22 classic owners

[John W]

Just got the new rig, going out in her tomorrow for the maiden voyage!!!!!! :rlol: My question is what props are you guys running, my stock prop is a Mirage 14 1/4x25, just curiuos if any have changed up. the boat has the 496 Ho engine.
Thanks,
JW

[Dr. Dan]

:spongebob John.... do a search under "Performance Talk" for Props....the 22's work well with the Turbo's.....I am running a 25 currently... I have a 27 in the stable ....but it likely is too tall with my current King Cobra Ratio....but we'll see....

The 25 Pitch is a great all around Prop....and I think you will find alot of discussion on this topic!

Congrats :beer:

Doc

[Barry Phillips]

John W, I have a 496Mag running a 23" Mirage Plus, but I think the boat is underproped, since I bump up against the rev limiter when I really fly the boat. I was wondering myself if a labed 25 would put me in the right RPM range and put less stress on my motor. The Mags should run 4,800 WOT and the HOs should turn 5,000 to 5,200 rpm. I am running 5,000 and the rev limiter warning will come when I'm really putting the hammer down, about 71 mph.

[Pismo]

Is your prop a Mirage Plus, if so the 25" may be perfect, you will rev just over 5000, hopefully just below the rev limiter which is perfect and should not harm the engine. Expect mid 70s top end. My 502(415hp) with a 25" turns just to the rev limiter 5050rpm at 74.5mph GPS. You have 425hp with the same prop but a higher rev limiter so look for a touch more.

Enjoy.

[cigarette30]

Is your prop a Mirage Plus, if so the 25" may be perfect, you will rev just over 5000, hopefully just below the rev limiter which is perfect and should not harm the engine. Expect mid 70s top end. My 502(415hp) with a 25" turns just to the rev limiter 5050rpm at 74.5mph GPS. You have 425hp with the same prop but a higher rev limiter so look for a touch more.

Enjoy.

Ditto, almost exact numbers for the 496 h.o. with the 25" Mirage Plus. I went to a labbed 26" hydromotive, picked up 1.5-2 mph, little harder to plane, great midrange ride without porpose, worth a try.

[cigarette30]

John W,

BTW, just saw you were from Annapolis, should you wish to try a couple differant props, or if I can help you, I am in Ocean City. What are the specifics of you "new ride", ie: yr. dealer, may have some info. that would interest you. PM me.

Thanks

[Pismo]

Cig30,

Which Hydromotive prop is the 26" labbed.


Thanks,
Pismo

[ChromeGorilla]

I have a 496 HO and I'm pretty happy with the all around performancee of the stock prop. 25 p mirage +. I have a hydromotive 4 blade to try but been lazy. every time i put in i just wanna go! Let us know what you try.

[cigarette30]

Cig30,

Which Hydromotive prop is the 26" labbed.


Thanks,
Pismo

4 blade will get serial number if needed. Thanks

[John W]

I ran the boat today. What a world of difference from the 16. With the boat trimed up and and a little tab, wot I was able to get 76mpn on the speedo at around 5000 rpm. i think that is dialed in enough. I will try to get a gps speed when my wife can hold the gps. Awesome performance, kind of squirrley WOT, do not tell mercruiser!!! and trimmed up but i'll get the feel of it.
I would like to try a different prop ans soon as I get all the info.
Thanks,
JW :smileybo:

[Pismo]

My 22 also gets rather wobbly at 70+ mph. It is very, very stable at 60mph (4000rpm with a 25" Mirage Plus), but up over 70 it starts to ride on that rounded keel and sways around. It was worse with a labbed 27" Mirage Plus and more manageable with a stock 25" Mirage plus. It is manageable but annoying. I am installing hydraulic steering this winter and this should make it solid as a rock. I am going to try the labbed 26" 4 blade hydromotive per suggestion.
Cheers
PIsmo

[cigarette30]

My 22 also gets rather wobbly at 70+ mph. It is very, very stable at 60mph (4000rpm with a 25" Mirage Plus), but up over 70 it starts to ride on that rounded keel and sways around. It was worse with a labbed 27" Mirage Plus and more manageable with a stock 25" Mirage plus. It is manageable but annoying. I am installing hydraulic steering this winter and this should make it solid as a rock. I am going to try the labbed 26" 4 blade hydromotive per suggestion.
Cheers
PIsmo

I would asume the "wobbly" is the chime walking when the boat is really "freed up" thus the increase at speed. I have found that to be the interesting part, but curious how those that exceed the "factory" speeds (mid 70's) handle it. Comments please.... Does the external steering really help? I found little differance in props, boat still running out of hull. Lets not forget that infamous "powerboat" article, laughing. After many Donzi's, all of them I have again enjoyed "driving" the chime walk out.

[Hotspare]

John W ...... When you start seriously propping your 22 you'll find out the right setup is kinda like a bottomless Pit .......... However,,,, We've seen lot's of testing here on the subject and would suppose most the leg work should be done for you at this point ....... Something I might add though would be to also check your propeller "slip" factor ......... A certain amount is required to provide the propper thrust needed to propell your hull .... The formula escapes me at the moment, but I know who to call .... I did find at AOTH last year by using the formula that the "slip" on my 22 was running at 6% ,,,,, which I'm told is hooked up pretty good ........ So check it out ,,,,, You might eek a little more out of the ol girl .............. Bruce. :wink:

[RickR]

I have found the Turbo 1 to be the best prop for inland lakes and smoth water conditions.

Although I am currently using a Mirage Plus for offshore and rough water, I would like to try Turbo's Vector for those conditions.

