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1996Z15
11-02-2003, 08:46 AM
I was cleaning up the boat for winter storage when I noticed a crack along one of the chines. It appears that when the marina lifted it with the forklift that the boat was resting right on the sharp edge of this particular chine (strake, whatever it's called). Anyway, there is a crack that is pretty bad for about 3" and then it's just a hairline crack for about 4'. I am very concerned about this and do not want to use the boat again until I get it fixed.

1)Does anyone know what's involved in repairing cracks in the hull such as the one I've described?

2) Do you think I'll need to gut the boat in order to get this repair done?

3) How much do you think something like this will cost?

4) Does anyone know a good place in my area where I could get it fixed without getting ripped off?

I don't want to miss next season but it doesn't look good for me and it's only November.

BUIZILLA
11-02-2003, 09:08 AM
Tow it over to Pearson's house for a lookysee. I'm sure his findings would be accurate.

J

Walt. H.
11-03-2003, 07:05 AM
That type of crack usually is an indication of having soft stringers causing the hull to over flex, or if your lucky it's just from an air void between the gel-kote and the glass laminate that broke through. But since it traveled for four feet from the initial three inches, most likely its a bad stringer. (wood rot)
Is the boat over 10-12 yr's old?

Sorry, :(

Walt

1996Z15
11-03-2003, 10:25 AM
Yes, it's an 86' Minx. I hope that you are wrong, how do I check the stringer integrity?

Walt. H.
11-04-2003, 01:05 AM
I can understand your comment, its like hearing a unfavorable medical diagnoses, you want to deny what you heard and look for a second opinion hoping to hear something better. In this case something like "its only a scratch not a crack fill it in wet sand and compound it out then finish with polish. (that only screws the next owner.) It cracked for a reason, from a cause.
Most sub-floors lives in a moist invironment from only condensation to 100% bilge water, fiberglass is porous and will allow moisture in faster then letting it out. Your stringers are wrapped in f/glass and over time will rot wood, first they will develope soft spots. The same thing happens to transoms usually you will see some bubbling in the gel-coat exterior called "asmosis."
Good stringers should give off a hard wood ring when struck/knock on with your knuckles or a small ball peen hammer :) , if it gives off only a hollow thud sound like hitting wet balsa sponge wood. :( Then take a good deep breathe and two strong adult beverages, close the garage doors walk away followed by a few more beverages. On the following day start making plans for a rebuild like many here have done, me too!
If you can drill into the questionable area from the inside for a core sample that would give you a better answer. (good wood or something that looks like wet cigar tobacco) thats real rotten wood.

Good luck and i'll keep my fingers crossed for ya!!

Walt. :)

1996Z15
11-04-2003, 05:55 AM
Thanks Walt for the response; at least now I have an idea of how to determine if it's the stringers or not. It sure doesn't sound like a cheap do-it-yourself project.
Oh well, I guess the Minx is going to be in the yard for a while.

1996Z15
11-04-2003, 05:56 AM
Thanks Walt for the response; at least now I have an idea of how to determine if it's the stringers or not. It sure doesn't sound like a cheap do-it-yourself project.
Oh well, I guess the Minx is going to be in the yard for a while.

Walt. H.
11-04-2003, 08:46 AM
Your welcome, but hey it can be an opportunity to make things better then when it came from the factory. Like the old saying => "When life hands you lemons, make lemonade" Blab,blab etc.

W.H :)

Morgan's Cloud
11-04-2003, 02:07 PM
If I may interject... here comes one of MC's alternate views ....

The chine and or strake are two very different areas of the hull... exactly where is this crack ?

On my friends' old Benchseat Hornet AND on my St Tropez there were cracks on the hull bottom next to the strakes on both sides that ran for about 5 to 6 feet.In my case I had a fibreglass guru examine them when I first got the boat.He deducted that they were most likely just stress cracks in the rather thick gelcoat from hull flex as it is on a lifting surface.
I did not worry about them anymore even though I did'nt like them and used the boat for another 16 years.

