Wet wet wet - Interior

[Chili 18]

This has been my first full summer of Donzi fun. Yeaaaaaaaa :-)

But a trouble spot has come up and am wondering how others deal with the issue presuming its 'not just me'...

I have a complete new interior from B-R. It looks terrific. However, when I have friends along and swimming and skiing and splashing happens... The seats soak up the water like a sponge and stay wet for a very long time resulting in mildew etc.

Water gets under the rubber backed carpet and the backing wont allow the water to evaporate. Solution, remove the carpet when it may get wet. Though, seems the carpet should be breathable somewhat..

The front seat bottoms become soaked. Only thing to do is tip them up on their sides in the sun with the seams down so watter can seep out over a few days.

The rear bench seat has a zipper. The foam inside is just that standard upholstery tanish color foam. Its a sponge. The foam was wrapped in a thin plastic bag which has failed allowing water to get in, but not evaporate. Solution, remove the foam andthe plastic and let the thing drain out for a few days.

Seems the cushions should have been made with some kind of closed cell foam that wont hold the water like that. Like the stuff ski belts, and floating key chains are made of.

Just wondering about others experiences with wet interiors, how you deal with it, and if a better solution exsists. ??????

Cheers!

[Morgan's Cloud]

Oh when , oh when are boat manufacturers with open cockpits going to start using 'quick dry' foam for upholstery work ?
It's been available for a good while now and I can't see it adding much (anything) to the final cost .

S

[knots2u]

Please do not be insulted, but first use a little common sense. If you know everyone is soaking wet have them sit on a towel! :bonk: This problem is not limited to just Donzi's, it is a problem that exists with every boat/car/interior.
The plastic wrap has nothing to due with waterproofing, if the foam was not wrapped it would not, I repeat NOT slip into the upholstery. All foam, open cell or closed cell has to be wrapped. To help with drainage in the past few years we have added some grommets for drain holes on the bottom of the cushions, check to see if you have them. What I would do is remove an area of plastic on the bottom of the cushion to allow the foam to drain, just unzip and snip some plastic away. Using a closed cell foam adds significant cost and also makes the seat hard as a rock, any bouncing around over waves is sure to cause back injury!

[Chili 18]

Hmmm,

Perhaps some temporary 'wet use' bottom cushions could be molded from that spongey fairly soft ski belt material. For wet use. Then the uphostered bottoms could be saved for dry and show use.

For some of my friends, just dragging them back onboard is enough of a chore much less trying to keep things dry....

Knots2u, could be a market for such a product??

[Ranman]

I keep my seats as dry as possible through the use of towels. Beyond that, once I get home for the day, I always lift up the front seat bottoms and unsnap the back seat cushions and position them so any water behind the cushoins can dry. I'll only un-snap the carpet after a particularly wet day. Lucky for me the boat stays in the garage when not in the drink.

[DonziJon]

I have a twenty year old Minx with the original cushions and foam stuffing. The foam is not wrapped in plastic. No One swims off the boat, however, a leaky tonneau cover will collect rain in little puddles in the rear corners, which will drip water into the boat on the rear cushions. The tonneau cover is 10 year old "Sunbrella". The guy that made it for me says "wash the cover in an "Industrial" type washing machine in a laundramat and Re Waterproof it" with waterproofing stuff that is available in a spritzer bottle from West Marine and made for "Sunbrella" material.

I havn't done this yet because I'm LAZY, so I will continue to remove the foam from the cover every season and dry it out. It takes about two days in the warm September sun on the dock. You have to remove the foam from the covers or you WILL get mildew. Turn the covers inside out to dry. Putting the foam back is not that bad once you get the knack. After years of practice, it's actually pretty easy. ALSO: Doing it this way, you don't have to go to a laundramat and sit around for two hours waiting for it to get done.http://www.donzi.net/ubb/graemlins/cool.gif

[need for speed]

little rule on my boat.. dry off and don't step or sit on the seats :kaioken: , before you get dry!! pain in the... but the seats are all like new and they are 12 years old. :banghead:

[Ted Guldemond]

I just had some cushions made with a filler material that resembles the course mesh of a scotch bright pad (obviously with out the abrasive). The canvas guy convinced me when he demonstated by pooring water on the stuff. It ran right through it. The bottom of the cushion was made with a heavy duty screen material, the same stuff a lot of out door patio furniture is made with. Again the water just runs through it as well. I'll try to get the name of the filler material.

