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DonCig
07-13-2006, 09:10 AM
Does anybody have any reccomendations or experience with aftermarket wideband oxygen sensors? I am having a bung put in my port header for using a hand held unit or a dash mounted unit like the following two links.

Thanks,

Don

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/xcart/customer/product.php?productid=16139&cat=248&page=1

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/xcart/customer/product.php?productid=16164&cat=252&page=1

BUIZILLA
07-13-2006, 09:17 AM
If your going to buy one, that's the one to buy...

JH

yeller
07-13-2006, 09:44 AM
I having been planning on installing a dash mount air/fuel gauge. I like the one you posted. Based on info from other sites, it seems the concenses is that O2 sensors don't hold up well in marine exhaust. If you are considering the dash unit, I assume you plan on leaving the O2 sensor in at all times. Do you have any concerns on the longevity of the sensor?

BTW: I plan on doing mine (despite the negative views) by installing it in a spacer between the manifold and elbow.

Ed Donnelly
07-13-2006, 09:55 AM
Don't forget led's are almost impossible to see in sunlight(don't ask)
A cheap alternative is the Auto Meter #3375 Sport-Comp Air/Fuel
Summit Racing $51.88 Uses a narrow band oxygen sensor(extra)
Works really well,but, like I said hard to see in sunlight.....Ed

Ryan23
07-13-2006, 11:36 AM
Narrow bands are about useless unless you are are only buying one for the pretty lights. They have a slim range of accuracy, right around stoich (14.7:1). Great if you are tuning for emissions but not so hot if you are tuning for power (typically 12.5~13:1 naturally aspirated, 11.5~12:1 forced induction).

I would personally recommend the FJO unit. It's available with a few different display options and uses the superior NTK sensor. It is a little more pricey but it is military grade. Not to mention that you can run two channels (one per header) and have the display indicate "leanest channel first". Sensor location should be 18" downstream from the head and I don't to see how a marine environment would effect longevity. The "brains" themeselves are in a sealed water/shock proof unit.

FWIW, I have no affiliation with FJO other than I have used their products in the past. I have a history working on aftermarket turbocharged applications in cars, import & domestic. I've been a lurker here for a few years on & off, researching & dreaming. I'm finally in a position to be able to afford to "adopt" a 22' classic if I can just find the right one :)

Ryan

HallJ
07-13-2006, 11:40 AM
I've had an inovate lm1 for a few years. It works quite well.
I just installed a GM EFI sysem on my boat, and use it on there.
I made a spacer to go between the exhast riser. one side is for the feedback to the ECU and the other side is for the wideband. I also included a port to measure exhuast backpressure. Once I know the system is tuned properly I will remove it.
Jeff

HallJ
07-13-2006, 11:46 AM
The fjo unit is also a good choice.
NGK also makes one. It must be good because they are the ones that actually make the "good" NTK sensor.

The inovate will also accept the NTK sensor it's just more expensive.

Jeff

Ryan23
07-13-2006, 12:06 PM
The fjo unit is also a good choice.
NGK also makes one. It must be good because they are the ones that actually make the "good" NTK sensor.
The inovate will also accept the NTK sensor it's just more expensive.
Jeff

One thing I don't like about the Innovative is that you have to have the large handheld unit somewhere in the chain between the sensor and the gauge. I'm surprised they haven't done away with that. I have never used on in a boat but I would be a little concerned with water/moisture entering the unit as it's not waterproof.

I wasn't aware NGK started offering a wideband. What's the display look like? Do you have a link?

Thanks,

Ryan

HallJ
07-13-2006, 12:13 PM
Ryan,

True about the moisture thing. I wouldn't leave it in there all of the time.
They do offer them with the conditioning unit in the dash mounted display.

here's the link to the NGK unit.

http://www.ngksparkplugs.com//products/air-fuel/index.asp?nav=19000&country=US

Jeff

yeller
07-13-2006, 09:12 PM
Sensor location should be 18" downstream from the head and I don't to see how a marine environment would effect longevity.

Hey Ryan,
By 'marine environment', I was referring to how it would hold up due to moisture. I've heard the sensor can't handle any. Even mounted before the water, it'll be subjected to some moisture. I was curious if Don was going to leave his in or not.

There's no way you could mount 18" downstream from the head (unless you run dry exhaust) because that'll put it in the wet exhaust.

DonCig
07-13-2006, 10:55 PM
Yeller, I only planned on leaving the oxygen sensor in the exhaust bung long enough to make sure that I had my jetting close to optimum, then I was going to pull it out and put a pipe plug in the bung for continious use. My bung will go in 2" after the collector on the headers, so that will put it approx 24" from the head.

Don

HallJ
07-14-2006, 07:42 AM
Don,

That will work fine. If you plan on leaving it in, from expierience you will have to change it once a year. no biggie.

Jeff

HallJ
07-14-2006, 07:45 AM
Just to make things clear, you can't run it in the cooling water.
It has to be in the dry section of the exhaust.

Jeff

yeller
07-14-2006, 10:33 AM
My bung will go in 2" after the collector on the headers, so that will put it approx 24" from the head.
Don
Yes, I stand corrected. You have headers, so 18" or more from the head is possible.

DonCig
07-20-2006, 06:33 AM
I decided to go with the Innovative unit and a dash monted analog gage.

http://www.innovatemotorsports.com/xcart/customer/product.php?productid=16143

Thanks,


Don

Traveler
08-03-2006, 09:02 PM
Jeff,
Your O2 spacer is very similar to one I made and installed this spring. Have you run it yet? I too am running the Innovate setup and haven't had any issues with it. The guy I bought my supercharger from had nothing good to say about the Innovate though. In fact he was downright hostile. There seemed to be some bad blood or experience but I didn't get into it with him. He advised me to stay a 1/2 pt rich to stay safe due to innacuracy in the sensor and that's what I'm doing.
BTW I'm running a Gen VII Accel DFI in closed loop until I get the VE mapped and can pull the sensor off. I just don't believe the sensor is going to live long in the marine environment and figure I'd be better off going open loop than having the ECU pull or add fuel due to a faulty sensor.

HallJ
08-04-2006, 12:03 PM
It still works fine.
Iwill take the wideband out when I can verify everythings okay, Its not part of the ECU loop. Ive run them side by side to more expensive units, they seem to read the same.
I'll leave the narrow band sensor in, if it goes bad it gives me a check engine light and the GM ECU runs in open loop.

Jeff