Restoration Questions...

[Tall Cotton]

New guy. First post. Apologies if this is a dead horse. (I did search!)
Florida boy here now residing in Texas and been around boats all my life. First boat was a MasterCraft stars and stripes and I now own a Sanger. Always wanted a Donzi so here goes...

I'm interested in an older Donzi with some restoration needs. I think I've narrowed it down to an 18' 2+3 classic. Late 60's to early 80's depending on condition. I plan on doing as much of the work that I can. Some stuff I just don't have the expertize/equipment for. I'm not looking for a back to original restoration. More of an old look and new technology.

Engine/Outdrive Recommendations? I have a lot of good experience with 5.7L Mercruisers but little or no outdrive experience.
Any issues/nuances/problem areas to look for?
Expected final cost of a $2K - $4K start?
Not to interested in a 16' Something longer than an 18, maybe 20ish is a consideration. Same Classic style. Any recommendations?

Thanks, and I look forward to hear what everybody has to say.

[Donzigo]

There are idiosycrosis with each model year.

Am I reading this right? You are interested in an older Donzi that needs restoration work and are willing to spend from 2K to 4K for the initial hull/boat?

[mrfixxall]

New guy. First post. Apologies if this is a dead horse. (I did search!)
Florida boy here now residing in Texas and been around boats all my life. First boat was a MasterCraft stars and stripes and I now own a Sanger. Always wanted a Donzi so here goes...
I'm interested in an older Donzi with some restoration needs. I think I've narrowed it down to an 18' 2+3 classic. Late 60's to early 80's depending on condition. I plan on doing as much of the work that I can. Some stuff I just don't have the expertize/equipment for. I'm not looking for a back to original restoration. More of an old look and new technology.
Engine/Outdrive Recommendations? I have a lot of good experience with 5.7L Mercruisers but little or no outdrive experience.
Any issues/nuances/problem areas to look for?
Expected final cost of a $2K - $4K start?
Not to interested in a 16' Something longer than an 18, maybe 20ish is a consideration. Same Classic style. Any recommendations?
Thanks, and I look forward to hear what everybody has to say.

good luck finding one in that price rang:eek!: talk to cuda i think he'll give you a deal on a minx..(turn key boat)

[Tall Cotton]

There are idiosycrosis with each model year.
Am I reading this right? You are interested in an older Donzi that needs restoration work and are willing to spend from 2K to 4K for the initial hull/boat?
Am I missing something? I was going by what I saw in the classifieds. Namely one '67 2+3 with the top and bottom separated a 270 outdrive and no engine in CT. http://www.donzi.net/forums/showthread.php?t=46334
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I basically want to take something like that and turn it into something like this:
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Doable?
I appreciate the inputs. I'm off to the lake now. Be back on Monday...:boat:

[hardcrab]

what you save on the initial purchase price of a boat that " needs a little work " ............ you'll likely spend two fold (and more) to bring it around.

older and "cheaper" models almost always need to be recored, stringers, transom, and GAS TANK. and then you begin to outfit it.

I'm smack dab in the middle of one ; it's worth the effort if it's a keeper, otherwise spend a few bucks and start with a solid complete hull.

[gcarter]

Ditto what Rootsy said....I have over 20 K in mine .......and that's no labor.
Oh yeah....I paid $4,000.00 for it.

It's fun though, in a sick sort of way.:eek!: :propeller

[farmer tx]

TC, Come to Bass Hallow on lake Possum Kingdom Sept. 22-24 and meet up at the Texas Roundup V. There will be all sizes of Donzi's 16'-33'. There should be plenty of extra seats. Sounds like a ride in Don Tamm's 18 would be in order, 427 CID mouse with Blackhawk drive. It is a very sweet ride.

Try to be there,
Mark

[LKSD]

I would expect 15-20K minimum to do what you want.. Repowering & restoring is not cheap even if doing it yourself....

