Another compass question

[Carl C]

Like joe I'd like to mount a compass on my dash but I have the Aluminum fairing. Does anyone know if this will affect the operation of the compass? It would be directly behind it.

[tmdog]

Is it magnetic or electrical? If not, compass should be an easy install.

[TuxedoPk]

Carl- It's easy to tell whether you'll have any significant magnetic deviation by just placing the compass where you are thinking of mounting it and swinging the compass and comparing it to a handheld compass bearing.

If you've never done this, point your boat with the new compass heading to 0 degrees north. Using a handheld looking straight down the center of the bow record the compass bearing.

Now point the boat to 30 degrees and record what the handheld compass says. Repeat this process for each 30 degree increment.

When you get done you will have an indication as to the accuracy of the compass on each heading. If you are within 3 degrees or so at any given point you're fine and could go ahead and permanently mount the compass at that location. If you are off more, either find a better spot to mount the compass or you could have the compass adjusted by a pro who will place magnets in the compass for you.

** I happen to agree with Cuda's comment about not mounting a compass unless you are doing a decent amount of navigation as it takes away from the clean lines of Donzis. A handheld compass or GPS/Chartplotter (The Garmin 276 is a nice unit that can be temporariliy mounted) is a good alternative.

[Ranman]

I'm with Tux. If you only boat on inland lakes, skip the compass and get a good GPS/chartplotter. I have an in dash Ritchie compass and NEVER use it. If you absolutly must have a compass, look into the in dash ones as an option.

[Rootsy]

my vote is for a big ole arch over the rear seat and a radar pod... :yes:

[Carl C]

Well that was quite a variety of answers! I do plan to venture into the Great Lakes this year and will be out of sight of shore sometimes. I will have my handheld GPS but a compass would be more convenient. Anyway I am planning small excursions this year but eventually I want to cross Lake Erie to Cedar Point and would like to cross Lake Michigan (50 miles). A compass right in front of me will make this easier. I will experiment with my handheld compass to see if it shoots through the aluminum fairing OK before I order a flush mount one. Thanks for the input.

[gold-n-rod]

I kind of like the ones mounted out on the foredeck of the older models. Kind of neat if you ask me, but I'm not sure how it'd look on the more modern lines of the 22 with the AE fairing.

:wavey:

[Carl C]

I kind of like the ones mounted out on the foredeck of the older models. Kind of neat if you ask me, but I'm not sure how it'd look on the more modern lines of the 22 with the AE fairing.
:wavey:Randy, I don't know if I could bring myself to cutting holes in the fore deck!!

[Sam]

Trust me Carl I have done lot's of long range cruising in a boat much larger than a 22 Classic and never used my compass once. It came with the boat and I thought of it as a back to my back up GPS. With all the bouncing you will be doing you will never get a true reading. If you feel you have to have a compass get a hand held. For what you want to do and for what GPS's cost theses days I would have a main unit and a $100.00 hand held for back up.

By the way if your going off shore you better have a good VHF radio, PM me if you have any questions.

Sam

[maddad]

If you're not sure you want to cut a hole in the deck,consider a flat card compass down on the floor, or in the ski locker like mine. The hole for the lighting wire is just another drain hole.

[maddad]

Sorry all, that photo did not scan very well, but I swear that there is a compass in that black blob in the ski locker and it is easy to see day or night.

[Carl C]

Sam, I didn't think about all the bouncing throwing off the compass thanks for pointing that out. Maybe a good GPS and a handheld compass for emergencies is the way to go. I now have a handheld VHF and may install a permanent one if this Great Lakes thing works out. I might invest in a EPIRB also.

[Sam]

Carl just a note about hand held VHF radios. They only have five watts of power. The general rule of thumb is 1 watt will get you one mile of transmission. I have tested this theory many times and it has held true. The permanent style radios are 25 watts but don't count on getting out 25 miles to a similar radio. If you had to hale the C.G. beyond the 20-25 miles they would probably be able to pick you up due to the power of their radios and their large antennas. There are many factors to radio range but that's another subject.

Give me a shout sometime if you want to talk about Lk Erie, I have spent a lot of time on that body of water. Jery Eslie also knows that body very well and I'm sure would be happy to talk to you.