[Bob]

Just tell the girls to take their suits off if they're wet. :eek!: :rlol:

[Chili 18]

Ok, so far, four suggestions:

1 - Its my fault for getting them wet. Dont get them xxxing wet! If you do, just deal with it - ok...

2 - Mold a closed cell lower cushion for when you just know it will get wet.

3 - A porous cushion material inside the upholsery with a draining mesh on the bottom side of the cushion allowing water to pass thru. hmm...

4 - Ask the ladies to remove their bikinis if they are wet before being seated.



I like number four even if another solution is used...:-)

[MOP]

Curious was B-R building the interiors in 1991? My 91 16 which I am absolutey sure had the original interior had hard foam like the throwable cushions they did not absorb water, the cushion bottoms had mesh to let them breath. They were a bit hard on the butt, but the covers would dry in a few hours if they got soaked.

Phil

[DonziDave]

Need for Speed has it right....drip dry first, sit on towels, and NO stepping in the seats. My 18C is 19 years old with the original seats and they still look great.

Dave

[gold-n-rod]

4 - Ask the ladies to remove their bikinis if they are wet before being seated.

I like number four even if another solution is used...:-)

Me too. :D #4 it is, then?

[knots2u]

Bilt-Rite did the interiors in the Classics from 1964 - 1996. Mesh (Phifertex)was used on the bottom of the cushions for a few years, mid 80's-early 90's. It was found that the mesh would break down before the vinyl. No closed cell foam was ever used as original to Donzi. I have done 1, maybe 2 replacement sets with closed cell foam in the bottom cushion, I don't remember exact price but do recall it was expensive, and as I said before, hard as a rock. I have also looked at the dri-fast foam (scotchbrite like foam) but could not get the right compression, I have samples of every compression available but found that even the best was too soft. The plastic wrap will deteriorate over time so I'm not surprised by some of the other posts, it could also be the previous owner removed it. Stepping on the cushion while climbing in and out of the boat is a no-no for sure, but very hard to avoid. As with everything, maintenance is the key to longevity. I have seen original cushions from 1964 that were in better shape then some that were only a few years old, maintenance was the reason. There is no easy answer, other than #4 :D.

[Morgan's Cloud]

I just had some cushions made with a filler material that resembles the course mesh of a scotch bright pad (obviously with out the abrasive). The canvas guy convinced me when he demonstated by pooring water on the stuff. It ran right through it. The bottom of the cushion was made with a heavy duty screen material, the same stuff a lot of out door patio furniture is made with. Again the water just runs through it as well. I'll try to get the name of the filler material.


EXACTLY what I was talking about .. word for word ... even the builder doing the 'water test' :D !

It's how I had the upholstery done on the Magnum .

S

[Barry Phillips]

My 18 were caught in a downpour and the interior soaked through. Take the foam out seats and let dry in the sun, they are bitch to reinstall, but will go back in place. You can forget about the fine membrane material between seat material and the foam, unless you have lot patients.

[Marlin275]

As with everything, maintenance is the key to longevity. I have seen original cushions from 1964 that were in better shape then some that were only a few years old, maintenance was the reason. There is no easy answer, other than #4 :D.

What is the best maintenance to make them last 40 years?

[knots2u]

Briefly, care for the cushions as you would with any other prized possession! Try not to step on the cushion, that will damage the stitching. Try not to get them soaking wet, if you do dry them out promptly. Stand the bottom cushion on the long edge when not in use. Clean them regularly, do not use armor all. Low odor mineral spirits is excellent for cleaning and rejuvenating the vinyl. Customers have told me they also use the 3M waterproofing treatment on their cushions, same stuff as used on sunbrella. It will soak into the seams on the channeled vinyl and help keep water out. Like the others have said, if you remove the foam turn the cushion inside out, there is also foam where the vinyl is sewn on. Make sure your cover is not leaking!

[txtaz]

Am I the only one who doesn't have problems with their cushions? I don't do anything special other than air them out when they get really wet.
Wes

[Chili 18]

here is a link to one reseller of drifast foam

http://www.scalisemarine.com/foam.htm

Believe the mfgr is Foamex, but couldnt locate product details on their www. though its probably somewhere.

