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dclassic
08-19-2004, 08:56 AM
Hello all! I have a few questions. I have narrowed my search down to a clean late model 22c or a new or used clean late model 18c. I think I know what I want in a 22, but I have more questions regarding the 18's.

If yall were going to order a new 18 classic would you get the 6.2 Bravo or the 5.7 alpha combo? What kind of performance should one expect out of either combo? Would the hydraulic steering make a notable difference in safety or handling? Any opinions on the winshields vs. grab rails? If you were going to special order a new 18c how much should one expect to pay? x% discount?, x% over invoice?, As far as I can tell, they have about 30-35% margin to work with. How does one determine a fair price? All the dealers I have talked to just want me to make an offer. I know they need to make a few bucks, but it will be a quick easy sale for them as well.

If you were looking at nice late model used boats what would be "must have" options? The ones I am looking at have 5.7 alpha power and trim tabs which seem nice, I just can't help but think how bulletproof a bravo drive behind a small block will be, and a stroker motor is always nice too. I would appreciate any of yall's thoughts. Thanks.

Lenny
08-19-2004, 10:31 AM
A new 18 Classic would HAVE to have the 6.2 MPI Horizon and a Bravo if you ask me. I like the windshield as well but don't expect it to provide much protection. Rick would be able to tell you a "fair" price on one equipped like this as he is in the business.

Ranman
08-19-2004, 10:41 AM
If you go with a late model 22, 502/Bravo or 496MAG HO /Bravo is the top choice and good for 70+ MPH.

Regarding the 18's. 6.2/Bravo is a far superior option and worth every penny. Your comments on a bulletproof SBC/Bravo are on the money. Hold out for a Bravo boat, you'll thank yourself later. (This is not a bash on Alphas, just my personal recommendation from an 18 owner with a Bravo). The 6.2MX combo is good for honest high 60's (67-69MPH) and maybe a touch on 70 if you're lucky. For windshields or grab handles, I won't go there. It's simply a matter of personal preference. I feel there are advanteges and disadvantages of both. Hydraulic steering is a great option. Not absolutly necessary on a stock 18 or 22, but you'll be glad you have it if it's back there. Also, it will all ready be in place (and necessary) should you choose to enhance the top speed of your boat through modifications.

To me, the must have options on an 18 would be:
350MAG or 6.2MX (300hp/320hp)
Bravo One
Full hydraulic steering
Pop up cleats
Dual batteries
Depth finder
hour meter
4 speaker Stereo
Tandem axle trailer

Trim tabs are an option and beneficial, but I find they are not absolutly necessary on an 18. In fact, I rarely use mine. They can also be easily added later.

If I were going to order an 18, or just buy any new one for that matter, I would contact Robert Nelems of Nelems Marine (Magicfloat on this site). He will give you a straight deal with no worries. Robert has an impeccable reputation here and on OSO.

Another option would be to go through RickS and his father. I'm also sure they would give you a great "no hassle" deal at a stellar price. They are on the west side of the country though.

dclassic
08-19-2004, 02:25 PM
Thanks for the info guys. What is the benefit of the dual batteries? Wouldn't they just add weight and get in the way at service time? What is the benefit of the tandem axle trailer vs. single axle? I spoke with Robert Nelems yesterday and I was verry dissapointed to hear he is getting out of the Donzi business as he has helped me a great deal. I would love to have given him my business. He is Selling off his remaining inventory and will no longer be accepting orders. Have any of yall dealt with Pier 57, Hascell's or RV World?

Ranman
08-19-2004, 03:05 PM
The main benefit of the dual batteries is redundancy. The duals will allow you to listen to the radio while docked in confidence. In other words, say you go out to your favorite island and crank the tunes for a tad too long. With a one battery system, you're screwed. With two simply switch to the other and fire her up. Also, if you happen to leave an accessory on by mistake, you have a backup. I think the additional battery capacity outweighs the "extra weight/space issue. They don't get in the way for me at all, and there's been more than one occasion, I've needed them both. It's a cheap option and cheap insurance.