Good Luck
Sam

[tiger lily]

Well that was quite a variety of answers! I do plan to venture into the Great Lakes this year and will be out of sight of shore sometimes. I will have my handheld GPS but a compass would be more convenient. Anyway I am planning small excursions this year but eventually I want to cross Lake Erie to Cedar Point and would like to cross Lake Michigan (50 miles). A compass right in front of me will make this easier. I will experiment with my handheld compass to see if it shoots through the aluminum fairing OK before I order a flush mount one. Thanks for the input.


i run from grosse isle to put in bay, and kelleys island in the summer, i dont have a GPS, only compass, however i do have a good vhf ship to shore unit, most of the time the compass isnt worth a damn because of how much im bouncing around, and i know that area pretty well, going into sandusky bay to cedar point can get ROUGH, ive seen 10 footers in there before while being on my parents 40 footer.. this year im buying a plotter because its almost a darwin award leaving put in bay at dusk..

[TuxedoPk]

I don't see what the big deal is concerning 'bouncing around'. When steering a compass course don't most people get a visual bearing on land or a cloud and steer heads up to that rather than constantly looking down and eyeing up the compass card.

For most purposes a quick look at a handheld compass will give you a visual position to steer when you are up on plane and bouncing around.

[MOP]

All this talk about bouncing around must be something new, back in 66 I had a G3 with a 90 Merc. I had a Richie power damp stuck through the fore deck it read darn good and that boat got a lot of air and bouncing, my eye balls danced harder then the compass.

Phil

[joseph m. hahnl]

You guys are making me feel bad!!!!

The compass I bought is specifically designed for off shore Racing so I would say that all your bouncing around is a compass not designed for the boat.
as far as the wndshield interfearing .The compass comes with compensators. aluminum is non magnetic I tend to doubt it would create any interferance. What you do have to avoid is electrical fields created by wires and switches.The compensator will not be able to eliminate that type of distortion.
I would agree that GPS is a cool alternative but would not fit any were in my boat that would look as clean as a flat card compass.
Last of all. As you all Know I just put my trim tab buttons on my steering wheel so obviously I prefer to keep both hands on the wheel and holding a portable compass in my hand would defeat the purpose.The reason Most of us don't use compasses is because we don't know how to.The coast guard gives navigation courses that would benifit the worthiest of seaman .

SO CARL: don't let everyone bully you. If you trully want and desire a compass you can hold of till I test mine and I'll let you know if it's worth a
4" hole in the dash top.

joe

[Sam]

Try following a compass in the dark or fog with no visual references :banghead: . ( good point for radar but not on a classic :D ) What if there is no land in sight what do you do then? What if all the rocks on shore look the same, what then ? What if you are looking for a specific buoy or series of buoys marking a channel, if you’re off a few degrees your screwed. I could think of many reasons why I would chose a GPS over a compass as my primary navigation devise.
For my money and peace of mind you can not beat the predictability, features and saftey factor of a GPS. And if you don't believe me the next time you need to call the Coast Guard in an emergency ask them if they would prefer a compass bearing or a GPS coordinate :wavey: .

[TuxedoPk]

One things nobody has mentioned is that for compass navigation you need to have paper charts. I don't remember seeing too many classics with navigation tables.

Sam- I did a coastal navigation course last summer when sailing from CT to Maine and encountered many of the issues you described- fog, lack of visual points of reference at times, shore line that looked so much the same you'd swear you were on Lake Cumberland :)

What helped quite a bit under those conditions was having a depth meter and being able to do a bit of the navigation by following depth contour lines.

Based on the amount I learned I think formally learning to navigate with paper charts, taking bearings, deducing your postion, etc. is worthwhile and can be a lot of fun even if you wind up using a chart plotter as your primary means of navigation. To me, its like enjoying a manaul transmission vs. driving with an automatic.

Joe- I wasn't suggesting driving your boat holding a hand held compass. I was suggesting to stop the boat, take a compass reading towards where you want to go, and looking for a house/tower/marking on land or a particular cloud in the sky that lines up or is at a fixed angle from where you want to go. You can then put the handheld back in your pocket, get back on plane, and head toward your visual point of reference.