Prop slip caculator
http://www.rbbi.com/folders/prop/propcalc.htm

I agree with Cigarette30, the 22 runs out of hull mid 70s. I have not had much success driving out of the chine walk with conventional steering.


Turbo 1 24", 22 Classic, BBC, Bravo 1.5, GPS, VDO stock tach, cool dry conditions, light fuel, one person in boat.

Slip
.28@2200
.24@2400
.164@3000
.094@3500
.059@4000
.046@4500
.075@5000
.080@5450

23" Mirage Plus comes in around 10% at WOT

[Pismo]

6% slip is nearly impossible for a heavy vhull like a Donzi. The best race rigged very light cats run 4-6% slip. Regular pleasure cats run 6-8%. VHulls with steps, notched transoms, high drive, etc run 8-9% and normal pleasure vhulls run more like 9-13% slip. My calcs of my 22 Classic have always come in around 10% slip via GPS with a 25" Mplus.

[Pismo]

Check out........

http://www.go-fast.com/boat_speed_predictions.htm

[RickR]

Prismo
When companies calculate propeller pitch is not an exact science due to the pregressive pitch of the blades.

Slip with my 23" Mirage Plus at WOT is a little over 10%

[Rootsy]

my 16 with the quad IV will run 7 - 8%... GPS speed.. with the quad IV O/T i am 9 - 10%... both props run on an 18 classic with the same sterndrive and similar power and numbers match...

3 blades will generally be a bit higher..

low slip #'s with the BIG Quad IV is NOT uncommon...

[RedDog]

I'm seeing about 8% slip with a Mirage Plus 25 at higher RPM range.

Rick - why do you like the Mirage Plus in offshore and rough water vs. the Turbo I for inland/smooth water? I assume this preference has something to do with the 23" pitch of the Mirage?

[RickSE]

Any of you guys have the newer Gaffrig Monster guages? If so what are you trimming to on your elec. trim guage. My guage has 5 divisions lines and I've yet to go past the first line. I'm sure it will just blow out if I go too high but I've been worried about getting into the so called "trailer position" or hurting the U-joints. The trim on my 18 would stop before entering the "trailer position" but the trim on the 22 will just keep going up.

[RickR]

reddog
In rough water, a prop with more blade surface area will give you more stability. The Mirage Plus and Vector have more diameter with similar blade design (Mirage 14 5/8, Vector 14 1/2, Turbo 1 14 1/4)

Larger diameter does not necessarily mean more stability. I ran a Turbo Lightning (14 3/4)last week and it performed poorly on my 22. It was designed as a surfacing prop (for a drive with a high X Dimension).
13.1% slip @ 4500 RPMs 3mph slower.

I do not know the physics (either the gyroscope or rudder thingy). CDMA where are you????

[Dr. Dan]

:wavey: I can only speak of my own experience in my 22.....but for those not familiar...with my "Blue Pill" retrofit...this past year...we went from a 454 ...330 Horse King Cobra which maxed out at 44 - 4600 RPM's and reached an anemic 60 to 62 mph...to installing the Healthy HP500 EFI currently nestled in between the Stringers...we conservatively picked up 18 - 20 mph....and zero chine walk at speeds above 75! :smash:

I think the Chine Walking is a direct result of an overtrimmed drive......with keeping the Monster King Cobra Drive.....and as Poodle and The Evil Twin(Roadtrip) can attest to, I am too conservative on Trim...so I have to work on loosening up the Transom....but even in running conservative Trim...there is enough power to comfortable reach 75 mph... at will...with no bounce, no loss of control....I do think Hydrallic Steering or an ITS System should be a must on any boat....period. To me it's dangerous to maintain high speeds without it.....and if I keep the King...eventually I will add it...but I have been the most impressed with the overall stability of the New Package...

The benefit of the King drive is its deep bite in rough water...which as The Evil Twin can attest to.....an IMCO Shorty can make for some "Short Changing Re-Entries" at high speeds....over wakes! So I guess there are trade offs....driving a Donzi or any hull at high speeds is a totally dynamic experience each time out....the water is always different...the wakes are ever changing....and then there is the wind, traffic....and ????? So I think ya have to be realistic...personally 75 mph is flying in my boat!...I am more thrilled by the Torque and Acceleration the Repower provided...than the top end! I still have more to learn next Season...but for a Debut of a Radical Alteration.... I am humbled by the result....and I am man enough to admit...that for now.... I am not ready for going over 80 in that Sucker....maybe someday...I will actually hit the rev limiter....but it will be when I am ready....I know its more than there....

Doc :smash:

[roadtrip se]

It seems like I always have had a witness when the beast tries to trip at 80-ish. Rootsy, Doctor, and MP have all had an opportunity to pour salt in the wound.

I think anything north of seventy in a 22 is a must-be-sober and focused on the water ahead of you and those around you all the time experience!

The shortie is just a hoot, period, Serious bling, better handling, and the ability to turn bigger props. I attribute all of my stumbles to the demon prop, the 29 pitch, Mirage Plus.
IMHO, lots of blade width causes her to want to do some strange things in less than perfect landings. I go back to ole' Diablo, becasue she produces the most top end consistently.

The Hydros have never exhibited any of these bad manners with the shorty. The 27 has even turned in as fast a top-end as the Mirage on the rare occassion. Of course, every time somebody wants to race, i.e. Byron the Ambusher, I got the Cadillac, "wife pleaser", 28 Hydro on back.

These boats are safe at 80, much less 70, but only in experienced, sober hands!

Todd