[wrussellw]

All good advice. On one level I wish I had spent more time on the forum before starting my current project.
But I wanted an older boat, wanted a 16 and really wanted to do it right. So about 16,000 later I am getting closer.
Of course a used 80's or 90's wouldn't have brand new interior, thumping stereo, all new modern gauges, custom trailer, complete rebuilt engine that I know what's inside, etc. Also will be a keeper and my son is lined up waiting to be the next owner.
Am looking for a 22 to work on over the winter?
Yes Rootsy you can say I told you.

[Donzigo]

Tall Cotton,

OK, I'm with you now. 2K to 4K would be a right price for an old hull............maybe even a little less.

There are various types of ownership types:

a. Those who like to work on boats; but, when they are finished, they sell them after a while and do it all over again.

b. Those who buy a "resto-project", use it, do a little at the time, then maybe a big chunk of downtime for a top-bottom burst to do a fuel tank, or an engine change, then back to the water to use it.

c. Those who like to "turn the key and go" types, paying for the work to be done by others.

d. Those that hitch a ride with others, tell good jokes, bring a "hottie" with the right curves, bring ALL the beer, and buy ALL the fuel for the day. (by far, the cheapest way to go boating)

Tell you the truth, on type A,B, or C, the money sometimes works out to be fairly close.

So, which type are you?

[Magicallbill]

I bought Jerry Eisele's boat(documented here on the registry.)
I did none of it myself as I haven't the talent,time, or patience.
I have $32,500.00 in it,and I have a few mop-up expenses as we blew the outdrive on our test run.
The work was all top-shelf by Randy Crum of Randy's West Shore Boat Repair. Paint job by Skater performance Catamarans.
347 Ford Racing Engine Designed by Tyrone Thorne;Built by Woody's Automotive.

It's exactly like the house I had built..It'll take longer than you think and cost more than you think.

Is it worth it...??

Oh yeah....

If you like it's under "Magic's 16" in "Performance " You'll have to scroll back a few pages, as it's been off the frontline for awhile.

[LKSD]

just realize it is money you will not get back in cash, just in pride, enjoyment and emotional value


pride, enjoyment and emotional value.

I agree :)

These are some good main reasons to get a boat.. Everyone needs to have something constructive that they take interest & enjoyment in... speed boating is not a cheap hobby, You just cant worry about the money too much.. It's best to let loose a bit & enjoy the experience overall.. Many of us give up things of lesser interests to allow more $$ & time for the boating... Just my 2 ccents.. :) Jamie

[Cuda]

It's exactly like the house I had built..It'll take longer than you think and cost more than you think.
.
I'v been in construction for 20+ years, and I've always said there are only two things you can count on.

1. It will take longer.
2. It will cost more


I found out that it is even more true when fooling with boats.

[Magicallbill]

Cuda is correct,as he usually is.
So are the other guys. I've seen it posted that you don't get your money back out of restoration projects(Donzi's)when you sell 'em.
That could be from a variety of reasons, not the least of which is the classics are so one-dimensional. Girlfriend can't lay out anywhere,no place to store skis,coolers, etc.
However if you appreciate what they are and what they mean,the dollar value,while significant is not the main thing.
My son Jason bought Jerry's boat as a surprise for me..I'll never part with it. I look at that thing in my barn and it's timeless.
Whenever I get a little squirrly about what I spent, I just hit the gas, cross a wake or two, and it's all good.

[LKSD]

That could be from a variety of reasons, not the least of which is the classics are so one-dimensional. Girlfriend can't lay out anywhere.
C'mon... The wife or girlfriend can lay out on them.. It may be a bit difficult on some boats, especially windshield ones, They just have to lay sexy like..:yes: :boat: :boat: :pimp: Jamie

PS: Donzi Kristin here. It is hard to balance on the 18 and the 22 is tough because of the windshield. And god forbid you break a windshield. Many of you know out there they are tough to come by and are very expensive if they are still in production. Jay thinks that I have wings and can fly over things as not to touch the windshield. God forbid if I fall off the boat. That is okay. Depending on my mouth some times he leaves and comes back for me. You definately need a towel to lay on so as not to slide off... :) kristin

[Magicallbill]

OK;I stand corrected..
Laying out is possible..
A good wax job on the bow and a large boat wake on the beam and D.Kristin is overboard....
Tall Cotton;
Good luck with your quest and restore project if you do it..Surely you won't spend any more than I did...

