It's time to fish or cut bait!

[Tony]

(Just what the heck does that mean, anyway?)

Here is an update on my engine overheat saga: it is now an engine rebuild saga.
With the help of my insurance company I am planning on building a 302 Ford. Not a 351, nor a Chevy...so youse guys save your breath, ‘eh?

Now it gets fun. I’ve got a Ford machine shop engine guy (knows car racing well, shakey with marine experience) says he’d use an older block, bored to .030 over, and a Lunati 51013 cam. He says he would not do any head work, though.

Which sounds like another guy who says “302 heads are sensitive to port volume, a smaller port would out accelerate the larger port…E7TE heads need a full port & polish, 1.80 intake and 1.50 exhaust… GT-40 are even better, .510 lift, duration 225-230”.

My marine guy buddy is very experienced and suggests starting with a new Ford Motorsports short block (Part # 6009B50), using what’s good off my old engine, and buying a hand-picked aftermarket collage for the rest.

I’m not getting far with Ford trying to find out the details about their new marine engine, a “Triton 5.4L V-8”. I even asked them to supply me with a complimentary “prototype”...maybe this is why they think I am whacked!

Emmo and Forrest attest to a Ford longblock setup, but I worry about what else I have to do to complete this type of insertion. Randy likes flat top or slightly dished pistons (not hypereutectic) and a Crane cam (not CompCams for Ford marine).

So...
Flat tappet or roller motor?
Cam, duration, overlap? Heads?
Re-milled old block...short, bare, or long block?
FoMoCo parts or aftermarket?

I don’t know how much latitude I’ll have with the insurance company, but I do know this...I want to do this right, short and long term, the first time.

I want an engine very strong in the 2500-4500 range, with good reliability and durability. (Like the countless Holman Moody Hi-Po’s that lasted forever!) I want decent top end, but do not spend much time there. I am not capable of much “tinkering”, in fact my two mechanical “shining moments” were r & r’ing my water pump and drilling/tapping my propshaft!

Feel free to be specific in your replies. I have some decent general ideas (not really, but I quite often delude myself) and things will be happening soon. Especially if I want to be in Kentucky in May! Maybe this will be the type of thread we could use as a “Ford 302 Tech Article”.

Sorry for the lengthy post, and thanks for any help you’ve already given me. My e-mail is in my profile if you want to contact me direct. THANKS!

[turbo2256]

Got just about every thing you need here. But I only use Kenitc and or Thomson for machine work and I am waiting for a guy to sell a house before I rebuild two engines for him so I am available right now.

[Woodsy]

Tony...

Go with the box stock Ford Motorsports crate motor, M-6007-XB3, aluminum heads, 345 HP for $3100. You will not be able to build a motor that cheaply. Those fabled Holman & Moody marine engines were nothing special. Very few Ford motors are. All Holman & Moody did was put on some dress up goodies and a marine carburetor to a stock Ford 289 or 302. Big deal... As for the hypereutectic pistons, don't worry about those, all of the new GM marine engines come with them. Grizz has a concern about heat transfer, but you will be running a thermostat, so its not an issue at all. You can use your carb, intake & distributor, oil pan and exhaust manifolds. The cam specs are inline for a marine motor .480 lift on both sides, and duration @.050 is 224 degrees on both sides. All you need to do is replace the freeze plugs and go. If you really wanted to spend some $$ you could replace your valves with Manley Severe Duty, SST intake and Iconel exhaust, but you really don't have to. The engine comes with SST valves and HP valvetrain already. I would get the crate engine, bolt my stuff to it, and bring to a shop with a dyno to tune it and work the bugs out. Then, you drop it in, align evrything and go. No muss, no fuss, no hassle! Going with a crate engine is your best bet. Is it the best engine you can build, absolutely not, with enough cash you can build anything. But it is the best bang for the buck with the least amount of hassle.

The Ford Triton 5.4L is an ovehead cam motor similar to the one found in the new F-150. It will not work in your application.

I guess it boils down to how much you want to spend and how much the insurance company gives you. If it were me, I would not waste my time or money rebuilding a motor when for $3100 I can get a brand new 302/345 hp out of the box. If I got some serious money from the insurance company I would probably step up to one of those 385 hp aluminum headed 351W motors. But they are about $5100 and you will have to buy a new intake, etc.

Woodsy biggrin.gif

[Ranman]

Tony, I totally agree with Woodsy. The Motorsport (FRPP or whatever they're called now) GT40 crate engines are very durable and a great value. They will provide you with plenty of power and longevity. Although forged pistons may have a slight edge, hypereutectic pistons can also take a beating and would work fine in your application. Good luck with the project.

[Rootsy]

SVO motors are good pieces... just make sure that the powerband falls where you need it... some of those camshafts wind out to about 6000 rpm before they make peak HP. They also use open plenum long runner intakes which are high rpm horsepower pieces... Late model roller motors use larger rod bolts which is a good thing... i've seen A LOT of late model roller motors take severe beatings on nitrous without so much as a hiccup... actually i had a friend years back that had a mustang running in the 10:80 range with a stock shortblock, tfs heads and induction and a supercharger... had trouble keeping head gaskets in it til he O-ringed the cylinders.... the short block never came apart though...

If you go a rebuild route.. you can purchase a brand spanking new late model 302 block right from SVO for around 300 bucks... which is well worth it... you can go roller or flat tappet cam with this block... i'd opt for flat for our general purposes...

what kind of power numbers are you expecting to see when you are all said and done? that'll dictate what you need to put inside of the motor...

[turbo2256]

None of the small block engines are listed for use in marine applications in the 2002 Ford Racing cat. Only the big block 460 crate motors are.

[Forrest]

The crate motor will definitely save you some hassles, but unless you plan on going with fresh water cooling, I would nix the aluminum heads for the cast-iron version. Even in so-called fresh water, there is enough minerals and junk to cause accelerated corrosion to the water jackets in those nice heads. Even an aluminum intake is going to suffer the same problem, but at least those don't cost too much to replace - as long as you replace it before you have an internal leakage problem.