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Jabes
06-22-2005, 03:59 PM
Cruising in a straight line in my 22 classic, and its like it popped out of gear with no warning. No clunk or any unusual noise for that matter. Engine revved way up, but I throttled her back quickly. Motor runs fine, and I can see the shift cables moving on top of the motor, but I have no forward or reverse. I'm hoping its the cable from the shift mechanism down to the gears. Any input greatly appreciated. Also, who's a good mechanic in SE Michigan that won't rip me off? Thanks!

Trueser
06-22-2005, 04:03 PM
Check your coupler....................

Jabes
06-22-2005, 04:10 PM
Check your coupler....................


I was told it may be that, but I was also told that the coupler goes under heavy strain as planing or turning at high speed. I was going straight when it quit. I think I know where that is, how do I check it?
Thanks

Trueser
06-22-2005, 04:23 PM
Try marking the driveshaft behind the coupler and see if it's turning when you run the motor or turn it over.

What year boat and motor?

Mike

roadtrip se
06-22-2005, 04:23 PM
Try Ed Smith, marina owner and part time offshore racer.

He owns a marina in St Clair Township.

Bill Stephenson introduced me to him, when I was having some issues with my IMCO lower. Fixed me right up, when nobody else could.

810.329.2908

RT

Lenny
06-22-2005, 04:49 PM
Ed and his wife also looked after my X-18 for me and gave GREAT service as they babysat it prior to shipping it to me on the West Coast. Did services and all, up front, trusted Bill S to make good for me if I didn't pay for it. I respect their service, Bill's too for that matter :wink: :yes: All was handled effortlessly from 2400 miles away and a phone.

Jabes
06-22-2005, 05:04 PM
Try marking the driveshaft behind the coupler and see if it's turning when you run the motor or turn it over.

What year boat and motor?

Mike


85 22 classic, originally 350/260, re-powered in 2000 with a 383 using many parts from the old 350. Sounds like our 22s are similar. I get 60 mph out of her, gps in 1-2 foot chop. about 57 on flat water.

Jabes
06-22-2005, 05:08 PM
Roadtrip and Lenny- Thanks, I'll call Ed tomorrow. Bill S should have been the first call I made. He is the Donzi guru. Thanks again!!!!

MOP
06-22-2005, 07:37 PM
Check the prop hub, if the coupler let go you would know it! It stinks the whole boat up of burning rubber smell. Could be in the drive, hope not but I have had guys bring in boats that the upper gear set just let go. Drain a little of the gear oil to see if it shows signs of metal, but have a hunch it is the prop hub.

Phil

Sam
06-22-2005, 08:05 PM
Call Art Cook (Art Cook Marine Service) on the Island he moved his shop right across from the ferry exit. He is the Best !!! Right now his shop is a bit messy due to the move but he will treat you right. Tell him Sam sent you.

Sam

Jabes
06-22-2005, 08:41 PM
Check the prop hub, if the coupler let go you would know it! It stinks the whole boat up of burning rubber smell. Could be in the drive, hope not but I have had guys bring in boats that the upper gear set just let go. Drain a little of the gear oil to see if it shows signs of metal, but have a hunch it is the prop hub.

Phil

Yeah, I thought that would be kind of violent if the coupler went. I'll check the gear oil.
Is there a way to tell if its the hub without tearing it apart?
Thanks.

Jabes
06-22-2005, 08:43 PM
Call Art Cook (Art Cook Marine Service) on the Island he moved his shop right across from the ferry exit. He is the Best !!! Right now his shop is a bit messy due to the move but he will treat you right. Tell him Sam sent you.

Sam

Thanks Sam. I'll call him tomorrow.

Rootsy
06-22-2005, 08:58 PM
geez no one has any faith in me?

if it is an alpha, pop the top cap off of her and see if the gears are intact... if the gears went you'd hear it when the motor was running, pretty confident of that but does not hurt to check...

MOP
06-22-2005, 09:00 PM
Yeah, I thought that would be kind of violent if the coupler went. I'll check the gear oil.
Is there a way to tell if its the hub without tearing it apart?
Thanks.

