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MOP
11-10-2004, 08:19 PM
Soon my 22 project is starting, have a heated barn and all the gizmos to do any and all work. With the possiblilty of some stringer and transom work got talking with RT, he put me onto a product that appears to be of real interest. As some of you know I have been in the boat biz a long time and done my fair share of breathing Ketones. I have alway wondered why we replace bad plywood with plywood that will go bad again! Not long ago I ran a moisture meter over about 20 boats all near new in our High & Dry, guess what 60% had wet transoms and probably wer stringers. It is a plague that we have been living with for many years, there may be a better way! I am reseaching the product on the site below, which may be the answer to our prayers. What thoughts do you guys have?

http://www.transomrepair.com/

baronmarine
11-10-2004, 09:33 PM
almost seems to good to be true. if it works let us (me) know i have the same project this winter

MOP
11-10-2004, 10:53 PM
I am not convinced just yet, was just turned onto it and need to do some poking around. Will look over the testimonials and hopefully will get to speak with someone that has done it. If it is really 1/2 as good as they I may just try it, I have gotten damn tired of fooling with encapsulated wood if it ain't wet now it damn sure will be!

Phil

gcarter
11-11-2004, 05:11 AM
Volusia County Florida is Daytona, and DeLand, where Cuda lives. Maybe he could try to find them since there's no address given . :smash:

MOP
11-11-2004, 08:08 AM
George I am going to email some of the folks that have used it, if the stuff holds up under 5 outboards offshore on a Scarab FOR REAL it is a no brainer. I do need some more convincing old ways die hard, over the years I have seen so much go wrong with wood this could be a dream come true. I doubt if we will see it in production boats as they will stick with the cheaper wood and poorly placed limber holes. I must admit wood is that bad if the job is done right, where most all fail is is in the placement of the limber holes. Instead of notching or half mooning a hole at the very bottom most just hole saw through the laminate an inch or so above the hull. Most do not seal the holes in it any way, now think how stupid that is wood wicks water in and cannot get out real intelligent. If they were to make the limber holes at the bottom of the laminate where it meets the hull it could drain and last a lot longer. Just how much longer would it take them to do it right, almost all manufacturers do it the easy cheap way.

Phil

RvR
11-11-2004, 08:32 AM
Interesting stuff. I haven’t done much composite boat repair but over the years I have done a fair amount of composite vehicle design and fabrication and composite processing research. Mostly building off-road and solar vehicles and most recently non-metallic trailers for finding unexploded ordinance and other missing WMDs :D I have used plywood in a few locations since it is easy to fabricate and bond in place but this castable could be a nice replacement.

The things I looked at first here were the test data and the predicted maximum temperatures. The test data indicates they are using a reinforcement mixture with some reground FRP in it. An interesting approach that might help keep the reinforcement from settling. The predicted peak temperature of only 160 F, which I assume was measured for a typical thickness for a transom, is fairly low. Over heating of a thick laminate like this is always a concern but they seem to have gotten the chemistry right to keep the temperatures down.

I noticed the guy in the picture pouring it with out a mask on! Man those little styrene monomers in polyester like to grab on to brain cells, not to mention the buzz. I think I would wear a good mask myself.

I see they offer a free cut-out core sample. I may just order one up, touchy feely is always good.

gcarter
11-11-2004, 01:03 PM
My mind is open to stuff like this. However, plastics tend to have a density of two or three times that of wood.
Which brings up another proposition, WEST system.
If a person set up their ply laminate in 1/4" instead of 3/4", and saturated it w/penetrating epoxy, then laminated it w/epoxy, I believe you would have a permanent transom using only everyday materials.
Some things, the blow boaters do things better than we do.

