Sanding The Hook Out of The 22 Classic

[DudeHoss]

Hello, My name is John and I just bought a 1997 22 Classic with the 454 Magnum. This is a great forum and I am completely impressed by some of your posts. I do however have a very strange question?

Has anyone ever tried sanding the hook out of the 22 Classic. I know this may sound weird but my father has thousands of hours in the 22 and is well studied in hydrodynamics. He can't understand why Donzi left the hook in the 22 after taking it out of th 18 in 1967. So my question is, "Has anyone ever heard of anyone doing this or even thinking about it?"

[gcarter]

I took the hook out of my Minx.
And you don't have to turn it over to do it.

http://www.donzi.net/forums/showthread.php?t=43778&highlight=hook

[Cuda]

I've been meaning to ask you if you noticed any difference George.

[gcarter]

I picked up about 2-3MPH at cruise.
I'm still not satisfied w/my carb choice. Phill Reed rode w/me yesterday and he agrees I need more carb. It still falls on its face at 4200-4400 RPM, regardless of prop.
I had to re-do the bottom anyway so it just added some more time to the project.
I think it was worth it, if for no other reason than to learn to do it.

[Cuda]

What carb are you running?

[DudeHoss]

What did takeing the hook out do to the handling on your Minx? Did you have to build up the hull before you started sanding on the bottom. I'll take a look at you thread. Thanks for your input. What could I expect from taking the hook out of the 22 hull. Would it make the boat too loose?

[gcarter]

What did takeing the hook out do to the handling on your Minx? Did you have to build up the hull before you started sanding on the bottom. I'll take a look at you thread. Thanks for your input. What could I expect from taking the hook out of the 22 hull. Would it make the boat too loose?
No, it's not looser.
In fact it's more stable.
In fact, Phil Reed called it totally benign.

[gcarter]

What carb are you running?
A 600 CFM Holley.

[BigGrizzly]

I won't get into this carb thing too much, but unless you have over 400HP and turn at least 5600rpms you don't need it. My Corsican has a 600cfm and it is 351cid ad with a 650 double pumper or a 750 single pumper it isn't any faster nor does it maKe more power (same day testing). Unless you have a Big block your wasting your time. If you put on a bigger carb and it does work better then your first carb wasn't set up right. My Citerion only has a 825 cfm on it and it is a procharged 502 with well over 650HP and can turn over 5300rpms. When someone tels me they need a 900+ on this application I go over and look at their transom and yep it has black soot all over it, or will have shortly. Look at tne back of My Dam Donz(the Criterion) and you won't find that, nor on my Corsicanor our 16 sporster either. I have spent countless hours on the dyno wasting time trying to put on too big a carb in an engine. I was looking just yesterday on the spec sheet on one of Garry Grimes 572 with 736 hp and 708 ft/lbs it has only a 850 cfm. on it. The combination for the application is what counts! I know some body here has a friend that did it. I beleive if you ask anyone who has heard my boat run, they say it is crisp and clean and really responsive. Work on what you have.

[MOP]

I have a 750 that has been worked by the Auth Holley shop on my 383, it works decent but even the guy at Holley said I would do just as good with a 650. He said 750 is fine for street engines but a bit much for a boat, I would like to try a 650 on mine to see how much it helps.

Phil

[Cuda]

A 600 CFM Holley.
I've got a 750 Q jet if you're interested. What intake do you have?

[gcarter]

This has been a frustration since I started running the boat. I have tried 22" to 25" props and none will turn more than 4400 RPMs.
The engine runs real strong up to that point. Secondaries come in (vacuum) @ 3900 RPMs, it instantly runs up to 4400 RPM and stays there. There is NO soot on the transom.
The intake manifold is an Edelbrock Performer with spreadbore, an adapter plate for squarebore, and eight stud holes.
I have purchased a Qjet from a 330 HP 454, I just need to get it together, been a bit busy lately. This will be a simple swap requiring only fabricating a new fuel line.

[gcarter]

Just in case someone is thinking my tach is reading wrong, several months ago I sent it to Livorsi to have calibrated. They called me and said it was well within tolerances.

[Greg K]

Not that this thread has gotten away from the hook question already..but what type of ignition do you have?

[BUIZILLA]

GC, in addition to Greg's question, what cam and valve springs do you have? you would be VERY surprised what weak or improperly set valve springs will do to upper rpm ranges...

JH

[Carl C]

If your boat hangs off your trailer like mine does then this is where your hook came from. I've already moved mine up 3 inches and must go 3 or 4 more. I'm still working on this and hopefully no damage has been done yet. Pretty F'd up to ship a new boat on a trailer that doesn't fit.

[gcarter]

Greg, the ignition is a new T-bolt IV, V8 24* module (54 hours).
Jim the cam is a Federal Mogul Speed Pro marine cam, roller hydraulic lifters. If I remember correctly, after two years, the stock Vortec head springs (90#??) were replaced with 120# springs...I'm fuzzy on this but it seems right. 1 1/2;1 rockers, etc.
Guys, I'm open to suggestions.

[farmer tx]

George, I am working on the same problem. I will keep you posted on the results of what I try.

[DudeHoss]

What carb does the 454 Magnum come with stock? What carb and size would help the performance?

[BigGrizzly]

Not to say it was designed into the hull, but all the Criteriond have a slight hook in the top strake, Jus maybe it is because we sit in the back. The nexr play is is not doing anything at above 50-60 anyway. In my boat's case no hook is in the water at WOT anyway. Tx don't carried away yet. Unless it is a problem or the hook is on one side leave it alone at cruise my boat runs flat- for one resson, the hook. Remember the Criterion has different balance than a classic 22, this is just plane fact. The hull is also different than newer classics. look and see. That hook doesn't cause the nose to drag but lifts the boat. I had looked at this for years and am not going to change it. Don't anybody compare the Minx to a classic hull because there not even close, not strake placement size hull geometry not alike. I am not saying there bad just different. maybe the classsic has is bad, I would need to see it first.

[gcarter]

I agree with the spirit of what Randy says above.
If the hook isn't excessive, it's even on both sides, the hull bottom is in generally pretty good shape, then don't fool with it.
If, however, your intention is to run in the seventies w/o large engine expenditures, and you have the wherewithall and knowledge, tools, and place to do it, well, TAKE IT OUT!
The biggest part of the investment is the labor. The materials won't break the bank.
Disclaimer;
I didn't say that removing the hook will put you in the '70's!!:rlol:

:wavey:

[farmer tx]

Randy, The bottom on the Criterion is straight as an arrow. I was refering to the mysterious loss of 500 RPM's on the top end. Sorry I didn't make that clearer.

Later