjustments....

and believe me, Byron runs a mean 22.

Where I see a lot of new Classic owners get into trouble is by not listening to what the boat is really telling them.

Quit pushing buttons in reaction to every nuance.

Instead, ask your self... What is the water doing, how much fuel and passengers, and other weight do you have on board, what kind of prop are you running, what is going on with the temp of the air and the water, what sea level are you running at, where are my drive and tabs set, and a multitude of other inputs that impact the handling of ANY performance boat.

These things are not Sony Playstations, you can't just push a button the same way every time and master the rules of the game. You have to listen to what the boat and the conditions you are running in tell you and adjust accordingly.

It's kind of a Zen thing for me.

[VetteLT193]

The 22 is a deep V boat, and IMO, all deep V boats have a 'sweet spot' range for speed.

If you take the boat faster than the sweet spot, it will be a handful to drive
If you are slower than the sweet spot, it won't drive that well either

Many 22's are equipped with power that can send them past the sweet spot... If you are not really experienced with the boat, it will seem quirky and can even be scary.

From my experience, the 'flatter' the V is in the rear, the bigger the sweet spot is for straight line running. As the V deepens the sweet spot range gets narrower, but the ride and handling within the sweet spot gets better.

[blackhawk]

I don't think any 22 boat with a 7' beam and a 24* deadrise that runs 65mph+ is for a "beginner" IMO. And I use the term "beginner" loosely. If you have been around fast vehicles, whether it be bikes, cars, snomobiles, etc that took a good deal of input then you will adapt quickly. If you haven't it may take more time.

My first boat was a Chaparral Villain II. Nice, wide boat that had probaly a 20 or 21*(I'm guessing) deadrise. It would run 55mph and was a breeze to drive. In fact, my girlfriend at the time used to take it out and drive the piss out of it. My buddy's Liberators are the same way. At 60mph you have to do something REALLY stupid to get into trouble.

As other's have said it is a driver's boat. I have had the Blackhawk, a U19 and now the Pantera 24 since the Villain and they all took a lot more concentration. As others have said you become "one" with the boat. Hell, I even talk to mine while driving! Sometimes my girl gets jealous! :D

My point is if all you have driven is a flatter bottom, wider beam boat that is slower and you hop in a Classic 22 you will have a little learning to do. Some people learn quickly and some don't.