I now have the boat in three pieces and can see exactly what was going on. I wonder if you have the same situation ?
It basically comes down to the simple single skin (no core) hull construction and location of the stringers !
This is long enough.... need more info ? just let me know !

Steve

1996Z15
11-04-2003, 02:44 PM
Wow, I am so confused now. Maybe if I knew the difference between a chine and a strake that might help but the crack that I have sounds very much like what Morgan's Cloud described. I am still going to have to get a knowledgeable person to check it out for me just for piece of mind.

Ranman
11-04-2003, 03:13 PM
The chine is the outermost part of the hull. The area where the bottom meets the hullside. The bottom comes up at an angle towards the hullside. the chine is where the bottom flattens out (parallel to the ground and then makes a 90 degree angle going up the hull side.

The strakes are closer to the centerline of the bottom. The strakes run front to back (as does the chine). some strakes run all the way back to the transom and some stop before reaching the transom.

The chines are on the outside and the strakes are on the inside. Someone should post a pic.

MOP
11-04-2003, 10:46 PM
Its pretty common to get cracks on strakes, there have been a few posts. It is usually not structural, if I remember both Ralph and Lenny had strake cracks. The 22 I just got has some slight damage to the strakes from the roller trailer. Ask around find a competent glass guy to look at it, I doubt if it will be very expensive glass is pretty easy t fix. The work should be able to be done from the outside no need to gut the boat.

Walt. H.
11-05-2003, 01:52 AM
Just another $.02 fact of mine from experience and from others. When water gets in under the gel-kote through a crack it will delaminate the glass from itself, actually removing the resin from the cloth over time which will make that area soft.

Bad stringers or not, you have to die-grind the crack out and re-gel-kote.

Morgan's Cloud
11-05-2003, 10:23 AM
Yes Walt.. this is where I was going..
Even though hull failure did not occur the cracks were there (and moving..'flexing')long enough that water was weeping through the cracks AND the glass.This was visible when the floor liner was completely removed and is now being tended to so as to never happen again :D
I would find it inlikely that the stringers have a problem... (a 16 year old classic is a baby after all wink )
If it was me ,I'd see if the forklift operator is liable and is insured !

oldLenny
11-05-2003, 01:34 PM
1996Z15...

To further some of these comments, "bubbles or blisters" are the result of water, transcending the gel-coat and finding uncured polyester links trapped in styrene pockets of your hull. The water meets (replaces) the styrene and creates a powerfull acidic solution that will eat up the chemical bond that keeps your glass happy. The off-gassing of this solution is what is creating the "bubbles" in the hull or wherever. These trapped gaseous pockets eventually break and then you have visible holes in your gelcoat. It(the process) is unavoidable in most cases and is a by-product of the manufacturing methods and mix and cure rate and ventilation during the lay-up.

Vinylester resins are purported to be far superior in regards to these occurances and are used by many manufacturers for the gel-coat and skin outs at least, in new hull construction. Some manufacturers use it exclusively for the entire lay-up. It costs more and has not been in the mainstream of the industry all that long. (10 years or so)It has been thoroughly tested mind you against its' predeccessors and shines through.

This will not be a trapped air bubble scenario mind you, as ANYONE can lay-up the first couple of "skin-outs" in a hull and get it close to error "bubble" free. The chances of someone laying up your Minx, and leaving a 4' long void of air against your gel-coat, in the chine, and NOT seeing it don't really exist.

I would be thinking about the stringer/flex scenario more seriously. The osmosis issue and blisters doesn't apply to this form of hull failure either.

Just my thoughts mind you... wink

Ralph Savarese
11-05-2003, 06:06 PM
I have not fixed mine yet other than cosmeticly when I did the restoration. At that time I thought thats all they were and sanded down and filled. They came right back the first year in use. I have new stringers and I think at this point I might put horizontal shelfs in to stop stringer flex These cracks have been there for 20 years They are on the strake to hull line that is directly below the stringers. that is why I feel it is directly related to hull VS stringer flex.