thinking about swapping cams suggestions?

[Moody Blu']

these are the specs for the lunati in it now

Bracket Master II Camshaft Hyd.Flat Tappet RPM 1500–5000 Adv.Dur. 284 Int./Exh. Valve Lift .488 Int./Exh. Lobe Angle 112 Deg. HYDRAULIC

1975 351w magnafluxed block

351w magnafluxed/balanced crank(i forget the name of the metal NEO soemthing?)

351w rods magnafluxed, shot peened, polished and balanced

351w hyperutectic pistons

351w 2 valve heads rectangular ports not sure on comp ratio 8:1? 9.9:1?

750cfm edelbrock

edelbrock rpm performer intake

msd6t ignition

accel coil

msd distributor mechanical advance

holley 130gph fuel pump

the boat still jumps out of the hole with plenty of torque so I dont mind losing some bottom end torque for more in the higher rpm range.

im pushing my newly worked prop at around 4500-4750 rpm's and would like to be able to get this prop up to around 5300 rpm's and then re work the prop a bit to bring them down to 4800-5000

ive seen the retro fit roller cams, hows that route? SO im wondering what everyone thinks is a good way to go/ cam to pick?

are there any kits that have complete upgrades, with roller rockers as well?
or should i go with a set of higher ratio rockers as well with a matched cam lifters etc?

I figure I have to install my new oil pan and tank so why not throw in a better cam and upgrade some parts while its out. maybe a new manifold too?

any help is appreciated


Broque

[maddad]

Hey Broque, I'm not the most qualified to answer, but I do know this:
A cam swap is not a majic pill for more power. You need to take piston type, chamber shape and comp. ratio and see what cam that combo needs to make power where you want it. It's possible you have to much duration already, or your closing the intake valve to late for your comp. ratio. Talk to someone who knows Fords about all your parts,and what your goals are. Then you can come up with a solid setup.:yes:

[Moody Blu']

Hey Broque, I'm not the most qualified to answer, but I do know this:
A cam swap is not a majic pill for more power. You need to take piston type, chamber shape and comp. ratio and see what cam that combo needs to make power where you want it. It's possible you have to much duration already, or your closing the intake valve to late for your comp. ratio. Talk to someone who knows Fords about all your parts,and what your goals are. Then you can come up with a solid setup.:yes:


I added stuff to the post (my internals) but i already put up my goals?

ive talked to some ford guys down at the garvey and j boat races and they seem to swap out cams every weekend looking for that extra umph. but id rather hear from the board members:wavey:

[Moody Blu']

without knowing specifics as far as valve diameters, flow capability of the heads, static compression ratio and quench distance, yadda yadda yadda, all of those other "important" things that make stuff all work... all you can do is close your eyes and hope to pin that tail close to the donkey's ass...
retrofit roller kits ain't cheap... and rocker arms are seperate...
they are oem 1975 351w heads maybe someone has specs for them?

when i get around to it turbo will be redoing my spare set but for now, I plan on upgrading the valve springs/cam/ lifters(possibly to roller) and perhaps roller rockers so i can rev this baby past 5k without worrying.


the retro fit roller setups are around 700, now that im dealing with a german car(audi s5 twin turbo) parts for this boat motor are insanely cheap in my eyes so the money part is not a problem.

does anyone have suggestions? I listed practically everything, besides the cam intake and shot peened rods I this is pretty much an oem marine 351w

i tried finding specs on a oem 351w but cant seem to find em help a brother out?

[mrfixxall]

these are the specs for the lunati in it now

Bracket Master II Camshaft Hyd.Flat Tappet RPM 1500–5000 Adv.Dur. 284 Int./Exh. Valve Lift .488 Int./Exh. Lobe Angle 112 Deg. HYDRAULIC

1975 351w magnafluxed block

351w magnafluxed/balanced crank(i forget the name of the metal NEO soemthing?)

351w rods magnafluxed, shot peened, polished and balanced

351w hyperutectic pistons

351w 2 valve heads rectangular ports not sure on comp ratio 8:1? 9.9:1?

750cfm edelbrock

edelbrock rpm performer intake

msd6t ignition

accel coil

msd distributor mechanical advance

holley 130gph fuel pump

the boat still jumps out of the hole with plenty of torque so I dont mind losing some bottom end torque for more in the higher rpm range.

im pushing my newly worked prop at around 4500-4750 rpm's and would like to be able to get this prop up to around 5300 rpm's and then re work the prop a bit to bring them down to 4800-5000

ive seen the retro fit roller cams, hows that route? SO im wondering what everyone thinks is a good way to go/ cam to pick?

are there any kits that have complete upgrades, with roller rockers as well?
or should i go with a set of higher ratio rockers as well with a matched cam lifters etc?

I figure I have to install my new oil pan and tank so why not throw in a better cam and upgrade some parts while its out. maybe a new manifold too?

any help is appreciated


Broque

What rotsy said,,,,what is your cranking compression? for example mine is 165-170 psi.flat top pistons (srp) zero deck height .042 gasget,70cc combustion chamber,i firugure 10.2-1..the cam you have may be ok you may just need a little more compression to spin that prop...i just had my ultra 14x24 reworked and had a little xtra cup put into the prop and im still spinning it at 6200+ with a full tank and 4 people....

[BUIZILLA]

leave it alone...

:shades:

[MOP]

I am kind of with Jim!