[Sam]

I agree with you Tux, you should know how to use charts and compass, hat's off to you for taking the course. When I was cruising we always charted our course out the night before we left port, just in case. The only sugestion I would make as far as charts go is if you can find strip or bound charts it makes it much easier to read them on a small boat.

You hit the nail right on the head speaking about Lk Cumberland. I made the mistake of following a bunch of boats last year and guess what.................we hit a dead end and were all lost v:mad:.

[Rootsy]

I agree with you Tux, you should know how to use charts and compass, hat's off to you for taking the course. When I was cruising we always charted our course out the night before we left port, just in case. The only sugestion I would make as far as charts go is if you can find strip or bound charts it makes it much easier to read them on a small boat.
You hit the nail right on the head speaking about Lk Cumberland. I made the mistake of following a bunch of boats last year and guess what.................we hit a dead end and were all lost v:mad:.


what do you have for a handheld gps sam, i forget?

[Carl C]

If you trully want and desire a compass you can hold of till I test mine and I'll let you know if it's worth a
4" hole in the dash top.
joe Yes, I'd appreciate that. Thanks for all the input. One thing I just learned is that if I do go for a compass is to buy a good one. I'll also bust out my catalogs and see if there is a GPS that would look good mounted on the dash top. I guess a lot depends on how this Great Lakes thing works out. There is so much to do and learn this year and I can't wait to get started. This will be my second season as a Donzi owner. Last year was spent on small lakes and getting used to the boat. This year I will slowly venture into bigger waters, starting with Lake St. Clair. With all of the horror stories about Lake Erie I will probably not go there this year. tiger lily - 10 foot waves @ Sandusky Bay?:eek: :eek:Has anyone crossed Lake Michigan? Is it a little tamer than Erie? At 50 MPH it's only an hours cruise at the narrow part.:)

[tiger lily]

Yes, I'd appreciate that. Thanks for all the input. One thing I just learned is that if I do go for a compass is to buy a good one. I'll also bust out my catalogs and see if there is a GPS that would look good mounted on the dash top. I guess a lot depends on how this Great Lakes thing works out. There is so much to do and learn this year and I can't wait to get started. This will be my second season as a Donzi owner. Last year was spent on small lakes and getting used to the boat. This year I will slowly venture into bigger waters, starting with Lake St. Clair. With all of the horror stories about Lake Erie I will probably not go there this year. tiger lily - 10 foot waves @ Sandusky Bay?:eek: :eek:Has anyone crossed Lake Michigan? Is it a little tamer than Erie? At 50 MPH it's only an hours cruise at the narrow part.:)


st. clair(lake st. stupid) is usually worse, its a small lake, and the boat wakes are what gets rough, just like running in the channels of the detroit river, lake erie can get bad, but what you have to rember about these small lakes is that, 4 footers on erie, will seem like 6 or 7s on michigan, they are real close together, where as lake michigan they are far apart, the closer together they are, the more of beating you take.

[Sam]

Tiger lily your right to a certain extent about lake St Clair but like any body of water you have to know it. My cottage is on Harsens Island so I run my little 16 on Lk St Clair and the surrounding channels all the time. The key to this body of water is timing. During the week I can go anywhere I want to. On the weekends I can do the same up until 12:00 pm or so. After that I have to pick and chose my routes more carefully due to traffic / wind conditions. Having said that I run my 20' Key West anywhere any time I want. So for those of you with 22’s you obviously have a big advantage. Feel free to call me any time if you want to come out sometime.

Carl, I've cruised Lk Michigan a few times. The thing about that lake is due to its shape there are fewer options to run and hide if the weather gets nasty. The other thing and this goes for all lakes is you have to have a contingency plan. By that I mean you have to know your port options. Mother Nature and or mechanical issues may force you to deviate from your original plan. So before venturing out make sure you know what your port options are up and down the coast line.

Also, please feel free to call me anytime if you want the ten cent tour of Lk St Clair and the surrounding waters. There are several Donzi owners that run out here as well; Ranman, Kraven and Ol'Red just to name a few.

James, As for hand helds I have one Garmin that's ten years old but I forget the model and the one I use on the 16 is the little Etrex ($100.00). I really only use it as a speedo.

Sam