MOP
11-11-2004, 10:31 PM
Got a lot more interesting today, every area has its good and so so glass guys. I was very interested in speaking with he two top guys, I managed to catch Joe Barbone Alias "Gel Coat Joe" he is the Van Gogh of glass in these parts. I asked if he had heard of Seacast, he piped up and said he had done several transoms but no stringer work. He does prefers to use wood in the straight easy access laminates, but went on to say the stuff is a very good product. Great for transoms even with big outboards, it saves cutting wells out all work can be done through the cap. Says getting all the old wood out is not as easy as some think, but once past that the rest is easy and straight forward. He did remark that when working at high summer temps, you need a helper with a rubber mallet to keep tapping the transom to get the air bubbles out. He expressed concern about getting a good tooth on the old glass, he said that took a bit of doing. I turned him onto an gizzy I made moons back for that type stuff. For those of you that like gizzies try the following. Get a piece of 1/4 aluminum rod longer enough to reach well into your job, cut a 1" slot in one end to insert cloth grit. Get some very heavy grit 1X wide tear off 6" long pieces, slide a piece in the slot with about an inch sticking through. Make sure you have the longer grit side out wound in the direction a drill turns. Use a high speed light duty drill, the object is to not apply pressure but to let the grit flail out abrading the old glass. Anyway back to Gel coat Joe he say he has several of the Seacast transoms out there with -0- complaints and from the few he got to see they looked the day he did the job no signs of any separation or cracking. I will use it, I know there are a few issues with mine.

Boy that was hard a little to much :party: :party: tonight! Old friend leaving town had to pop a few corks :umbrella:

Mellow Old Phil!

John W
11-14-2004, 12:36 PM
Got a lot more interesting today, every area has its good and so so glass guys. I was very interested in speaking with he two top guys, I managed to catch Joe Barbone Alias "Gel Coat Joe" he is the Van Gogh of glass in these parts. I asked if he had heard of Seacast, he piped up and said he had done several transoms but no stringer work. He does prefers to use wood in the straight easy access laminates, but went on to say the stuff is a very good product. Great for transoms even with big outboards, it saves cutting wells out all work can be done through the cap. Says getting all the old wood out is not as easy as some think, but once past that the rest is easy and straight forward. He did remark that when working at high summer temps, you need a helper with a rubber mallet to keep tapping the transom to get the air bubbles out. He expressed concern about getting a good tooth on the old glass, he said that took a bit of doing. I turned him onto an gizzy I made moons back for that type stuff. For those of you that like gizzies try the following. Get a piece of 1/4 aluminum rod longer enough to reach well into your job, cut a 1" slot in one end to insert cloth grit. Get some very heavy grit 1X wide tear off 6" long pieces, slide a piece in the slot with about an inch sticking through. Make sure you have the longer grit side out wound in the direction a drill turns. Use a high speed light duty drill, the object is to not apply pressure but to let the grit flail out abrading the old glass. Anyway back to Gel coat Joe he say he has several of the Seacast transoms out there with -0- complaints and from the few he got to see they looked the day he did the job no signs of any separation or cracking. I will use it, I know there are a few issues with mine.

Boy that was hard a little to much :party: :party: tonight! Old friend leaving town had to pop a few corks :umbrella:

Mellow Old Phil!

MOP,
I had a transom problem in an old Seacraft and I used a product called Coosa Compsites Bluwater Board. Will not rot even when submerged. It seem the newer boats are all going to composite material for their transoms. The stuff was expensive about $350.00 per sheet, but when I was done the transom was rocksolid. I used MAS epoxy and cabosil as a thickener to laminate the 2 pieces in the hull.
Thae sad part was that I got into the Donzi's and just sold the seacraft.
Hope this helps, Coosa does have a website and customer service that is great,
JW

MOP
11-14-2004, 05:48 PM
John can you post teh site address? Tried to find it but could not.

Phil

motorcity
11-14-2004, 06:40 PM
http://www.coosacomposites.com

MOP
11-14-2004, 07:00 PM
Thanks looks like another good product, Ah more thinking to do!

Phil

John W
11-14-2004, 07:44 PM
Thanks looks like another good product, Ah more thinking to do!

Phil

Phil,
I did call the company before I bought the Sheets of the product( Bluewater 3/4 inch), just to check it out. The Seacraft was an I/O and wanted to make sure youcould bolt a outdrive to this stuff. The Coosa guy said as long as you tourque all the bolts to spec there will not be any peoblems.
I imagine that someone with a gorilla feel could pull the bolts thru it , but my own tests (a 22 long hollow point and did not penetrate) is that this is great stuff. I also used the 1/2 blue water to re-core some deck hatches on my hatteras.
JW

MOP
11-14-2004, 09:19 PM
I will have to make a judgment call based on what I find, at this point all I have to go on is some not to bad moisture readings. Need to get in the hole and do a real good check out, there are a few small obvious things. Its the hidden stuff that needs to be reckoned with.

Phil