Knots. Great product quality and advice on care. No questions on that. However the sponge water retaining material used for the cushion bottoms is unacceptable for my needs. Every weekend this summer the cushions got wet from waves on lk Michigan, or wet friends. Play all weekend and open and dry the seats all week,only to have them saturated again... not my idea of fun. I will gadly sacrafice a small amount of ideal comfort for proper functionality for my needs. Seems this material should be a standard option when ordering from B-R. with disclaimers provided and the trade offs explained.

I love having my friends onboard and also lots of their little munchkins. Certainly dont want to be capt. bligh scowling and barking at everyone to dry off and tow the line...

Probably a larger boat which is more dry by nature, and has plenty of room to stand and towel off, the rules are different. On an 18, often the only option is sitting or laying low...

I will probably make this a winter project. Replacing the foam in my seat bottoms. and adding drainage on the bottoms.. If so, ill try and remember to post an update in the future. Worth a shot....

Cheers,
Chili

[Chili 18]

.....

On second thought...

I dont have the heart to modify the beautiful B-R product. Its classic and I'm grateful to be able to have a factory new interior on my 'old' 87.

Will however have some wet use cushions made up from the stuff they make patio furniture from.

Best of both worlds!

C....

[Ted Guldemond]

I would be very cautious of using mineral spirits or any other hydrocarbon based solvent on vinyl. It removes the plastisizer which leads to the vinyl getting prematurely brittle and cracking. 303 Aerospace Protectant is recommended by vinyl manufactures as well as hypalon and vinyl inflatable boat manufactures to protect against UV. It has no hydrocarbons or silicone.

[knots2u]

"Low odor mineral spirits" is safe for vinyl, it is packaged in plastic bottles! Use a little on a white cloth, wipe on, wipe off. Any solvent from a glass or metal container such as acetone or laquer thinner is not recommended.

Bob
Bilt-Rite Uph.

[Carl C]

I have used mineral spirits to remove glue from the backs of DVDs, after removing stickers. It makes them brittle and they crack and crumble. They are plastic and the MS ruins them!! :eek:

[knots2u]

Here are some links to the manufacturers website in regards to cleaning vinyl. We use three brands: Naugahyde, G&T Marine Specialties, and a little Boltaflex/Nautalex. All early model Classics (1964-1985) were Naugahyde, late model (1986-up) Classic interiors are G&T. If you don't know what brand you have unzip the cushion and look at the back of the vinyl. Naugahyde has the naugahyde logo, G&T has large printed diamond shapes, Boltaflex/Nautolex generally has no marking. The key to cleaning with a petroleum solvent is not to AGGRESSIVELY rub a stain. All sewing machines use oil, lots of oil. Every interior/cover we make ends up with some oil on them. We WIPE it off with mineral spirits, which is the least potent of the petroleum based solvents. We do not use acetone or lighter fluid. I have found nothing that removes ink without damaging the vinyl, pens are FORBIDDEN at Bilt-Rite. If you get oil or grease on the vinyl wipe it off immediately, it will permanately stain if allowed to set in. Read on:

Naugahyde (http://www.naugahyde.com/cleaning.html)

G&T Marine Specialties Group (http://www.marinespecialtiesgroup.com/msg.html) left click on Products

Nautalex/Boltaflex (http://www.omnova.com/products/contractupholstery/documents/prefixxprotectivefinish.pdf)

We do not use CD's to make interiors or covers :biggrin.:
Care & Cleaning of CD's (http://sony.storagesupport.com/mediacare.htm)

Suggestion #4 from the earlier post is the best idea, post some pictures!!!!

[Chili 18]

Suggestion #4 from the earlier post is the best idea, post some pictures!!!!
;) ;) ;)

[joseph m. hahnl]

alcohol removes ink;

i noticed my bench seat was wet didn't think to much about it. but it would seem to me you could use a water repellent spray. as i haven't done it myself i would read the warnings on the spray and cautions for what fabrics you can use it on. as all products allways say test it on an inconspicuos area.

if you now what type of vinel you could by a small piece from a fabric store and test the spray on it. and if you take the foam out it would probably be wise to spray it also.


as far as people stepping on the seats .well i leave my boat in the drive way.
no one is allowed in the boat" ever" including my self. that way the interior never gets dirty and looks new. :shocking: :shocking: :shocking: :shocking: after all i bought my donzi not to use but just to say i have one.



heres some food for yah. there is a couple of snowmobile dealers up here who leave there new sleds out side. no covers no protection what so ever.

would you then consider that a used machine seeing how it's been weathered????????????????????????????????????????? ??????????



joe