[Tall Cotton]

I am impressed. Thanks everybody. Looks like I've gotten the info that I've been looking for. Like I told Minxguy, I'm on a fact finding mission right now because I may be looking at a semi-retirement in a few years and am looking for something to keep me busy. It will probably do that but by the looks of things it also may keep me hungry as well. A newer boat in need of a new interior and refurbishment is becoming a viable option.

Donzigo, I'd probably rate a B+ on your scale. I do as much work myself as I possibly can because I've found that most times I can do it as well if not better than the shops can. I have lots of resources to draw upon. Friends that can weld and owe me BIG, an auto shop on base that has tools and expertise that I don't. Plus, if it breaks, it's my fault. I can deal with that. The only thing that doesn't make me an "A" is that I'd keep it when finished.

Yes, I know it usually costs more and takes twice as long, Cuda. We just finished a lake house. Don't know if I'd do it again! Definite thoughts to consider.

I also am going to keep the Sanger for practicality sake. It's an inboard ski boat so it can't be beat for practicality, room, skiing and "boat babe" space. Therefore I won't be hard pressed to get it done to have a boat on the water.
I would, however like a boat that makes a lot of noise, goes relatively fast and has no real practicality. Y'know, to "compensate":wink: .

I have considered some ways to keep the cost down. Lemme know if I'm smokin' crack.

Engine: A custom built race motor is a seriously shiny coin. How about a 350 Mag like the one I've got in the Sanger. 300ish hp and good for 40 mph cruising and spurts to mid 50s. I'm thinking a Black Scorpion might be a little too much. Am I thinking correctly here?

Outdrive: The only real area I'm lacking in knowledge here. I have experience with outboards and inboards, not the in between. Are rebuilt outdrives an available/cost efficient alternative? What's a good outdrive to consider? Alpha, Bravo, PV? I'm really lost here.

Thanks again everybody. It's nice to come back from three hard days on the water (and nights at the house) and see all the help y'all have to offer. I'll keep checkin' in to see if anybody has anything else. Great to be here.

P.S. Farmer tx, you have a PM

[Cuda]

A 350 mag is more than adequater for an 18. I'd go with a Merc if possible. Too many horror stories about other sources, including a couple of my own. :(

[realbold]

If spending a bit more is ok with you go for it. I have gone further than most and most think its crazy but I dont plan on selling and I know what I will have. Keeps me out of trouble. I already have a 350 built for it and plan on going with an Alpha Gen II. Not a Donzi but its roots came from an Allan Brown design. I started a thread called "Insane Project".

[onesubdrvr]

A 350 mag is more than adequater for an 18.


Says WHO?? :wink: :eek!: :tongue:

Wayne

[Cuda]

I guess it pretty much boils down to doing it for the love. It's doubtful you will save or make money restoring a boat. One good thing, if you get one that runs at all, you can do upgrades when you have the time and money to do it. It's about like paying for a new boat, but you make the payments when YOU feel like it. :)

That's pretty much what I'm going to do with Deb's 22. I imagine by the time I finish, I could have bought a newer boat for the same money, but the boat becomes a part of you when you bring it up to your standards your own way. Gcarter would be an expert on this. I admire all the things he's done on his own. Catch 22 and I were talking about that yesterday.

[Tall Cotton]

A 350 mag is more than adequater for an 18. I'd go with a Merc if possible. Too many horror stories about other sources, including a couple of my own. :(
Are you talkin' engine, outdrive, or both?

[Cuda]

Are you talkin' engine, outdrive, or both?
Both.

[farmer tx]

I would, however like a boat that makes a lot of noise, goes relatively fast and has no real practicality. Y'know, to "compensate" .

If that's what you want this is what you need. I was going to include a link to his for sale thread but it disappeared.

[Tall Cotton]

OK, enlighten me. Doesn't look like a classic. What is it?

[Tall Cotton]

Speaking of "what is it"... What's this little gem? Sweet 16, 18, Corsican? Like the lines with the windshield.
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