For tandem trailers, there are several benefits. They're more stable, especially at high speed and again, you get redundancy. A worst case example would be your towing to your favorite destination and you lose a wheel bearing. With a tandem, you can remove the tire and limp home on 3 axles. With a single, you'll be leaving the boat on the side of the road (unless you carry a hub kit with you). Tandems also offer less strain on the wheels, tires and bearings. You get to divide the weight of the boat across 4 axles instead of two. A 3500lb boat would mean 1750lbs per axle (ie bearing rim and tire) on a single or 875 lbs per axle on a tandem. Less load per axle means longer life. Lastly, the tandems simply look better under nice boats. This is not a huge benefit, but aesthetics is important to me. The whole boat and trailer package should look as good on land as the boat does in the water. The only downfall is that some will say you have a bit more maintenance with a tandem, but really, I think it's the same. Since there's less load per axle, my regular service intervals are increased. My suggestion,find some pics of Donzi's on trailers and judge for yourself.

Sorry to hear Robert is getting out of the Donzi business.

Here's a pic of a few trailers.
http://www.zabram.com/pics/Donzi/Trailers1.jpg

boldts
08-19-2004, 03:14 PM
d,

2 batts = backup for those times when your at the beach and want to have some tunes playing on the radio or cd. It's a safety thing more than anything else. Most of the time when you have 2 batts, you also have a switch which allows you to use both or just one battery. So, if your using just one and happen to leave lights or the radio on, you've got a 2nd to get the boat started again.

Daul axle trailer again is a convience item. No you don't have to have 2 axles to tow an 18, but if you like to take your Donzi with you when traveling or attending Donzi gatherings, and you get a flat twice on the same trip? You'll have that 2nd axle to get you off the highway and to a garage or service plaza to fix the flat tires. Not to mention the trailer bearings. If you loose a trailer bearing on a single, your not towing that trailer to a service place. Your stuck until a flatbed can come and winch the trailer up on it. If you have 2 axles and lost a bearing, you can tie the bad bearing wheel up and get to a service center. With that said, if you don't plan to go anywhere with the boat and are only using the trailer for storage, a single will be just fine except it'll mean less $ at resale time. Just has a personal preference, I'd also put brakes on the trailer whether dual or single. Makes life a little easier on your tow vehicle.

Sorry to hear Robert won't be selling Donzi boats anymore. He had a flare for ordering boats with-out a bunch of not needed stuff and in some different color combos than most dealers order.

I can't add to anything that has already been stated about how to order a 18 Classic. Randy pretty much said it all! Just out of curiousity, will you be running on inland lakes or ocean waters most of the time? Weekends or week nights? While the 18 handles ruff water just fine, the 22 handles it even better. How about family or children? The 22 is going to have a little more space and be a deeper cockpit for little ones. Good luck in your search! You can't go wrong with either Classic.

dclassic
08-19-2004, 04:17 PM
Thanks again for the thoughts. Most of our boating will be on inland lakes like Lake Lanier and Lake Hartwell. Lanier can be pretty rough on weekends, the 22 will have the advantage there. We will be boating both on weekends and week nights. The 18's seem to handle the rough water pretty well, we were surprised. Our boating will be primarily just the 2 of us with friends and relatives a good part of the time as well. No kids as of yet. My wife loved the low freeboard on the 18, she had a better time riding in the 18 than the 22. She said it was like a go cart on the water. It seemed to handle like a go cart as well. Lots of fun.

Ranman
08-19-2004, 08:26 PM
She said it was like a go cart on the water.

I like to think it's more like a Ferrari. :biggrin: Go kart just doesn't have the same "feel" if ya know what I mean.

DickB
08-19-2004, 09:04 PM
Trim tabs are an option and beneficial, but I find they are not absolutly necessary on an 18. In fact, I rarely use mine. They can also be easily added later.

I use the tabs on my 18 fairly often. I'm on an inland lake chain that gets heavy use on the weekend. I find a little tab keeps the boat from bouncing.

gold-n-rod
08-19-2004, 09:06 PM
Here's another take.....

I would not buy a new 18. I believe that many 18 owners get the itch to move up to a 22 very soon after getting an 18. That leaves some nice, late-model 18s out in the market.

Buying a new 22 makes more sense because one cannot go bigger and stay in the Classic series. Thus, there are fewer nice, late-models that are bargains.

Do I have proof of my theory? Not really, that's just my opinion. Your mileage may vary, not valid in Rhode Island, tax not included, no shirt, no shoes, no service. :cool:

another Randy

DickB
08-19-2004, 09:14 PM
That's what I did. I found a '99 in very good shape. I suspect most Donzi owners baby their boats. A very common question that I get is "Is that new?", and the reaction is one of surprize when I say "No, it's 5 years old."