But if you do go flat tappet REMEMBER one thing, you can ruin the cam in the first 10-15 minutes doing an improper break in. Flat tappet cams should be run up tp 2200-2500 immediatly upon start up and left ther for 15 minutes, it is very important to get the oil spash on them from the crank. There is a thread on OSO right now where a guy is condeming the cam company for two bad cams, in his write up he states how it was idled during break in. He ruined his own cams!!!!

Phil

[Moody Blu']

I am kind of with Jim!
But if you do go flat tappet REMEMBER one thing, you can ruin the cam in the first 10-15 minutes doing an improper break in. Flat tappet cams should be run up tp 2200-2500 immediatly upon start up and left ther for 15 minutes, it is very important to get the oil spash on them from the crank. There is a thread on OSO right now where a guy is condeming the cam company for two bad cams, in his write up he states how it was idled during break in. He ruined his own cams!!!!
Phil

break in procedure is not a problem for me, i built this motor when new but it was a kit. all i did was shot peen and polish the rods and brought them to a friends shop and had them balanced

I cant leave the motor alone if its going to be out of the boat, ive been upgrading the top end since i built it,different exhaust, carb spacer

now its time to do a new cam a valve train possibly, and then, bottom end time...

[BUIZILLA]

okay then, since it's out..

check the valve springs, and touch up the valve job.....

new head gaskets...

same cam....

then, leave it alone.

JH

[showtime]

Rootsy said it. Those factory heads won't flow without a lot of work. You have some mismatched components. Cams for Windsor series(289-351w) Fords with stock heads should favor exhaust timing. Early Windsor heads have poor flowing exhaust ports and there's no point trying to cram more flow into an engine that can't get rid of it. Try eating for a week without going to the bathroom! That's why the Chevy guys can't make a Ford run. The GM guys have always had decent heads from the factory. Your cam should favor the exhaust side instead of being "single pattern"(like you have now)unless you have aftermarket heads. The cam you have was designed for better heads that already have good exhaust flow. You could spend hundreds on port work and never equal what a pair of GT40 or any other aftermarket heads out of the box will flow and the guy doing the port job will probably screw them up any way. A pair of fully assembled aftermarket heads are actually pretty reasonable now. Change the cam or the heads to match! Also, you will never turn enough rpm to use 750cfm on a small block. I ran a 650 turning 7200rpm on my drag car! BEWARE OF MACHINISTS WEARING BOWTIES!!!! A Ford ain't a Chevy, they're 2 different animals!

[Moody Blu']

Rootsy said it. Those factory heads won't flow without a lot of work. You have some mismatched components. Cams for Windsor series(289-351w) Fords with stock heads should favor exhaust timing. Early Windsor heads have poor flowing exhaust ports and there's no point trying to cram more flow into an engine that can't get rid of it. Try eating for a week without going to the bathroom! That's why the Chevy guys can't make a Ford run. The GM guys have always had decent heads from the factory. Your cam should favor the exhaust side instead of being "single pattern"(like you have now)unless you have aftermarket heads. The cam you have was designed for better heads that already have good exhaust flow. You could spend hundreds on port work and never equal what a pair of GT40 or any other aftermarket heads out of the box will flow and the guy doing the port job will probably screw them up any way. A pair of fully assembled aftermarket heads are actually pretty reasonable now. Change the cam or the heads to match! Also, you will never turn enough rpm to use 750cfm on a small block. I ran a 650 turning 7200rpm on my drag car! BEWARE OF MACHINISTS WEARING BOWTIES!!!! A Ford ain't a Chevy, they're 2 different animals!

I dont know if I agree with you about the heads supposedly turbo, from the registry can redo the stock heads of a 351w to flow better then gt40's, even worked gt40 heads. for about 1200 hes gonna set me up when the time comes.


so EVERYONE is on the same level with this? dont swap cams? jeeeeeeeezzz maaaaannnn the lunatis cam i have in it is the lowest one, its not some crazy cam, there desription says must have headers and dual exhaust
doesnt seem as radical as what you guys are telling me?

no one in this forum thinks its a good idea to swap cams out for more power??? not even one up cam from what i have????

maybe i should talk to turbo about doing my heads real soon then do my cams... I really didnt feel like shellin out 1200 right now, as the work i need to do to the baot this month is gonna cost some looooot!!!!(deck off)

if anyone wants to help me let me know..

[BigGrizzly]

The cam you have is fine. my only suggestion is usr roller Rockers, not for speed but to reduce valve guide problems and save valve stems. I don't have a Bow Tie and my Corsican has a Cleveland with big heads and I have a running restored 1971 Mach one in my garage. I have a Chevy motor in my criterion. the only parts that are Chevy is the block and the outside the cylinder heads. Get it together carfully and enjoy it. next year after the boat is safe then do the motor another way. Remember that torque rules on the water.If you get too carried away you will end up slower than before.

[joseph m. hahnl]

MB: are you buying heads or modifing the stock ones???





joe

[Moody Blu']

MB: are you buying heads or modifing the stock ones???
joe


i have two sets of 1975 351w heads the set on the boat and the spares, i have the originals 2 but they are cracked down the middle when the boat sat on land for 10+ years until i revamped it with a fresh motor. why?

mop did link a sick set of heads on my "will it ever see water" thread 100 hp for heads, but there aluminum.

griz thanks, i do plan on doing the rollers, i suppose that could free up some HP and maybe get my rpms up a bit more.

i could also have my prop reworked and have tuckerton propellor cut down on my blades face so i can turn a wee bit more rpms.

[gcarter]

I completely second what Jamie said.
After 2 1/2 years of some pretty intensive work, I still haven't done anything with my engine because there's still hull work to be done.