I still do not think the coupler died, you get some smoke and a enough stink of burning rubber to know it let go, if the gear oil looks nice (expect a blob of dark stuff on the magnet) I would pull the prop and look at the back side for sticky rubber blobs where it contacts the hub. Spun hubs are pretty common, if you do find what appears to be a little to much metal in the oil do not start it that can keep you from doing more damage and the bill a little lighter.

Phil

Dr. Dan
06-23-2005, 05:47 AM
:smash: OK This is fun...I had these symptoms twice in the last 3 weeks on mine! First time it was the lower Shift Cable going to the Drive...it had frayed enough to not allow engagement of the gears.

Last weekend at Lake George after doing the whole run on Saturday, the engine went into what I thought initially was a cavitating prop, turned out I spun the Hub, which visually there was little evidence of BTW...but that is what it was...we had idle ability to get back into the docks...but over 2000 rpms the boat would act like it was stuck on a patch of ice. :bighug:

So do I win something for experiencing both problems with similar characteristics and having to very different resolutuions? I didn't think so....the shift Cable was like $140 from Doug Russell, plus $40 to overnight it cuz I was going to the DustOff in a week! The Labor ...well for me I had to pay "Getter Done Rates" which was worth it...until the Hub Spun and I realized I had left my Spare Prop in my Friggin Garage...Ohhhh! :lookaroun

Good news is I got home very early Sunday afternoon...bad news is I missed another day of running with my pals in one of the most beautiful spots on the Planet...with 10" of water over the docks but hey?

Oh BTW I contacted Turbo Props and they are going to rehub the Prop, I sent it back to them already!

Good Luck

Doc :smash:

Pismo
06-23-2005, 06:12 AM
If the coupler goes on an Alpha drive it will over heat promptly. You may not get the rubber burning either, when mine blew it was the splines in the coupler that gave up, not the rubber.

olredalert
06-23-2005, 08:33 AM
Doc,

-------With the power you are now pushing I would think you should bring along 5 or 6 extra props. Just being prudent, dont you know............Bill S

boldts
06-23-2005, 09:39 AM
Just to add to OleRed's comment. Doc, you probably need to add a 26 or 27" Turbo TXP to your arrsonel. Maybe a 25 or 26" Hydromotive Quad IV to the mix from your post about what others are running on their boats. Your statement that you had 5200 with a passenger, full fuel and it was still climbing is a sure sign that more pitch or more gear in the drive is needed. I guess it would actually be a lower gear number when looking at the ratio numbers I think?

Back to the original problem and regularly scheduled question about drive losing bite. I guess it could be a spun hub in the prop. I only had that happen once and like the good Doc, boat would still move albeit very slowly at a much increased RPM rate. No expert, but I think I'd be looking at the shifting cable going to the drive since the engine runs fine, but no gear. Do you have reverse by chance or completely nothing in either direction?

Dr. Dan
06-23-2005, 10:16 AM
:cool!: Good Points guys...when I lost my Shift Cable I had Reverse but no Forward, we couldn't even manually put it into gear when disconnecting the Linkage...and using Pliers to move the cable.

I have 1.43 Ratio in the King Cobra...and the 25 Turbo seems to hit the Sweet Spot...I may get one labbed or try a 26...but the 27 was too tall for sure...we only hit about 70 all weekend in LG with 3 of us...course it was rougher than heck...but there were areas to open up and I was maxed, too much pitch.

I am looking into a Quad 4 from Hydro...

When I am not with Lizard I will Air it out and see if I can't break the 80 MPH Barrier...76 and climbing was moving Arse when we weren't even trying to...