Barry Phillips
08-19-2004, 09:55 PM
With an 18 you can go with the 350 Mag or the 6.2, but a Bravo 1 is the only way to go, if you don't get it, you will wish you had. When I purchased my 18 in 97 the 350 Mag was only offered with the Bravo 1. I also had the windshield on my 18, which is useless but looked good in my opinion. Dual batteries can be handy if you like to hang out on the water and listen to the tunes. Tandem axle trailers are great, stable and a must under a 22. I’m not sure were you boat, but think about the 22, they are no more difficult to tow, launch, or retrieve. I started out with an 18 and now I have a 22 with a 496 Mag, I love them both. The 18 is a blast to drive, mine could run 63 to 65 mph with a carberated 350 rated at 250 HP and Bravo 1, which I had to order special since the Alpha was standard with this power package. I always meant to add tabs, but the boat never really needed them. My 22 took a little more getting used to; tabs are essential on this long narrow hull. Without them you will completely loose sight of the horizon climbing up on plane, once trimmed up and air out the 22 will run over anything. The 22 also looks awesome on her matching tandem axle Eagle trailer. Although I wanted the 496 HO, I could not pass up my deal.

One footnote, Classic Donzis command respect, this passed weekend alone 3 people at the local ramp wanted to look at and ask about the boat. A guy with a Searay 32 and a another with a Cigarette waved me over just to talk about the boat. One guy who had never seen a Donzi before, just keep on looking at it and commented that it was elegant. Just interacting with people about them is half the fun.

dclassic
08-19-2004, 10:01 PM
Yes of course... Ferrari, that's what I meant! :D

There are several very nice nearly new 18's we have our eye on. Unfortunately, they all seem to be 5.7 alpha powered where I was wanting the 6.2 bravo with hydraulic steering. I'm sure either would suffice, but I dig the Bravo reliability. That is the primary reason I would go new, to get exactly what I want as I plan on keeping it for a long time.

You guys might be onto something with the 22's. I have been looking for a while and have only found one I would actually buy, while there are several 18's...hmmm??

Do yall find a big difference in the fun factor between the 18 and 22's for playing around, skiing, cruising, etc.? Thanks again.

Ranman
08-19-2004, 10:08 PM
Do yall find a big difference in the fun factor between the 18 and 22's for playing around, skiing, cruising, etc.? Thanks again.

Search this site on "18 vs. 22" or some variation of that and you'll get plenty of good reading with respect to the differences between the 18 and 22 Classics.

The 5.7 Alphas are fine behind the 18's, but the Bravo's are as worry free as they are rare.

TuxedoPk
08-20-2004, 02:16 AM
Do yall find a big difference in the fun factor between the 18 and 22's for playing around, skiing, cruising, etc.?

Fun is really dependent on the conditions... Riding with Ranman in his 18' was fun on Lake St. Clair with nice conditions but it lost it's fun factor when we were getting beaten to hell on the Great Lake...I'd have to say that being in the 22 under those conditions for an extended period of time was more fun....

If you're more into Cadillacs than Ferrari's, there's always the 21' GT to consider.

Barry Phillips
08-20-2004, 09:03 AM
Dclassic, I boat on 2 large NY lakes, although not the Great Lakes, they both get plenty choppy. As I said my 18 was a blast to drive, instant hole-shot and turn on a dime handling. Few surprises unless you don't mind going air born now and again. Great in 12 to 18" chop but can get tedious in the really rough stuff, not uncommon in any boat. My 22 loses a little in handling but has longer legs in the rough stuff. I fined myself running at 3,500 rpm at about 47 mph cruise speed on rough water. Under 2.500 rpm she wants to drop off of plain and begins to porpus unless the tabs are fully down. The 22s are much dryer boats because of the higher freeboard and reverse chines, the 18s have flat chines. Size is also better if you want to bring friends along. Neither boats are great ski boats because of they both lack ski platforms and thick gunnels that make boarding from the water difficult. I used a standard 11” hook ladder which could be mounted just aft of the windshield, but it dose not fit the 22. I am not a water skier but the 22 still has boarding issues and climbing on the drive is not my taste. I am considering a dive latter, but I think a red powder coated tube swim platform could look really cool my red on white 22.