Oh Todd..the World may never know... :p

Doc :bonk:

Pismo
06-23-2005, 01:27 PM
If it overheats, it is the engine coupler or the upper gear set, if no overheating it is the prop hub or a shift problem/lower gears. That will narrow it down quickly. (If an Alpha drive)

Barry Phillips
06-23-2005, 02:33 PM
My 375 hp 496 Mag equipped 22 is running a 23’ Mirage Plus. I have no complaints about the performance of the boat at 68 to 70 mph; it runs like stink for 375 HP, the boat is also dead stable. I will say the boat is without a doubt under propped, the 496 Mag is specked for out for 4,800 rpm at WOT, and I’m spinning 5,000. Although the H0’s are shipped with 25s they are designed to run 5,000 to 5,200 RPM. Since I’m bumping up against my rev-limiter alarm on flat water, a 24’ wheel or a labed 25 would seem to be perfect. A little stern lifed would not hurt either. Bob Haver is running a labed 25’ Mirage on his 502 equipped 22. Bob is claiming 54+ mph on GPS at 5,000 RPM, I would love to try this prop, and I promise I won’t break it.

joseph m. hahnl
06-23-2005, 08:45 PM
Cruising in a straight line in my 22 classic, and its like it popped out of gear with no warning. No clunk or any unusual noise for that matter. Engine revved way up, but I throttled her back quickly. Motor runs fine, and I can see the shift cables moving on top of the motor, but I have no forward or reverse. I'm hoping its the cable from the shift mechanism down to the gears. Any input greatly appreciated. Also, who's a good mechanic in SE Michigan that won't rip me off? Thanks!


there are 2 cables one from the remote shifter. and one into the out drive.
put the trim up and look up underneath to see if the shifter is rotating in the lower unit when you move the remote forward to reverse

thriller
06-24-2005, 08:49 AM
Sounds like a vertical shaft:banghead: I hope not......:confused:

MM

Let us know what they found?

roadtrip se
06-24-2005, 10:13 AM
Just to add to OleRed's comment. Doc, you probably need to add a 26 or 27" Turbo TXP to your arrsonel. Maybe a 25 or 26" Hydromotive Quad IV to the mix from your post about what others are running on their boats. Your statement that you had 5200 with a passenger, full fuel and it was still climbing is a sure sign that more pitch or more gear in the drive is needed. I guess it would actually be a lower gear number when looking at the ratio numbers I think?

Back to the original problem and regularly scheduled question about drive losing bite. I guess it could be a spun hub in the prop. I only had that happen once and like the good Doc, boat would still move albeit very slowly at a much increased RPM rate. No expert, but I think I'd be looking at the shifting cable going to the drive since the engine runs fine, but no gear. Do you have reverse by chance or completely nothing in either direction?

Hey Doc,

I just received a TXP from MP Skunkwerks and Propeller Discount Warehouse.
It has the square hub, so I can put it on my XR shaft, which means it will take a K Cobra hub too.

I'll load it up with the arsenal for the trip to 1K islands and we can do a couple of on the dock prop changes just to see what happens. Probably, too much pitch, but we'll be able to get a feel for what it does to the attitude of the boat. If you really have the guts, we'll put "Ole Diablo", my labbed Mirage, on afterwards.

One boat, so many props, what do we try today?!

RT

Jabes
06-24-2005, 02:45 PM
Ed Smith has it now. He thought it may be the vertical shaft. I spun the prop with my hand while it was in gear (with the tether off of course), and it spun with a little resistance in the direction of what gear it was in, but it would lock up the opposite way. Hopefully I'll get the call today and I post the actual problem. Jabes

boldts
06-24-2005, 05:01 PM
I believe that is how it is supposed to be. Depending on whether it is in forward or reverse depends on which way the prop will free wheel. If you can't turn it in the opposite direction, I belive that means the shaft is not broke but it is in gear.

I think that leads us back to a spun hub on the prop or the shift linkage not engaging although it sounds like you were in fact able to put it in gear since you couldn't turn the prop.

Looking forward to reading what is found for future reference.

Pismo
06-29-2005, 09:32 PM
What was the final verdict?

Jabes
07-02-2005, 12:09 AM
Sorry, I've been out of town.

Vertical drive shaft snapped at the lower taper.
Having the bellows replaced while the drive is off... Just under $1800.
Haven't seen a parts list yet, but I will post when I get it back.

Ed Donnelly
07-02-2005, 12:12 AM
OUCH ............Ed

Jabes
07-02-2005, 12:16 AM
OUCH ............Ed

Yeah, that sucks. No fourth of July for her this year!! :bawling: